Unhappy Domino 500 Owner

Here's Sedge on replacing the DF500's lock levers to mimick the DF700s:


He mentioned fence drift. And here's the in-depth video:


and here's the link to the handles on McMaster Carr:
 
My fence is as supplied in the UK in 2009 - but I can't seem to find a clear explanation of the changes and consequently can't quite say what I have.

It prompts a concern mind you. If Festool come up with a later spec fence to solve my problem (if....) is it possible that it could make obsolete the accessories that I have? (pretty much everything that was available in 2009)

I tripped over this video when looking for information - it purports to solve fence drift/slippage:


'.....shows how to adjust the fence height on your DOMINO joiner so that you don't get fence drift.'

It doesn't fix the fence slippage problem - at least not on my tool.

Not to say that it doesn't happen or that the information will not be useful to some - but an assertion that seems to assume that users won't notice a basic matter like a lever fouling something so that the fence can't be locked down tight risks muddying the water on more fundamental issues.....

On the face of the machine, either side of the cutter opening, there's either a plastic 'paddle', or a steel sprung pin. Both are for referencing the end of a workpiece. Festool had to change to the plastic paddle, as the pins were a bit too close to another manufacturer's existing design.
 
If the local rep can’t help, go through Festool HQ Germany. Do not e-mail/ go through first level support, write an old fashioned letter, explaining the issue/ overall circumstances, direct them towards this thread. I’m sure they will take care of you & the issue.

Kind regards,
Oliver
 
Thanks Peter & Oliver.

The letter to HQ option sounds like a good idea. It may yet not be necessary. Time will tell. First line support in the UK citing the age of the tool won't touch it without a commitment to pay, but the rep seems to be getting behind it. It may take a while....
 
First line support in the UK citing the age of the tool won't touch it without a commitment to pay...
While it would be great to get it fixed without cost to you, I personally would not expect anything free on a portable tool that's well over a decade old.
 
We have a couple dominos in the shop the oldest being I think 2014 so about ten years. They don't always see daily use but certainly weekly. At least enough it was worth getting a second one about 5 years ago since we had times that running two was more cost effective then waiting for the other one to be done.

In all that time we have never had an issue with the purchased dominos not fitting. Moisture is def a issue and you can have times when the dominos are left out overnight that you gotta tap them in with a hammer and pull them out with pliers. Too loose has never been an issue unless we messed up the hole or used the wrong bit, had a guy drill a project with 5mm and then used 4mm to assemble before.

Three things usually cause us issues with the domino. First if the bit is dull, it makes the tool move and gives some climb to the cut. If we start getting climb or the fence is moving side to side to side we put a fresh cutter on.

Second the height scale sucks and is hard to read at times, we use set up blocks for all our standard set ups, much faster and repeatable.

Lastly how you hold the tool when you plunge makes a huge difference. Holding it back by the power cord is the only way to use it in our shop. New hires always struggle with this.

Sorry to hear of your issues and hope it can be worked out as once you get the tool dialed in it is a great joinery meathod.

Adam
 
Thank you for the input Adam, it all fits with my (limited) experience.

It seems clear that there is something odd about the dominos I have.

The plan is to try some more if the fence slippage problem gets sorted out..
 
This is to update the situation regarding the slippage of the horizontal fence on my Domino 500 - the core topic of this thread.

Free of charge assistance was refused during an initial phone contact with Festool service because the tool was way out of warranty.

The rep (contacted on the advice of a friend in the business) despite the tool being so old (but unused except for about a dozen cuts) got behind it and did everything he possibly could in an effort to get it sorted free of charge. Festool service however wouldn't budge - they issued an estimate claiming that the fence was worn ( :rolleyes: ???!!? - it certainly is not) and quoting what was probably the cost of a new fence to 'repair' it.

He generously however managed to come up with a used fence with a damaged horizontal fence plate in the hope that parts from it could be cannibalised to fix mine. It gripped much better than mine and transferring my moving horizontal fence plate assembly complete on to the used fence body saw the improvement retained.

It's not immovable but holds well enough to not slip in use - we have a working tool again! (y)

The improved grip seems likely in this case to be the result of a different alignment of the three sided block that the locking lever bears on. The pivot pin to its inside is fully buried in the mating hole/socket in the replacement fence main body - the base of the block makes contact with the latter. There was initially an ~1.25 mm gap in the case of mine. I'd picked up at the start that the pin on mine was pushing that side of my block up too high (the hole/socket it drops into was likely not deep enough) - it was tilting it so that the two pads on the other side of the block were making only line contact/scraping a narrow band/line on the land they bear on as it slipped. ( a narrow band/line = low friction because grip is roughly proportional to contact area for a given pressure)

I shortened the pin on my block back then (reducing the gap to a bit less than 1mm) and got some improvement but it seemingly was not quite enough - fitted to the used replacement body (that grips better) the same block leans in more towards the centre line of the tool. (the hole/socket is presumably deeper on this example)

It's a relief to have got a result - my thanks again to the rep.

The following is speculative but measurement of the clearances in the machined sliding ways (one of the faces/lands is angled at about 45 deg) at both sides that the horizontal fence assembly moves on (to the front of the fence body pillars) suggests however that the clamping block is likely (?) being asked to provide a lot more grip than was intended in the original design. (see pics)

It's a bit complicated to explain but it seems probable that these angled ~5mm wide faces/lands in the ways (which are driven together on the RHS when the locking lever/clamping block is done up tight) were intended to be the primary gripping faces - good thinking in principle in that the resulting wedging action over what is a significantly larger contact area than is available from the pads on the clamping block should give far more grip.

The difficulty is that the very large clearances side to side and front to rear (to the point of begging serious questions about the machining/the high incidence of reported fence problems with this tool) between these and the other mating lands on the fence body pillars and in the moving horizontal fence assembly on the examples seen mean that the clamping block must drive the latter forward on its side by a measured something well over 1mm to get the angled faces to bear hard against each other.

This amounts to a horizontal skewing of the horizontal fence assembly by over 0.5 deg. This is probably enough to tilt the same 5mm wide angled clamping (?) surface so that it makes mostly line contact along only one edge - as opposed to the perhaps originally intended/much grippier full face contact. It also moves the horizontal fence plate well out of alignment - but this probably doesn't matter so much because the centre line marker is close in to the body of the tool.

The ways/lands in the fence body and in the horizontal moving fence would need to be much more closely fitted to each other to prevent this from happening - perhaps the tolerances on the development examples were a great deal tighter?

The situation is not satisfactory, but it's a relief to have not been left with an unusable tool...

My thanks to all here for the inputs to what became quite a long thread.

(pics with feeler gauges showing fence way clearances added 17-7-25)

fence side to side clr 15-7-25.jpgfence front to rear clr 15-7-25.jpg
 
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This is an odd situation, where a "pre-fix" tool was unused for so long that it's beyond the memory of a lot of us.
It was still pretty common talk, back when I got my first one (2015) I never experienced the problem, since mine was post fix. Whatever that was. I have never seen the two at the same time to compare.
Until that fix is implemented, we are just chasing our tail.
Wasn't it like $825 bucks in 2009?

I can't comment on the slippage; i got a DF700 back in like 2017, but got a DF500 in late 2021 (saved $50 bucks cuz they were switching to the new systainer). I've never had an issue.
 
Picture of the aftermarket horizontal fence locking levers now fitted (they help but don't resolve the underlying grip problem) :

View attachment 375890
I notice that setting for cutting tenons is set at the loose position. Is that what you have been using normally? Try setting the position to the first setting and see if the tenons are still loose. Worth a try……
 
The exceptionally long elapsed time between purchase and use of the tool was down to long running illness followed by changing life circumstances.

Regarding the setting of the tenon width (the long dimension) R. The tool was used at both tight and loose settings - a first fixed/tight tenon to establish the lengthwise location of the boards being laminated together. Then followed in the usual manner by a line of side to side loose fitting tenons to precisely align the adjacent faces of the laminations during glue up.

Going from loose to tight side to side settings didn't seem to make any difference to the height (the smaller dimension) of the slots/the fit of the dominos - the slots/mortises all measured as being on nominal size. It's clear that the problems in that regard were down to undersize dominos.

The topic that has been described/that is at the core of this thread was repeated slippage of the horizontal fence in use no matter how tightly it was locked down - it simply wasn't reliable and messed up a number of cuts. The slots ended up at differing distances back from faces of the laminations that were to be lined up.
 
The bare-bones DF 500 was $775 while the DF 500 Set was $825. And that seemed like an expensive tool back then. 😵‍💫
With inflation, it's about the same price today.


So, $825 in 2009 would be $1237 today, and I believe the set is $1279 today. Don't know if the new fence design will raise the price, though...
 
With inflation, it's about the same price today.


So, $825 in 2009 would be $1237 today, and I believe the set is $1279 today. Don't know if the new fence design will raise the price, though...
True; I thought of the inflation after i posted. I'm also in denial that I'm old, and to me, 2009 was like "yesterday"
 
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