Well, the Mac went back...

[joraft]

... As to PCs being overly problematic in regards to viruses, that's not been my experience.  I've never had a virus cause a problem that I needed to be concerned with.             

I've had the same experience as you, Brice, I've been using MS based computers since the eighties and they have served me well.

I have nothing against Apple based computers, or the people who choose to use them, they're just machines after all. But what I do find annoying is that so many Apple users seem to have such an attitude of superiority. They're not satisfied with just using and enjoying their machines, they for some reason feel compelled to frequently tell the world how much smarter they are than those who are using and enjoying a different choice.

 

[Brice Burrell]

....I have nothing against Apple based computers, or the people who choose to use them, they're just machines after all. But what I do find annoying is that so many Apple users seem to have such an attitude of superiority. They're not satisfied with just using and enjoying their machines, they for some reason feel compelled to frequently tell the world how much smarter they are than those who are using and enjoying a different choice.

John, I don't mind at all because secretly I know I'm the smarter one.  With the thousands I've saved buying PC's over the years I've bought a ton more Festools. [tongue]

 

[tiralie]

I've had the same experience as you, Brice, I've been using MS based computers since the eighties and they have served me well.

I have nothing against Apple based computers, or the people who choose to use them, they're just machines after all. But what I do find annoying is that so many Apple users seem to have such an attitude of superiority. They're not satisfied with just using and enjoying their machines, they for some reason feel compelled to frequently tell the world how much smarter they are than those who are using and enjoying a different choice.

Same here...I won't add any other comments or examples other than this clip from "The life of Brian" "... it's symbolic of his struggle against reality" Hilarious!
Monty Python - Life of Brian - PFJ Union meeting

 

[nickao]

The main reason there are barely any viruses for mac(there are some)is that it is not worth a hacker time to create the virus. That's a fact. Why would anyone try to exploit a few million users when they could mess with a billion+ PC machines. Google it, the mac is just as easy to get into and make viruses for. It's simply a numbers game and is not worth anyone's time when there are so many PC's to infiltrate.

When any mac user can come close to the performance of my machine (and 3 d graphics as well!) at 1/2 the cost get back to me. I will put up my home made machine against the best macs on the market and my machine is 12 months old!

 

[jmbfestool]

The main reason there are barely any viruses for mac(there are some)is that it is not worth a hacker time to create the virus. That's a fact. Why would anyone try to exploit a few million users when they could mess with a billion+ PC machines. Google it, the mac is just as easy to get into and make viruses for. It's simply a numbers game and is not worth anyone's time when there are so many PC's to infiltrate.

When any mac user can come close to the performance of my machine (and 3 d graphics as well!) at 1/2 the cost get back to me. I will put up my home made machine against the best macs on the market and my machine is 12 months old!

And all that power just for FOG.  [tongue] [tongue]

 

[fidelfs]

Well,

Joraft, it is both ways.  I work with high technologiy companies, with the gratest and latest tools.  This is how It is my work every day.

Most of the companies are using pc windows for the clients, (users like you and me).  They have big servers, using windows, Unix, linix what not.

Most of the companies IT decides what the users will use as tools and computers.  It has been traditionally pc and windows.

I was strugling early 2000 with some requirements, because at that time, it was a big thing with the companies, moving into the web.  Most of the tools to have graphics were on mac or very expensive windows versions, that require a very advance graphic card and processor for their graphics.

I decide to buy my first mac.  I discover that it was not much difference that windows, but some tasks were simplier and easier than windows base OS.  I kept using my mac and linix at home, and windows at work.
People say that apple users are snow, but my experience is windows user always try to tell me how dumb I am for drinking the apple cool aid.  How I am wasting my monyey, etc.  See, it is the other side of the coin.

Nowdays the big IT Departments are opening up and letting users pick their tools, so I am seing more diversity on the workplace, linux laptops and apple laptops.

It is not that 92% know better, I would say 92% of that 92% dont know what they are  buying.  They just buy for impulse, or seing some bechmarks published by a magazine paid by the manufacturer to print the info.

So, if it works for you be happy, if you want test the waters in the other side it is not that bad ( either side)

 

[nickao]

The main reason there are barely any viruses for mac(there are some)is that it is not worth a hacker time to create the virus. That's a fact. Why would anyone try to exploit a few million users when they could mess with a billion+ PC machines. Google it, the mac is just as easy to get into and make viruses for. It's simply a numbers game and is not worth anyone's time when there are so many PC's to infiltrate.

When any mac user can come close to the performance of my machine (and 3 d graphics as well!) at 1/2 the cost get back to me. I will put up my home made machine against the best macs on the market and my machine is 12 months old!

And all that power just for FOG.  [tongue] [tongue]

hehe, well that, cad ,cam and mostly for my kids games.

 

[AlexThePalex]

It is not that 92% know better, I would say 92% of that 92% dont know what they are  buying.  They just buy for impulse, or seing some bechmarks published by a magazine paid by the manufacturer to print the info.

Well, wadda ya know, another smug remark by a Mac fanboy.  [thumbs up] You guys just can't help yourselves, can you?  [scratch chin] Thanks for once again proving the point Joraft made.  :

Tsk, tsk.

 

[fdengel]

the fact remains you spend more for less on mac. Less software compatibility, less upgrade options means all around less usability.

Less hassle, less time wasted on troubleshooting, less worrying, fewer viruses, fewer problems...

 

[fidelfs]

It is not that 92% know better, I would say 92% of that 92% dont know what they are  buying.  They just buy for impulse, or seing some bechmarks published by a magazine paid by the manufacturer to print the info.

Well, wadda ya know, another smug remark by a Mac fanboy.   [thumbs up] You guys just can't help yourselves, can you?  [scratch chin] Thanks for once again proving the point Joraft made.  :

Tsk, tsk.

Alex, if you want to put it out of context to prove your point is ok, but that it is not what I said.

 

[Ken Nagrod]

Let's not forget about Dell flooding the market with inexpensive Windows machines for quite some time.  Lots of people own them because the price was right.  Don't think that the numbers/percentages wouldn't have been reversed or rather a lot different if Apple had done that.

 

[peter halle]

Well, it has been more than 90 days since Bob returned his Mac.  I am certain that he has moved on.  We certainly have heard pluses and minuses on both sides from the proponents who like each.

Perhaps we should move along too before hard feelings develop.

Peter - Moderator

 

[Ken Nagrod]

Maybe someone will buy Bob a Mac for Christmas.  [big grin]

 

[Bob Marino]

Jeesh Bob - you might as well start selling Ryobi's!

Sounds like the folks that fault Festool's because their too complicated to use, metric, etc.  When we here know they're worth the xtra $$ and time spent figuring out how to use em.

Your $850 HP will be worth $35 in 8 months.  A $1000 iMac would be worth $650 a year later and $450 two years later.

Welcome to viruses and hassles.  Would have been worth the effort to get it ironed out...

They say that within 20 seconds of connecting to broadband, a new pc will be infected.  I've used Macs since 99 with no virus software with no issues.

Takes two hands to count the number of times per week I get spam emails from friends and acquaintances who's computers have been infected and are sending spam through their email accounts.  Takes another two hands to count the folks who complain about their computer's being slow or at the shop to be cleaned up and reset.

Why anyone would buy a PC I don't know...
Macs:
- no viruses
- high resale
- better hardware
- longevity of os/hardware compatibility
- better integration of os
- loaded with simple powerful apps
- better design, build
- did I say no viruses?

For you - compatibility with your warehousing network is key to your business, but for folks without those specific-type concerns, Macs are a better choice from any and all angles.

Julian

  Hi Julian,

Wow, were you late to this dance.
I already addressed this issue.

See below thread from  a while back.

Bob Marino, I bet you never thought this would turn into anything more than a Apple vs. PC war debate, leading to pick and choose the tidbits that swung you one way or the other.  You unknowingly opened up a whole can of worms.  Happy fishing my friend.  Big Grin

Ken,

I wrote a long reply, but must of hit the wrong key and got deleted, so I will be brief.

I had a feeling this would take turns; that's OK, still tons of great help. John R, yes this still quite civil; we've all seen other posts go negative big time.
Anyhow, I am leaning to the MACS primarily because of the same reasons I like Festool.

Service - as mentioned, I am not techy  (Shane can attest to that Wink)  and if I have questions, I can easily get in contact with tech support - and tech support is not outsourced outside the USA. There are also free classes and even one to one training; if I so choose. I like dialing a single number, not a series of phone prompts.
Seem to built better and have fewer problems. Initial price may be higher, but my time is important and my frustration level low for dealing with poor customer service. I am willing to pay more for that.
I appreciate the fact that Apple has a handful of computers, rather than dozens and dozens lik e the rest.  IMHO, they, like Festool don't issue new models monthly - they do their homework and get the product right. When there are enough upgrades available, only then will a new model be issued. Buy a Dell today, 1-2  months later, the price is lowered by $100.00, 3-4 months later there is a new skew number and 8 months later the computer is no longer available. Maybe a slight exaggeration, but not far off the mark. That they choose to have a maintain a  set price no matter where you shop is also a plus in my mind. Saves me from wasting my time and theirs  trying to get the "best deal".

Build a quality product, maintain the best customer support, support your dealer network - way too many similarities to Festool, for me not to be impressed.

Bob


See my July 25th response below.

After much much trial, testing, checking, frustration and ultimately, disappointment, I returned the Imac back to Apple.
A few thoughts to share about my decision as well as Apple. As mentioned in my original threads about PC vs Apple, my needs are relatively modest; efficient cruising of the Net, basic Excel, be able to easily log onto my Citrix based warehouse site.  Excellent customer service, the ability to  speak to a real live person, or bring it into any Apple store for repair, high quality materials, attention to design, stable pricing and many positive comments from MAC  owners heavily influenced me. Good  graphics and the fact that the MACS are not as plagued by viruses as the  PCs were also pluses. There are more reasons, but you get the point.
Anyhow, after losing Internet connections - while my other PCs didn't, and the absolute inability to properly connect to Citrix; this after a whole bunch of fixes with Citrix were tried and failed, finalized my decision to return the Imac and get a PC. I did give some thought to  placing Windows 7 on the Mac and using a program called Parallels or Bootcamp? to enable my MAC  to run Citrix...and Excel, but just wasn't willing to pump out more $$$$ and time into it. I didn't buy a MAC to run a PC.  Also, I was availing myself of Apple's One to One program; but really using that to learn how to use the Mac's features - features that I knew how to use on  the PC, but had to relearn the Mac's version.

Having said all that, I would say that Apple's products are higher quality - the screen's resolution is higher than HDTV, the mouse and pad are aluminum, not plastic, etc., etc. and their customer service and support  are leagues ahead of any others - Dell, HP, etc. BTW, went to the  HP website to check their computers out, called the Customer service 800 number and got routed to a HP call center in the Philippines - welcome to the PC world.
I later reluctantly went to Best Buy, spoke to a fairly knowledgeable young salesperson and bought a HP. I say reluctantly, because as also mentioned in my previous post, what I bought for $850.00 yesterday, will be around $650.00 in 3 months and unavailable in 6 months.
So, at the end of the day, the Mac just did  not work for me and had to go back. Shame, better machine, better customer service - all the things I highly regard, but again, just wasn't cutting it for me. Maybe one day though....

Bob

So, it's October and here we are. Again, it was with regrets and only after hours of frustration with not getting my IMac up and running successfully with Citrix - even the techs at Apple couldn't do it - that I decided that for me - for my specific application - that the Apple was not worth the time, money and effort. If Citrix went up without a hitch, I'd still have that Imac. Each  sytem has it advantages and disadvantages. Having said that, what I know about computers couldn't fill a thimble, but I do not look down on PC users as less sophisticated, nor up to Mac users as better enlightened. If a particular system works better for a particular user, Lord knows, who I am to judge?

Bob