wood movement question….

[Lou in DE]

I'm in the middle of a cherry dresser build - although I have made various smaller tables etc, this is my largest project to date and I'm at the point where I have the side panels ready with dados and drawer frames (poplar with dominos) ready to glue up. The side panels are about 18 inches deep (front to back) with the grain running up and down so I'd expect some movement front to back but over 18 inches I'm not sure how much. I have seen some folks glue just the front few inches and back few inches of the panels. Maybe just 18 inches isn't that much to worry about and I could glue the entire dado?

The finished dresser would be about 20 in deep, 32 in high and 65 in long.

Any suggestions appreciated.

 

[chrisrosenb]

Will the dresser have a face frame?

 

[Linbro]

Hello Lou - are the panels thick enough for a screw to bite into? You could glue the first 75mm or so, then screw through the drawer frames into the panels, using elongated clearance holes in the frames to allow for movement.

 

[Jesse Cloud]

Wood movement depends on a lot of variables - species of wood (cherry moves moderate amounts), the change in moisture content, and the width of the piece.  If you build something in an unconditioned environment in the desert and move it to a porch in Florida - a worst case situation - 18 inches of cherry would move about 3/8 of an inch.  If the piece is staying in a relatively climate controlled area, the movement would probably be about half of that.  Hard to tell how much but it will move.

I would never glue a frame all the way across a panel.  The suggestion of screws in slots is a good solution.  If the frame fits snugly into the dado, some glue at the front will do the job nicely by itself.

 

[AndyUK]

Using man made boards (mdf, plywood etc.) it's usually ok to glue the panel in place when using a frame and panel construction as movement should be negligible.
However when using a timber panel I personally always just let it float allowing enough depth in the dados for timber expansion and just glue the frame joints.

 

[Iceclimber]

Not to hijack a thread but this has me thinking about a project i intend to complete this afternoon.

How much movement do i need to factor in for the floating bottoms of drawers when working with sapele. The plan now is a 1/4" groove and 1/4 rabbit on all three sides in half onch stalk.

Being winter in New England is a snug joint just fine side to side or should i leave 1/16 or so on both the sides for seasonal movement?

 

[Lou in DE]

Thanks guys for the information. The dresser will have a face frame. The panels are solid cherry approx 20mm (13/16 inch or so) so there is plenty of "meat" for the screws - I think that sounds like the best approach - glue the first 3 inches and use screws with elongated holes.

Just wanted to add that I used the MFT3 with OF1400 to do the dadoes - what a pleasure - before Festool I dreaded using a router because of all the dust, chips and cleanup - with the CT26 there was minimal chips - just at the beginning or when doing the edges. With the MFT3 rail there was perfect squareness and repeatability using the guide stops.

I had 5 routers before getting the 1400 - now I realize how a router should work - what a pleasure to use.

 

[JimD]

Another factor on wood movement is the finish.  Poly will greatly retard moisture changes - but only if all surfaces are covered.  I finish the panels and the inside edges of raised panel structures before glue-up.  I don't glue solid wood panels to the frame anywhere (at least I do not intentionally do it).  I hate it when you see a nice piece except the panel shrunk exposing an unfinished edge.  So I finish the panel before glueup.  Doing the inside edge of the frame avoids having to try and finish it and avoid getting finish on the completed panel.  You have to stop the finish where the glued joint will be, however.

 

[golfingguy.rm@gmail.com]

if this is for your personal house i would take the panels into that area and let them acclimate for a couple of weeks...this will provide time for them to do what they will in the future and show any problems like shrinkage...including in thickness...i have had some panels shrink in  thickness after i brought them in...showing the seam lines is not a good look  [mad]