Weatherproof Cabinets

[Brian Livingstone]

Hi All,

I have a client interested in an outdoor cabinet job.  I assume PVC is the right material, which I have worked with in the past.  Anyone with any experience building exterior cabinets.  What hardware is weather resistant ?

I live in Nova Scotia Canada.  Snow, rain, heat, humidity, etc.

Thank you.

 

[tjbnwi]

Starboard or stainless steel.

Tom

 

[Cheese]

I have a client interested in an outdoor cabinet job.  I assume PVC is the right material, which I have worked with in the past.  Anyone with any experience building exterior cabinets.  What hardware is weather resistant ?

I live in Nova Scotia Canada.  Snow, rain, heat, humidity, etc.

First question is, will this cabinet be in a protected area, or completely naked in an open area? If in an open area, stainless may be your best choice because of the high coefficient of thermal expansion rate with PVC.

For hardware, 304 stainless will cover most applications unless the location is exposed to or close to salt air...then 316 is mandatory.

 

[afish]

I would not use pvc.  it will warp and cup if I did it again I would try the exterior mdf.

 

[woodbutcherbower]

Do you have Tricoya in Canada? It’s 100% weatherproof (actually submersible). Carries a 50-year warranty when used above ground, and 25 years when used below it. Plus 316 stainless hardware.
https://tricoya.com/

Kevin

EDIT - yes you do. Click on the ‘Where to buy’ button and a whole bunch of Canadian suppliers pop up.

 

[Packard]

The only weatherproof cabinets I have seen are the ones intended to reside in the beds of pickup trucks.

Most (perhaps all) of them appear to be made from sheet steel or sheet aluminum and then powder coated.

Most of those cabinets have a hinged lid for access, but some are constructed with drawers.

Perhaps a modular cabinet consisting of purchased metal cabinets meant for truck beds and an outer carcass to house them.

I know that they make outdoor furniture out of molded resin, but I would be concerned that long horizontal planks would sag from the heat of direct sun in the summer.

So, I would suggest aluminum (preferred) or steel sheet metal with a polyester powder coated finish.

https://www.napaonline.com/accessor...m_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organicshopping

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I assume that a client would be expecting that this is something that you build, rather than buying something metal?
Metal is going to get really expensive, for anything beyond things that look like lockers or tool boxes.....as if those aren't pricey too  [unsure]

For something that looks more like traditional cabinets (kitchenette?) and still be weatherproof, I totally agree with Tom.
Starboard is a great way to go. You can cut/drill/route, it with all of your normal woodworking tools.
I have built a few outdoor kitchens from it and a set of storage cabinets for an ambulance bay. They are not in direct sun at all times, there is somewhat of a roof, but rain, snow, and rough use do come into play.

 

[Brian Livingstone]

Thanks everyone for your thoughtful responses.  I’ll see what I can source here in Canada and make a decision.  Very much appreciated.

Brian

 

[kevinculle]

I would second Starboard...back when we were boaters, I used it for some exposed applications on the boat and around the dock and it held up very nicely.

 

[Packard]

I googled “outdoor kitchens”, and they show kitchen cabinets intended for kitchens in your backyard.

Expensive, does not adequately describe the pricing.

“ Outdoor Kitchen Stainless Steel 2 Piece Cabinet Set with 3-Drawer Cabinet and 2-Door Cabinet, $1,699.00 […]”.
https://www.google.com/search?q=outdoor kitchens&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-m
https://shopnewage.com/collections/...MIq_vkhPPYhwMVS0P_AR0qiyNOEAAYASAAEgJacfD_BwE

 

[Michael Kellough]

I would second Starboard...back when we were boaters, I used it for some exposed applications on the boat and around the dock and it held up very nicely.

King Starboard HDPE sheets. They make a big variety including lighter weight versions.

If you want to paint the finished product use Tricoya MDF. Maybe use it anyway since it probably costs less than HDPE sheets.

 

[jeh]

Have the customer buy the stainless and they will be set for decades. I think their thought process is they can save money having someone make them for them because they are "cheaper". Yes, you can make the cabinets, but why hassle with it knowing they are probably going to fail at some point due to leaks, warpage, finish failure, etc. Outdoors is not forgiving to a lot of things and cabinetry (wood, PVC, MDF) is one of them.

I like to work, but this is a time when buying a known solution guarantees success.

 

[Packard]

Have the customer buy the stainless and they will be set for decades. I think their thought process is they can save money having someone make them for them because they are "cheaper". Yes, you can make the cabinets, but why hassle with it knowing they are probably going to fail at some point due to leaks, warpage, finish failure, etc. Outdoors is not forgiving to a lot of things and cabinetry (wood, PVC, MDF) is one of them.

I like to work, but this is a time when buying a known solution guarantees success.

I agree.  The outdoor kitchens are almost all made from metal (stainless steel or aluminum), and are all quite expensive.

What we don’t know is what the driving force is to abandon that solution and get something custom made. What is motivating the customer?

Note:  Most of the outdoor kitchen companies appear to be willing to make custom size, layout, etc. cabinets.  So a desire for “custom” does not appear to be the motivation.

My immediate thought was that they are looking to save money.  But there is a reason why the manufacturers all seem to like metal.  It works.

Cabinets meant for yachts, use wood species (primarily mahogany and teak) for their resistance to the elements.  But those cabinets are “inboard”, the yacht equivalent of “indoors”. 

Note also that the outdoor kitchens all appear to use stone countertops.

 

[WastedP]

https://tricoya.com/

Thanks for posting that, never heard of it.  Nearby distributors are on their list, I'm going to have to look into the pricing here.

 

[rmwarren]

I've fiddled with Starboard, great stuff depending on the use. Do your research on adhesives, the manufacturer recommends mechanical fastening.

You can buy small pieces on ebay I expensively to experiment with.

RMW

 

[woodferret]

I'd probably hit up Robert Bury for MDO (listed as signboard) and Extira if you can't get the Tricoya.  Similarly Mcfaddens will have Medite Exterior and will likely pull over Tricoya if you ask.  Keep in mind, these are still vertical surfaces or slight inclined, so you may still have to look at some more durable top like SS.

caveat: this is more general knowledge/past research.  I haven't built with any of the listed, but have hit up the tech specs of what's avail here in NS.

edit: note that Medite is a little picky about the coating systems used for either Exterior or Tricoya.  They have a FAQ linking to the various systems.  Mostly, they seem to be concerned on moisture level and bonding.  Just something to keep in mind.

edit2: after reading some replies about longevity, note that Medite Exterior doesn't have a longevity estimate for it given how variable it may be.  They suggest Tricoya for the 25/50 yrs warranty (inground/above) if that's important to you.

 

[Cheese]

King Starboard HDPE sheets. They make a big variety including lighter weight versions.

If you want to paint the finished product use Tricoya MDF. Maybe use it anyway since it probably costs less than HDPE sheets.

Michael, I'm curious how you join the HDPE sheets? In the past when this material was used for semiconductor processing equipment, I always relied on hot air welding.

 

[mino]

For a start, I would clarify what is actually meant as "weatherproof" by the client. Sun-proofing and 3-foot-snow-proofing are very different cases.

There is a world of difference in requirements for something to be placed under some roof but not protected by walls - facing sun, wind-jammed rain etc. and something to be literally outside completely unprotected.

In either case, water-resistant ply is very much adequate and cheap. The some special woods. But the bigger focus needs to be on water to be able to escape, to not get in, in that order. Then accounting for major thermal expansion. Basically forget about glue joints if anything woody.

In other words, talk a lot to the client about the use case and what is imagined/desired before suggesting something specific.

 

[Michael Kellough]

King Starboard HDPE sheets. They make a big variety including lighter weight versions.

If you want to paint the finished product use Tricoya MDF. Maybe use it anyway since it probably costs less than HDPE sheets.

Michael, I'm curious how you join the HDPE sheets? In the past when this material was used for semiconductor processing equipment, I always relied on hot air welding.

[member=44099]Cheese[/member]  I haven’t used Starboard but like you have used HDPE panels. My use was mainly for the mechanical properties, low friction, a little give, and a lot of insulation.  Just used coarse thread flat head machine screws, a little longer than I’d normally use in other materials. Wood screws probably would have worked in my case.

For weather protection I’d use hot air welding combined with hidden mechanical fasteners like Zeta or Domino fasteners. Or even pocket screws and plain Dominos. I’d bevel the outside facing joints a little and use hot air and filler rod to seal the joint. Either bevel the panels before assembly or run a router and V bit down the joint after.

I don’t know if I could get a smooth surface on the joint this way. I guess I’d overfill the joint then use a flush trim bit to cut down the surplus. Maybe sanding and then flashing with a heat gun after?

But if a cabinet is thoroughly sealed from water infiltration you’re going to have to do something about vapor that is trapped inside.

 

[woodbutcherbower]

https://tricoya.com/

Thanks for posting that, never heard of it.  Nearby distributors are on their list, I'm going to have to look into the pricing here.

You're most welcome. It's made by the same company who produce Accoya wood (some very good manufacturer videos on YouTube explaining the process). It's quite incredible material and I've used a lot of it for demanding outdoor applications such as doors, gates and windows. The process of acetylation is expensive, so the product is pricey - but as said, both Tricoya and Accoya machine identically to conventional MDF and timber. It also paints up beautifully. Both Tricoya and Accoya are very acidic though - 316 hardware is mandatory.