45* bed frame legs project advice

[duburban]

Architect has given this project to build out of white oak. I noticed how the carpenters at the family's camp house built the beds with kreg jig joints and exposed kreg jig countersunk holes!

I have a domino 500 which i'm planning to use in addition to a concealed bed bolt connection.

I am also thinking about a layer of plywood as a sure way to stop the frame from racking.

Any genius ideas?

 

[mrFinpgh]

You want to make sure that there is ample room for the mattress to breathe on both sides.  That might be a reason not to use plywood.

Lee valley has a good piece for the middle leg: http://www.leevalley.com/us/Hardware/page.aspx?p=65557&cat=3,43715,43730&ap=1

If you line it up, it will be difficult for the bed to rack very much.

The other thing you could do, that I sometimes wish I had done, is use the slats to help stiffen the frame.  Maybe you can use dominos to locate each individual slat along each side.

Will the frame be knockdown, or will the joints be permanent? 

-Adam

 

[mouppe]

I used strips of plywood about 10" wide- with gaps in between them- to stop the bed frame racking and allow the mattress to breathe.

 

[bertv]

I have used tensioned steel cable in a similar construction (two V-shapes, mirrored from the center to from an X).

 

[Tinker]

I have used tensioned steel cable in a similar construction (two V-shapes, mirrored from the center to from an X).

I am wondering if tensioned cables would have a tendency to pull the side frames together.  Or are you talking about only two cables attached at the four corners?

Tinker

 

[bertv]

[member=550]Tinker[/member]: AFAIRecall I used 4 cables, that converged in the middle, where they were fastened to woodscrew eyes on both sides of the beam (or possibly a through and through end of threaded rod with eyebolts either side). The other ends were fastened with a turnbuckle to eyes on the sides, pretty close to the corner. The tension was just so that it prevented/compensated shear.

This bed had separate slatted bottoms (from IKEA), that dropped inside the sides and head- and footboard.

As the bed frame was constructed to be taken apart in case of moving, using cables was a convenient solution, I think.

 

[Dane]

I've used threaded rod for the same purpose as the above mentioned cables- a bit easier to tighten up, in my experience.

 

[Tinker]

[member=550]Tinker[/member]: AFAIRecall I used 4 cables, that converged in the middle, where they were fastened to woodscrew eyes on both sides of the beam (or possibly a through and through end of threaded rod with eyebolts either side). The other ends were fastened with a turnbuckle to eyes on the sides, pretty close to the corner. The tension was just so that it prevented/compensated shear.

This bed had separate slatted bottoms (from IKEA), that dropped inside the sides and head- and footboard.

As the bed frame was constructed to be taken apart in case of moving, using cables was a convenient solution, I think.

The slats definitely seem to be a good idea.  The cables pulling against the sides I think would eventually pull the sides together.  The slats prevent that bowing.  I have never seen cable use in making a bed, but i have only been around for .........................er............... [scratch chin]
Tinker

 

[duburban]

Thanks for all the input. "notifications" definitely did not work, so happy to see ideas.

I'd like to be able to break the bed down, I have to deliver it out of state. And, it seems like a greater engineering challenge.

Ply wood for shear is looking like a great option to me. Its a sudden no-brainer solution. It seems tacky to have the plywood and the slats but I'm willing to do that if it looks more traditional and provides a surface with more give.

I'm really curious about what type of domino/bed bolt configuration would be best at the joints. Also, would making the legs out of two laminated pieces be stronger than one 8/8 ? I'm trying to resist cracking here as the dominos can only be so far from the edge.

*Will update with sketchup images to illustrate.

 

[Holmz]

Plywood is strong in 2 dimensions, but the force only requires 1 dimension.
One could use glulams, and a good example is the IKEA slats.

 

[duburban]

Plywood is strong in 2 dimensions, but the force only requires 1 dimension.
One could use glulams, and a good example is the IKEA slats.

I'm not really following you

 

[duburban]

So... my domino scheme will not work. I would need to angle the dominos in a way that they act like a more tradition joint, tenon in axis of the rail.

The way it is would work but because I want to use a concealed bed bolt, it would be impossible to insert the bed bolt and the dominos at the same time.

I could use 45* shim blocks that I could domino through to create in-axis domino tenons that would jive with the bed-bolts.

Im thinking this may be better for a tradition tenon on the rail, I'd cut the shoulders on a miter saw, route out excess.

 

[Holmz]

Plywood is strong in 2 dimensions, but the force only requires 1 dimension.
One could use glulams, and a good example is the IKEA slats.

http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/00160215/
I'm not really following you

 

[duburban]

new scheme. This will allow the bed to actually be bed bolted together, and apart. Domino XL with a 45* spacer/shim block to allow it to rest on the bevel.

Has anyone gone down this road? Cutting a domino into a bevel?

 

[Holmz]

Is the bevel in there already?
And do you want or need a bevel?

 

[MrGinCT]

when I made a new bed for us last year, I used bed post fasteners from Rockler.  They are 2 pieces sets at each post that are slightly recessed to allow a good tight joint.  They look like 1 piece with 2 slots and 1 piece with 2 hooked metal tenons that go into the slots and get pushed down to lock tight.
quick and easy and very solid.  This would allow you to make the head and foot pieces to be dominoded into the legs and only have to connect the side rails.
I used six 3" slats for support of the box spring and to stop racking.  Worked great.

 

[Holmz]

when I made a new bed for us last year, I used bed post fasteners from Rockler.  They are 2 pieces sets at each post that are slightly recessed to allow a good tight joint.  They look like 1 piece with 2 slots and 1 piece with 2 hooked metal tenons that go into the slots and get pushed down to lock tight.
quick and easy and very solid.  This would allow you to make the head and foot pieces to be dominoded into the legs and only have to connect the side rails.
I used six 3" slats for support of the box spring and to stop racking.  Worked great.

Yeah...
I used those things 25 years ago, and they are pretty darn strong.

 

[duburban]

I thought about those things... I think that the bevel puts them into shear situation they may not be designed for?

Ill order them, BUT, the domino is going to get here first!

 

[duburban]

bed: