A New Rail Square Coming to Market - Teaser for Future Review
- Thread starter peter halle
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Tinkling in the Nextel apartment makes me think that MacGyver has escaped to the office and is tin....
I am looking to an in depth review of the square.
After all, when I started this thread I didn't say that I was going to be the only one to do a review. [big grin]
Have fun and be safe!
Peter
I am looking to an in depth review of the square.
After all, when I started this thread I didn't say that I was going to be the only one to do a review. [big grin]
Have fun and be safe!
Peter
tazprime38
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- 268
I was going to order this brilliant square but am now confused as to whether I should hold out for the parallel square. Am I correct into thinking that the parallel square can be used at front top end of the track (either end) but will be bigger than the current version which can be stored in a future holster due to the triangular shape but cannot be used at either end?
So the next model the parallel square will function as the first one but will do more, is this correct? If yes then should I wait for the second one?
So the next model the parallel square will function as the first one but will do more, is this correct? If yes then should I wait for the second one?
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Standard GRS-16 vs its stablemate GRS-16 PE:tazprime38 said:
both tools will fit into a rectangular footprint of approx 16 x 6 inches. While the Standard tool has the corners clipped into a triangle to fit flat into any Systainer TL, the parallel edge version will only fit into a Systainer 2 or taller standing on edge diagonally. A set of two consisting of Standard and PE version will both fit together in one Systainer TL back-to-back. The PE version will be bulkier but not much heavier. It will perform its function equally well on either end of a guide rail.
The Standard GRS-16 tool will be preferred, we expect, for everyday use - just a more compact size. But when you need to work from the other end, there will be no substitue for the PE version. And for long sheets, having a square at each end will be a plus for accuracy over the longer reach.
Hope this helps.
Klemm
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Kev said:Hey Kev,TSO Products said:Richard,
I figured you'd be out on your deck by now with your new Square
nice to hear from someone who knows first hand what it takes to develop a product and bring it to market. We are firm believers in having the product in production before we take orders. 'nuff said!
Klemm
do we have your permission to TradeMark our tools "RTT" tools - that is pretty descriptive along with a bit of FOG humor
Klemm
LoL ... FSO Products RTT ... Real Time Tools [wink] [big grin]
... it's pretty bad when you order a tool from (let's just call them) company 'W" and a real decision factor is "will I still want it and will I still be around when it finally arrives?" [eek]
TSO Products said:
[member=59331]TSO Products[/member]
Hey i just bought the current model. Love the free freight to australia.
i think the pe vesion would be better so you can referance off either the top or bottom. Im not sure why it has to be bigger it just needs to be rectangle.
Not sure i would use the 2 at the same time.
Do we have a time frame on the next model?
Cheers
Bryan
tazprime38
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[member=61691]TSO_Products[/member]
Any idea on what the pe square will cost when introduced? Can this be pre-ordered?
If the set is ordered ie the current model now and then when pe square is availble , what will be the total price?
@Bryan1983
I think if made smaller the accuracy may be effected as the edge that is aligned with the edge of the track must have a good reasonable contact area to prevent track perpendicular error maybe☺
Any idea on what the pe square will cost when introduced? Can this be pre-ordered?
If the set is ordered ie the current model now and then when pe square is availble , what will be the total price?
@Bryan1983
I think if made smaller the accuracy may be effected as the edge that is aligned with the edge of the track must have a good reasonable contact area to prevent track perpendicular error maybe☺
[member=5519]tazprime38[/member]tazprime38 said:
For me in only trying to cut say a 870mm high back panel on a kitchen.
having used the hkc track and seeing how accurate that is i just need this product to reference off the top because some times I've already scribed the bottom and need to use the longer track. and use ts 55 instead of the HKC -
Bryan
Richard/RMW said:Kev said:TSO Products said:Richard,
I figured you'd be out on your deck by now with your new Square
nice to hear from someone who knows first hand what it takes to develop a product and bring it to market. We are firm believers in having the product in production before we take orders. 'nuff said!
Klemm
LoL ... FSO Products RTT ... Real Time Tools [wink] [big grin]
... it's pretty bad when you order a tool from (let's just call them) company 'W" and a real decision factor is "will I still want it and will I still be around when it finally arrives?" [eek]
Ha! Bad enough my wife will have to figure out what to do with all this stuff when I croak, she'll really be ticked when it keeps showing up for the next 8-10 months...
RMW
Richard/RMW said:
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tazprime38 said:
pricing the GRS-16 PE:
we expect the individual price will be in the same order of magnitude for each of the Square Tools. The price advantage of sets is also still under consideration but it will be helpful to our customers. As we said before, the set price advantage will be extended to early purchasers of the standard GRS-16 until the PE version is available. Then the retroactive set-pricing will no longer be available.
We do not want to go down the road of soliciting or accepting pre-orders for standard products as a matter of differentiating business principle.
Klemm
tazprime38
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I have been thinking that using both squares current one and the pe together top and bottom of track would almost act like a clamp on the piece being cut.
Two problems I see;
1) If the top and bottom edges of piece being cut are not parallel to each other, only one square can sit at 90° to the edge of workpiece. This therefore defeats the purpose of using two squares.
2) You cannot really tighten the second square tight the the top edge as you woul need to be able to move the square down the track after clamping to ensure tight and square positioning. Similar to tightening a normal threaded or bar clamp.
I hope I have made sense
Two problems I see;
1) If the top and bottom edges of piece being cut are not parallel to each other, only one square can sit at 90° to the edge of workpiece. This therefore defeats the purpose of using two squares.
2) You cannot really tighten the second square tight the the top edge as you woul need to be able to move the square down the track after clamping to ensure tight and square positioning. Similar to tightening a normal threaded or bar clamp.
I hope I have made sense
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thank you all for the continuing flow of orders. More GRS-16's are continuing to be machined this week.
After we have actual pre-production examples of the -PE models in August, we can get serious about the best ways to provide protection in Systainers. Systainer 2 does not leave a lot of cushioning room. Better take a look with the real article and see what makes sense.
We have been looking for indications that enough interest would justify producing molded High-Density EPS filler blocks matching the interior shape of the Systainer. (think Tooling and inventory $)
Some of these issues are more a bit more complex than you might imagine. For example - the current GRS-16 ships in an 18x6x6 box and weighs right at 3 lbs. But UPS (and FedEx, too) look at the combination of weight and/or volume to determine cost. Even though our current package weights only 3 lbs, we are being charged for 4 lbs based on the volume occupied by our shipment in the UPS stream of packages.
So you say just make the box smaller so its "dim weight" comes down. No technical problem - just an economic one. Saving labor cost associated with cutting down the taller box manually means the smaller box would have to be a custom box (tooling cost, inventory and warehouse $). To make that work would require visibility on future demand. But we are already talking about change the pack to possibly include the EPS filler block which will definitely have us shipping based on Dimension rather than weight. Well if that's the case, you say, just pack the GRS-16 and the GRS-16PE together as a set - probably cost the same as only one square in the box. Forgot to mention that a bigger box$ is required.
I am writing all this not to complain or justify anything. Instead I hope some of you will find a look behind the scenes informative. After all, you're clearly are more technically interested and understanding audience than 99% of (power-) tool buyers.
We have opted, above all, to be a nimble developer of specialty products which make our customer's work more productive and more enjoyable. This means not settling for the way things are usually done. Let us know anytime you feel we're slacking.
Klemm
After we have actual pre-production examples of the -PE models in August, we can get serious about the best ways to provide protection in Systainers. Systainer 2 does not leave a lot of cushioning room. Better take a look with the real article and see what makes sense.
We have been looking for indications that enough interest would justify producing molded High-Density EPS filler blocks matching the interior shape of the Systainer. (think Tooling and inventory $)
Some of these issues are more a bit more complex than you might imagine. For example - the current GRS-16 ships in an 18x6x6 box and weighs right at 3 lbs. But UPS (and FedEx, too) look at the combination of weight and/or volume to determine cost. Even though our current package weights only 3 lbs, we are being charged for 4 lbs based on the volume occupied by our shipment in the UPS stream of packages.
So you say just make the box smaller so its "dim weight" comes down. No technical problem - just an economic one. Saving labor cost associated with cutting down the taller box manually means the smaller box would have to be a custom box (tooling cost, inventory and warehouse $). To make that work would require visibility on future demand. But we are already talking about change the pack to possibly include the EPS filler block which will definitely have us shipping based on Dimension rather than weight. Well if that's the case, you say, just pack the GRS-16 and the GRS-16PE together as a set - probably cost the same as only one square in the box. Forgot to mention that a bigger box$ is required.
I am writing all this not to complain or justify anything. Instead I hope some of you will find a look behind the scenes informative. After all, you're clearly are more technically interested and understanding audience than 99% of (power-) tool buyers.
We have opted, above all, to be a nimble developer of specialty products which make our customer's work more productive and more enjoyable. This means not settling for the way things are usually done. Let us know anytime you feel we're slacking.
Klemm
SMJoinery
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- Nov 17, 2013
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Hi Klemm
New product looks very good and looks to solve the problem of using the guide rails accurately when out on site away from the workshop and MFT.
I may have missed it but can you confirm shipping costs and ETA to Mainland Uk, Central Scotland. FK postcode?
If it's easier send me over a shipping container full of them and I'll easily sell them here for you and send back the proceeds! [big grin]
Thanks and well done on what appears to be a great product.
Scott
New product looks very good and looks to solve the problem of using the guide rails accurately when out on site away from the workshop and MFT.
I may have missed it but can you confirm shipping costs and ETA to Mainland Uk, Central Scotland. FK postcode?
If it's easier send me over a shipping container full of them and I'll easily sell them here for you and send back the proceeds! [big grin]
Thanks and well done on what appears to be a great product.
Scott
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