Upcoming CXS / TXS 18

[mino]

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Last night, I set the torque dial to #Drill and at speed 1 the sound was like the day before but at speed 2 the sound was once again that horrific, irritating high pitched scream.

Earlier today I tried the same experiment and at EVERY torque setting from #1 to #Light On and at full trigger pull it gave me the same non irritating sound whether it was set at speed 1 or speed 2.

Later this morning, I picked up the drill and fully pulled the trigger. The drill was left at the settings I tried last, #Light On and speed 2, the high pitched scream was back. Moving only the torque setting to #13 and the scream went away, I then returned the torque setting to #Light On and the high pitched scream never returned...there's some weird stuff going on.

I also noticed that the #Light Off setting doesn't work as the LED continues to light.

I'm going to work with it a bit more and notice what else is wonky.

Nice write up!

It seems the new CXS/TXS series are a prime candidate for introducting a custom firmware profile to limit the torque (and noise) to be enabled using the Festool WorkApp.

I am 99% certain that if an optional "Silent Mode" was introduced which would limit the torque to about 80% of the maximum in exchange of quieter operation that almost everyone annoyed by the noise would be perfectly happy with that while those needing the power would not mind either.

[member=101]Festool USA[/member] : Some food for thought to pass on ..

 

[Imemiter]

To add to the chronicles my CXS12 had to go back for repairs, too. I'd had it for a couple of weeks before realizing that it only had one speed.  [blink] Toggling between one and two made zero difference. I'd also had one strange stalling event, where the drill just stopped working. But fiddling with the dials fixed it enough to finish up whatever I was fiddling with. I'm pleased to report that Festool took the tool back and had it fixed and returned within two or three weeks. The invoice said they'd replaced a gear.

I'm still on the fence about whether to sell it or not. I'm set on selling at least one drill and already know it won't be from either end of the spectrum. IOW, not the TPC or the original CSX. 

 

[Cheese]

I was using the CXS 12 today for drilling aluminum and steel fence posts to receive rail connection brackets and through-holes for rubber grommets for running wire for fence lighting.

Unfortunately, when using the recently serviced CXS 12, it became very ugly, very quickly.  [sad]  The aluminum post drilling was marginal at best but when I went to drill the steel post it turned tragic. I needed a 3/8" diameter hole in the steel post to retain a rubber grommet that would pass a 14 GA low voltage wire. I'll typically pilot drill the hole with a 1/8" drill bit, swap that out for a 1/4" drill bit and then finish drilling with the 3/8" drill bit. 

The recently serviced CXS 12 drilled the 1/8" pilot hole just OK (it didn't seem to have max rpm's) but it refused to drill the 1/4" diameter hole thru .060" (1/16") thick square tubing. It continued to actuate the electronic clutch and beep at me even though the 1/4" drill hadn't yet broken through the wall, I was still in the "chamfer" stage. I eventually had to chuck the 1/4" drill bit into a Milwaukee drill and finish the task and then move on to the 3/8" drill bit. There are some very serious issues with the new CXS 12.  [mad] [mad] [mad]

The drill bits I used, were a new set of Milwaukee titanium coated items I recently purchased.

I'll work with this thing for the next couple of days but on Friday it will be sent back to Festool for another service. I certainly hope the next service interval will not be as long as the first service interval...that was 6 weeks.  [eek]

 

[Michael Kellough]

I was using the CXS 12 today for drilling aluminum and steel fence posts to receive rail connection brackets and through-holes for rubber grommets for running wire for fence lighting.

Unfortunately, when using the recently serviced CXS 12, it became very ugly, very quickly.  [sad]  The aluminum post drilling was marginal at best but when I went to drill the steel posts it turned tragic. I needed a 3/8" diameter hole in the steel post to retain a rubber grommet that would pass a 14 GA low voltage wire. I'll typically pilot drill the hole with a 1/8" drill bit, swap that out for a 1/4" drill bit and then finish drilling with the 3/8" drill bit. 

The serviced CXS 12 refused to thru-drill the 1/4" diameter hole thru .060" (1/16") thick square tubing. It continued to actuate the electronic clutch and beep at me. I eventually had to chuck the 1/4" drill bit into a Milwaukee drill and finish the task and then move on to the 3/8" drill bit. There are some very serious issues with the new CXS 12.  [mad] [mad] [mad]

I'll work with this thing for the next couple of days but on Friday it will be sent back to Festool for another service. I certainly hope the next service interval will not be as long as the first service interval...that was 6 weeks.  [eek]

A step drill is perfect for this. I bet the CXS 12 could handle the job with a step drill bit.

 

[mino]

A step drill is perfect for this. I bet the CXS 12 could handle the job with a step drill bit.

Seconded. A step drill would mostly prevents/limit the need for "hard" torque when drilling metals.

The thing is that a simple bit steel drilling is one of the jobs that benefit the greatest from the presence of a "hard" torque on a drill for those moments the bit bits a bit too much.

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All the new Festool drills use the electronic clutch to *intentionally* limit/block their hard torque. The last Festool without an electronic torque clutch were the DRC/PDC series drills.

This is why many people complained about the TPC - the new safety clutch setup makes it *less* capable (while less likely to hurt one's hand) with steel drilling than the older series. Despite having a 50% stronger motor.

Not sure if that drill does not have issues per se, but steel drilling is one of those tasks it is not optimised for. No matter what F says.

For steel drilling one wants a "simple" no-clutch drill. A Makita, Millwaukee, etc. Basically, any drill that will not hesitate a to separate the ligaments in your hand ..
Even the smallest non-clutch drills have about 45-50 Nm of hard torque with their "soft" torque (applicable for wood) being in the 25 Nm range, having weaker motors than the CXS 12. The CXS12 is a 30 Nm (!) torque tool due to the limiter. With a super-light shaft and chuck to match - so almost no momentum to help either. Precisely what is needed for a precise install driver .. not so for steel drilling.

A clutch limiter is great for using carelessly, but (almost) useless for steel drilling. By design.

 

[Cheese]

So, not to be an alarmist on this issue but rather just a general information sharer...today I again was installing some fence post bracketry and reached for the recently serviced CXS 12.

The first time I fully pulled the trigger it went into the high pitched scream mode. After that one time, I fully pulled & released the trigger 25 separate times and it NEVER again returned to the high pitched scream. Weird.

I filled out the paperwork this morning and received the forms back from Festool for prepaid shipping to the service center. I'll be returning the drill on Friday for another servicing.

 

[Cheese]

So, I returned the CXS 12 to Festool repair again today for the 2nd time. I really like the drill but I really dislike its abhorrent behavior. The drill acting the same way everytime you use it can be annoying but when it acts differently each time you use it, that's when things get exasperating.

So, off to Festool for another repair but today when I needed to switch to a Milwaukee drill for drilling aluminum fence rail, what I really noticed was the crude trigger control on the Milwaukee drill when I needed to use it instead of the CXS 12.

OMG, I was using the drill press downstairs and needed to lightly deburr some 5/16" diameter thru-holes in aluminum fence pickets and the old CXS 10.8 was outside in the garage. So I grabbed a Milwaukee that was next to the drill press but when I lightly pressed the Milwaukee trigger speed control, I'd get anywhere from 1 rpm to 400 rpm...that's certainly not the speed control I get from the Festool drills. You don't notice the finesse and the speed control of the Festool drills until you switch brands.

I typically use Milwaukee drills for drilling holes...nothing fancy, just pull the trigger and drill the hole at max rpm. Milwaukee nicknamed their drills "Hole Shooters" for a reason.

 

[COBill]

OMG, I was using the drill press downstairs and needed to lightly deburr some 5/16" diameter thru-holes in aluminum fence pickets and the old CXS 10.8 was outside in the garage. So I grabbed a Milwaukee that was next to the drill press but when I lightly pressed the Milwaukee trigger speed control, I'd get anywhere from 1 rpm to 400 rpm...that's certainly not the speed control I get from the Festool drills. You don't notice the finesse and the speed control of the Festool drills until you switch brands.

That's precisely why I returned my Milwaukee M12 Installation Driver and bought a CXS 18 kit.