As some of you may know, I am selling my cabinet saw and moving to a CSC50. I decided to buy it from my local Woodcraft store. I called the store last Friday and asked if they had it in stock, they did. I said I wanted to buy it that day and I mentioned I would like to have someone walk me through the saw and help me calibrate it as well. I was told, "no-one is really an expert but they would do their best???" I thought I would try again today and I called the store back, hoping to get someone else that may know more. Again, I told them I wanted to buy the saw today. I was informed the person that might be able to help me was talking to a customer and they would call me back shortly. More than an hour later, with no returned call, I went to the store. I was informed the person had left for the day at 4pm. I find this experience very frustrating. Every time I go into the store, their staff is sitting around chatting with each other. Why don't they spend their time educating themselves on the tools they sell. I ended up ordering it tonight from Amazon and saved $200. I have always been an advocate for local retailers with knowledgeable staff compared to saving money with online merchants. With all the information that is available on the web and staff that know virtually nothing about their products, I don't see them lasting much longer.
What's the point of retail stores?
- Thread starter MMCO
- Start date
onocoffee
Member
Hmmm, I hear you. That's a frustrating situation.
I think I'm lucky in that our local Woodcraft is very good. The owner keeps a lot of inventory on-hand and the staff is very knowledgeable about the products - including the CSC SYS 50
But, am I understanding you correctly? You bought the CSC SYS 50 for $200 less than retail on Amazon? Do you have a link?
I think I'm lucky in that our local Woodcraft is very good. The owner keeps a lot of inventory on-hand and the staff is very knowledgeable about the products - including the CSC SYS 50
But, am I understanding you correctly? You bought the CSC SYS 50 for $200 less than retail on Amazon? Do you have a link?
smorgasbord
Member
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I think the $200 is the difference between the 577383 and the 577378. There's also a version that doesn't come with batteries or chargers.
At the Woodcraft in Denver they were very knowledgeable, but that was 20 years ago (we moved).
Our local Festool dealer here (they did not survive the housing bust in '07) kinda ignored the Festool section. The owners wife even told me "You Festool people are kinda different"......
Our local Festool dealer here (they did not survive the housing bust in '07) kinda ignored the Festool section. The owners wife even told me "You Festool people are kinda different"......
I ordered the exact saw kit that is $1999. You pay less tax with Amazon and I get 5% with their cc, that's the $200 in savings.
smorgasbord
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Where do you live that Amazon charges less sales tax? They always charge me full boat.
ToolNirvana doesn't charge sales tax in most states, btw.
ToolNirvana doesn't charge sales tax in most states, btw.
Muttley000
Member
I live an hour away from any stores, formerly including a woodcraft that recently closed. Oak Tree Supply in Fort Wayne is the best of both. It is small enough the owners or one of their capable people is in every day if I want to stop, but most of their business is online. When I can’t stop in I call or email and get immediate information, and then buy through the website. They don’t charge sales tax on shipped orders, not an issue for me with tax exemption for my business but I could see that being a benefit for others. I like I get to support a small family owned business, and still get the convenience of the big online stores.
Sparktrician
Member
Must say, the owners of the two Woodcraft stores in Northern Virginia are pretty clueless about keeping knowledgeable staff in their stores and really knowing the products they carry. Many years ago I visited the former location of the Woodcraft in Springfield, only to find an MFT/3 that was missing parts and incorrectly assembled, and on another occasion, the staff was unable to inform a customer about how to use an RO 125 correctly. Any more, I'll drive to the Woodworkers Club in Rockville, MD, which is also a Woodcraft franchise. The ownership really cares about earning customers with great service and knowledgeable staff.
UncleRunkle
Member
Thank you for the tip on the Rockville shop- I will have to pop up there some day. Springfield is okay- decent inventory when I stopped in a couple months back but the hiring isn't focused so much on those passionate about tools and woodworking versus retired veterans, which is perfectly fine. At the end of the day it's a retail store, so the focus is really sales. Rockville here I come. My dealer is actually in DC so I have to make a trip for anything in-person anyway.
I live in an unincorporated county in colorado. The woodcraft store is located in centennial, a city in Colorado.
onocoffee
Member
Rockville is a great shop with very nice and welcoming staff. If they don't have what you're looking for, give the Baltimore location a call. Chances are they'll have it in-stock. I've heard that people will call them and then drive all the way to Baltimore because they got it that day. One guy drove from Pittsburgh to pick up a PCS.
rmhinden
Member
The Woodcraft I go to in San Carlos CA is fine. Not everyone knows everything, but overall they are helpful and meet my expectations.
Bob
Bob
ear3
Member
No experience with Woodcraft, but sorry to hear they are not keeping their end of the bargain on professional guidance. For me, having a knowledgable Festool dealer early on was crucial for building up my shop and experience-- shout out Acetool in Wantagh, NY. Nrver tried to upsell me on anything or steer me towards something that wasnt appropriate for the task. Saved me on several occasions from sending off a tool to service because they knew some tricks and fine adjustments to get the most out of the tools. They went above and beyond in permitting me to return accessories that they did not technically have to take back.
Now that I know what I'm doing with Festool, they still help when it comes to other tools/areas of the trade with which I'm less familiar. Last week I drove out there because I needed a more powerful laser for framing out a shed extension I'm building upstate. They just happened to have a great deal on a bosch gll3-330 that wasnt even advertised, so i was able to walk out with the right tool and having saved a couple hundred dollars compared to browsing myself on Amazon.
I mention all this because if we have the option, I believe it's important more than ever to support the physical retailers. If your local Woodcraft is falling down on the job when it comes to Festool advice, maybe you could write the manager or even corporate to let them know to give them an opportunity to rectify the situation, or hire another more qualified person who knows what they're doing
Now that I know what I'm doing with Festool, they still help when it comes to other tools/areas of the trade with which I'm less familiar. Last week I drove out there because I needed a more powerful laser for framing out a shed extension I'm building upstate. They just happened to have a great deal on a bosch gll3-330 that wasnt even advertised, so i was able to walk out with the right tool and having saved a couple hundred dollars compared to browsing myself on Amazon.
I mention all this because if we have the option, I believe it's important more than ever to support the physical retailers. If your local Woodcraft is falling down on the job when it comes to Festool advice, maybe you could write the manager or even corporate to let them know to give them an opportunity to rectify the situation, or hire another more qualified person who knows what they're doing
Because it most likely won't get them anything personal. Most people just want to exist in peace and mediocrity.
Festool used to require dealers or their employees to take classes at the training center in Lebanon IN. These were / are real hands on classes on using the tools and actually making things. However I am not sure of the current status.
Seth
bobtskutter
Member
I find it astonishing that US Foggers drive hundreds of miles to go to specific retail stores. If I did that in the UK I'd be driving "coast to coast" to go browse tools. Thing is, I'm beginning to think that's what I need to do, maybe not coast to coast, but defiantly "up and down the M1".
Bob
Bob
That's the Woodcraft I go to as well. I've had a similar experience where the staff tend to mostly be young people who aren't exceptionally knowledgeable about woodworking and definitely don't know the ins and outs of specific tools. It doesn't bother me much because I'm not going to them as product experts, I'm going there because I need something for a project and don't want to wait one to five days to get it online. But like you, I get most of my Festool kit from Amazon because of the 5% discount from the credit card.
I can clarify this a little: here in Colorado, our state sales tax rate is fairly low (2.9%), but county and city sales tax rates can be quite high since they are a primary revenue stream for local governments rather than property taxes as in many states. If you order things from Amazon, you pay sales tax based on where you live, while if you buy from a retail store, you're paying tax based on the location of the store. Given that city sales tax is often between 3-5%, if you live on unincorporated land and you're not in a hurry, you can save a decent amount of money by buying online rather than driving into town and buying from a store. Overall this is probably not the best system of incentives for the state and punishes local businesses, but these things are usually the product of history long before the internet came and upended everything.
johnmpf
Member
I live in South Eastern Wisconsin. I have yet to find a dealer who really knows the tools. The local Woodcraft and Rockler have a few people who sort of know what they are talking about, but no experts.
The local Neu's hardware store has a Festool section, but it is never staffed and is used as an overflow for other items. When I ask about Festool tools, they kind of mumble something of little value. It is a great store for Milwaukee stuff however.
It would be nice to have a premium store to match the premium pricing for Festool stuff.
The local Neu's hardware store has a Festool section, but it is never staffed and is used as an overflow for other items. When I ask about Festool tools, they kind of mumble something of little value. It is a great store for Milwaukee stuff however.
It would be nice to have a premium store to match the premium pricing for Festool stuff.
Cheese
Member
Don't forget factory reps can easily rebalance the equation. 
& 
The original Minnesota Festool rep used to stop by the Minneapolis Woodcraft store every 3-4 months and give demos and answer questions. There was no time limit and he would demo anything you wanted to see and discuss anything you wanted to talk about. If Woodcraft didn't have the requisite Festool item in stock, he'd go out to his truck and bring the item in to demo and pass it around.
The current Festool rep hasn't stopped by Woodcraft in the last 7-8 years. I don't even know his/her name. I no longer make many special Saturday Woodcraft excursions. 
& The original Minnesota Festool rep used to stop by the Minneapolis Woodcraft store every 3-4 months and give demos and answer questions. There was no time limit and he would demo anything you wanted to see and discuss anything you wanted to talk about. If Woodcraft didn't have the requisite Festool item in stock, he'd go out to his truck and bring the item in to demo and pass it around. The current Festool rep hasn't stopped by Woodcraft in the last 7-8 years. I don't even know his/her name. I no longer make many special Saturday Woodcraft excursions. 
