Would you return this TS 55 FEQ due to poor casting?

[BeerCanPyramids]

Just unboxed a TS 55 FEQ (purchased from BIS) and found some rough edges on the baseplate. Looks like poor casting, pitting, and/or powdercoat. It doesn't seem to effect proper guiderail operation; but I'm new to the TS 55 FEQ and haven't actually cut with it yet. Considering the $699 price tag, would you try and exchange it for a better one? Or are some rough edges just part of the deal? Hard to photograph but it feels like all edges should be straight & smooth out of the box.

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[Kpp80202]

Are there actual rough edges when you rub a finger on it, such that they would scratch anything, or is it a smooth, but uneven surface? If the former, I'd send it back. If the latter, I wouldn't. My FEQ is coming in tomorrow, so I'll be putting my money where my mouth is shortly.

 

[BeerCanPyramids]

Not really sharp or cutting – more smooth but uneven, as you say. And when on a track, the saw seems to glide properly and it didn't scratch the track that I can tell. But not being experienced with the system, I thought I'd ask the community for their take. And TBH, it just bugs me to pay the premium price but get a tool with sub-par finish work on important surfaces. I haven't used it, so I can return it, but there's dealing with BIS and return shipping costs. All to possibly get the same example of this saw.

 

[4nthony]

Here's a closeup of mine. I got it about 8 months ago. It hasn't caused me any problems. Maybe they've all got slight variations?

 

[Kpp80202]

And TBH, it just bugs me to pay the premium price but get a tool with sub-par finish work on important surfaces. I haven't used it, so I can return it, but there's dealing with BIS and return shipping costs. All to possibly get the same example of this saw.

I completely understand this feeling. But based on what you said, I think it's a non-issue. The key is that the saw cuts properly and the interface between the saw and the rail is not such that it will cause undue wear. You can use it for 30 days and return it if it doesn't cut properly, but it looks like it will work just great.

 

[woodbutcherbower]

When you’re paying top dollar for a premium tool, you have every right to expect premium everything. Justifying it by saying “Yeah I know the paint finish on my new Bentley is rubbish, but they’re all like that and it works OK” just doesn’t cut it. Take it back and get one which has a proper casting and a proper finish. Totally unacceptable.

 

[Kpp80202]

When you’re paying top dollar for a premium tool, you have every right to expect premium everything. Justifying it by saying “Yeah I know the paint finish on my new Bentley is rubbish, but they’re all like that and it works OK” just doesn’t cut it. Take it back and get one which has a proper casting and a proper finish. Totally unacceptable.

I can't really argue with this, other than I feel like it's like being unhappy with the paint finish under the Bentley, rather than where it counts. Which still can be a reason to be dissatisfied enough to return it.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Looks like the typical casting "flash" edges of a non-machined surface. They probably give it a quick hit with a belt sander and off to powdercoat. It's the bottom of a non-bearing surface, not like a contact point where you would touch it every day. At the end of the day, it is a tool, not a display item for your knick-knack shelf. 
I get the "Premium" thing, especially in the US, because there isn't really anything else in that range.
But, does Festool themselves really push premium? I thought it was more about the system approach and German manufacturing?

 

[Paul_HKI]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that saw.

 

[guybo]

this is our backup saw from 2013 from the recall and our 55ebq from 2010 looks the same  [big grin]

 

[mino]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that finish. Not at that place.

It is a place that does not touch anything so the only concern is it does not cut you - which it does not as it is sanded and painted over.

You should look at it in a way that Festool saved you $2 for skipped machining operation that would please your eye and nothing more.
I personally do not see any point in paying for something that just makes the tool look nice. It is a tool, not jewelry.

Besides, Festool is known for focusing (a lot, sometimes to the extreme) on details WHICH AFFECT FUNCTIONALITY. If something does not affect functionality or ergonomics, they do not waste resources on it. Never did. They are a tool maker. Not a phone/jewelry maker.

EDIT:
Actually, thinking about this, it is likely that this extruded piece costs a lot (more) to make precisely because they chose the side where the extrusion will be broken-off on a side that is non-conflicting with anything.

We have other brand tracksaws and they have (had, we filed them off) pretty horrible extrusion artefacts INSIDE the saw, disrupting the air flow and affecting dust estraction. Nothing like those I have seen on my TSC -inside- air channel. The "ugly" is also on the bottom as well. Where it does not matter ..

 

[BeerCanPyramids]

Appreciate the replies and images showing similar rough casting edges. Good to know it isn't a red flag to users with time on these tools – seems a non-issue to everyone. Function is definitely the main thing.

Festool costs more, so users expect more. 99% of the saw is so refined and crisp, a better edge in that one spot would harm no one and better back up the brand which is squarely on the premium end of tool options. A new Festool customer with high expectations based on price and name, might open a TS 55 FEQ, see a sloppy cast edge on the base plate side, and wonder if they got a lemon. That will be their first experience with Festool. An unsure “hope this saw is copacetic” experience. That is something Festool should aim to avoid IMO.

 

[mino]

Appreciate the replies and images showing similar rough casting edges. Good to know it isn't a red flag to users with time on these tools – seems a non-issue to everyone. Function is definitely the main thing.

Festool costs more, so users expect more. 99% of the saw is so refined and crisp, a better edge in that one spot would harm no one and better back up the brand which is squarely on the premium end of tool options. A new Festool customer with high expectations based on price and name, might open a TS 55 FEQ, see a sloppy cast edge on the base plate side, and wonder if they got a lemon. That will be their first experience with Festool. An unsure “hope this saw is copacetic” experience. That is something Festool should aim to avoid IMO.

The point being made, it is not a "sloppy cast edge". That surface is not casted to begin actually. What you see is a break-off point where the additional material required for the casting process is broken-off from the piece, sanded to not overhand/be sharp and painted over. Casting it like this - from one short side to then break-off a piece is actually pretty hard/expensive. It is MUCH cheaper to have all the external surfaces nicely cast and have a couple cast-insert places on the inside which are then sanded off. As mentioned, our other brand saws have it like that and it is a functionality mess. Yet they look better on the outside .. all the mess is on the inside, where the causes real functional issues ..

On the "make it nice" point. You are probably not much into industrial manufacturing. Every operation you do costs money. Nothing is free. And especially when you are paying your workers $50k+ /yr like Festool does ...

So where do you draw the line? Which is the point where it is not worth it? I can show you about 20 places you can make/add such operations on that saw to get smoother surface etc. Each would make one part of it "nicer" and "more premium looking/feeling". But none will have an effect on its operation.*) And all combined will make the saw easily $100 more. Will you pay it, in addition to the current price ? Maybe you will. Most will preferably not have to.

*) Actually there is one place where an operation would improve functionality -> machining the sliding surfaces where the saw slides on the slip strips would make it slide more precisely and more smoothly, it is probably an overkill, but that would be where *I* would spend those $5 for an additional machining step. That same operation would make the saw "uglier" rougher, and is probably overkill as the saw slides excellently without it.

That said, there is a brand that does go all the way to make/machine most of their surfaces as part of a policy - Maffel. You may want to look at them. E.g. their tracksaw is arguably a better saw than the TS55. I do not like them, as IMO the FS/2 rail system is more flexible. But there are a lot of people who swear by both the MT55 and their rail system.

 

[semenza]

[member=77838]BeerCanPyramids[/member]  Welcome to the forum  [smile]

      You will have to decide if it is acceptable for yourself. People have differing levels off tolerance when it comes to things of this nature. And that's fine.

    I can tell you, regardless of whether some people think it is OK or not, that they are all like that. I have four. Two TS55, a TS75, and a 55 cordless in a variety of vintages. All of them have those marks. So if it is not OK with you for whatever reason you should return it. But don't exchange it because you will get the same on another one.

Seth

 

[sancho57]

does the tool work as its supposed to? Why sweat the small stuff. If it doesnt interfere w form fit or function its good.
i guess you can return it get another one thats the same or worse then someone will buy it on Recon for a discount and enjoy it

 

[VirTERM]

[member=77838]BeerCanPyramids[/member]  Welcome to the forum  [smile]

      You will have to decide if it is acceptable for yourself. People have differing levels off tolerance when it comes to things of this nature. And that's fine.

    I can tell you, regardless of whether some people think it is OK or not, that they are all like that. I have four. Two TS55, a TS75, and a 55 cordless in a variety of vintages. All of them have those marks. So if it is not OK with you for whatever reason you should return it. But don't exchange it because you will get the same on another one.

Seth

I just checked my TS-55 F and found the same imperfections. This part does not touch anything so it’s just a cosmetics

 

[MrToolJunkie]

As others have said, normal machine marks aid they all have them.

 

[krudawg]

Just unboxed a TS 55 FEQ (purchased from BIS) and found some rough edges on the baseplate. Looks like poor casting, pitting, and/or powdercoat. It doesn't seem to effect proper guiderail operation; but I'm new to the TS 55 FEQ and haven't actually cut with it yet. Considering the $699 price tag, would you try and exchange it for a better one? Or are some rough edges just part of the deal? Hard to photograph but it feels like all edges should be straight & smooth out of the box.

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I'm on the fence.  It doesn't look like it will hurt the function but dang; they charge and arm and a leg for their engineering so I might call them and let them know you object to their sloppiness and they should spend a little more time cleaning up the edges.

 

[mino]

I'm on the fence.  It doesn't look like it will hurt the function but dang; they charge and arm and a leg for their engineering so I might call them and let them know you object to their sloppiness and they should spend a little more time cleaning up the edges.

Please use the correct wording.

Sloppiness => someone ignored something/did not do his job. That is not the case here as evidenced.

Festool chose to not provide a silky smooth finish on a side of the product where it does not provide any benefit. That is no sloppiness. That is a conscious design choice.

Wanted to initially argue, but then realized your post is very much self-contradictory.

On one hand you are unhappy Festool did not increase the cost by adding a cosmetic/non-functional finishing step on a tool. And by the second hand you complain the tool is expensive.

But these aspects are mutually exclusive to each other.

You can either have perfect finish, so you tools are nice when displayed on your fireplace. Or you can have more affordable tools. One does not go with the other.

 

[tomk]

Both my TS 55 REQ and TSC 55 KEB have/had this. I noticed it right out of the box. I'm sure Festool knows about it and decided it wasn't worth it to machine that side for one reason or another.

Would I be proud of painting over something like that? No way. I would have made sure my casting vendor had appropriate specifications for acceptability so this wouldn't happen. Festool tools usually have excellent fit and finish so this really stands out.

That said, just be happy with the saw. This is a non-functional defect on part of the saw you rarely see and never touch. It's a joy to use my TSC 55 KEB. Nothing is perfect... even Festool. [wink]