Yes, I have used the codeweavers product at work. They've done a very good job of seamlessly incorporating Windows support into Linux. They actually use wine as their base, but have taken it a step further in that they guarantee functionality for a number of Windows apps. Good product.
Any Linux Users Here?
- Thread starter Matthew Schenker
- Start date
That's funny and I don't doubt it. Hopefully it was a long time ago. 
As I recall, Microsoft contracted someone to put up a website for one of their products (just in the last few years) and the contractor used Linux for the server. Of course, Microsoft realized the mistake after it was already widely circulated on the web. I don't recall the product though.
As I recall, Microsoft contracted someone to put up a website for one of their products (just in the last few years) and the contractor used Linux for the server. Of course, Microsoft realized the mistake after it was already widely circulated on the web. I don't recall the product though.
Matthew Schenker
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Woodlunk,
Yes, I read about that in several Linux forums. As the story goes, Microsoft supposedly used Linux to run its servers, because Linux was more secure than Windows NT. As much as it amuses me, I'm not sure if this has ever been substantiated. If anyone has more on this, I'd like to see it.
There are plenty of interesting, and substantiated, stories to go around. I've just been getting into the Linux game in the past couple of months, but I've been catching up on all the amusing stories...
There's Microsoft's claim that all Linux users will have to pay Microsoft because of patent rights. Actually, this issue of Linux supposedly violating Microsoft's patents has been springing up more lately, which was predictable (CLICK HERE). Part of me would love to see Microsoft launch a suit against Linux developers and users. I think Microsoft would not only lose money doing this, but they would help favorably publicize Linux more than anything that has happened before.
Then there's this...Microsoft Linux. Was it meant as a joke, or were they serious? If it was serious, what happened to it?
And then there are articles LIKE THIS, which make me very optimistic about the future of open source and community creativity.
Matthew
Yes, I read about that in several Linux forums. As the story goes, Microsoft supposedly used Linux to run its servers, because Linux was more secure than Windows NT. As much as it amuses me, I'm not sure if this has ever been substantiated. If anyone has more on this, I'd like to see it.
There are plenty of interesting, and substantiated, stories to go around. I've just been getting into the Linux game in the past couple of months, but I've been catching up on all the amusing stories...
There's Microsoft's claim that all Linux users will have to pay Microsoft because of patent rights. Actually, this issue of Linux supposedly violating Microsoft's patents has been springing up more lately, which was predictable (CLICK HERE). Part of me would love to see Microsoft launch a suit against Linux developers and users. I think Microsoft would not only lose money doing this, but they would help favorably publicize Linux more than anything that has happened before.
Then there's this...Microsoft Linux. Was it meant as a joke, or were they serious? If it was serious, what happened to it?
And then there are articles LIKE THIS, which make me very optimistic about the future of open source and community creativity.
Matthew
Just to clarify the one I brought up... I hate to leave it open ended.
I did a search on 'microsoft linux server "urban legend"' ... basically...
Microsoft uses/used Akamai (caching company) to cache some of its pages (windowsupdate) which eases the burden on the Microsoft servers. Akamai uses Linux servers but of course, get all of their information from Microsoft servers. So, it could look like Linux is the server providing the Windows update, but in essence the Linux machine is a slave to the Microsoft server providing the user with popular pages of text but not providing any of the update processing.
... so, kinda sorta. I guess it depends on how you look at it.
I did a search on 'microsoft linux server "urban legend"' ... basically...
Microsoft uses/used Akamai (caching company) to cache some of its pages (windowsupdate) which eases the burden on the Microsoft servers. Akamai uses Linux servers but of course, get all of their information from Microsoft servers. So, it could look like Linux is the server providing the Windows update, but in essence the Linux machine is a slave to the Microsoft server providing the user with popular pages of text but not providing any of the update processing.
... so, kinda sorta. I guess it depends on how you look at it.
Matthew Schenker said:
Uh, I'll just hazard a guess here. Judging by the product description itself ("...released under the provisions of the Gates Private License..."), and other stuff on this page ("Microsoft Monkey Colony on Mars"), I think it's a joke.
Ned
Matthew Schenker
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Ned,
Yes, that article is on a Linux-friendly site, and obviously humorously exaggerates.
However, this subject is real. For example, take a look at THIS ARTICLE in Forbes.
Matt
Yes, that article is on a Linux-friendly site, and obviously humorously exaggerates.
However, this subject is real. For example, take a look at THIS ARTICLE in Forbes.
Matt
Wow, you leave a the group a few months and come back to a whole new forum.
Nice job, by the way.
I realize that I am way late to the party, but I can't help but chime in.
I am an IT Director by day, a web developer by night, and have been at it about 20 years. I've had every flavor of Windows, most flavors of UNIX prior to Linux coming out, had a couple of versions of Linux, and been running Mac OS since way before they went the UNIX route. At the moment, I am running Window 2003 Server, XP, Ubuntu, and OS X on machines at work and/or at home. The best, without a doubt, is OS X.
I am a total geek, but I would much rather spend my time designing and building a baby cradle than figuring out which why a stupid driver won't work and searching far and wide for a solution. I make my living with Microsoft and Ubuntu, but 2 out of 3 computers at home are Mac's. They allow me to get work done instead of troubleshooting. The third machine am running is an old laptop that I carry back and forth to work. When it gives up the ghost, you can bet that I will have a shiny new MacBook Pro.
I, too, think that Microsoft is in for a rude awakening. We just opened a new office in Alexandria, VA and I tried, unsuccessfully to get the boss to go total Macintosh. He worried too much about the initial hardware costs and not about software and support costs, which is why I keep having to log in remotely or jump on an airplane to go fix stuff. I know of one company that has 70 Macintoshes and no IT department. I know of no company that size running Windows or Linux that has no IT department. That should tell you something. We did end up going with OpenOffice instead of MS Office, so we at least got to keep some of the money in our pocket. If I had it to do again, I probably could get the boss to go the Mac route knowing what we know now. The XServe is one sweeeet server! Everything is built in and you don't have to keep buying more licenses. Microsoft, on the other hand, asks you to bend over every time you take a breath.
I still don't think Linux is easy enough for the average user and it can be a real pain in the back side if you are having trouble getting something to work.
I almost never have any problems with OS X. My wife is on it and she is a non-techie and is pretty much self sufficient. The only thing I help her with is web site design, which has nothing to do with the OS.
Well, that's my two cents.
Thanks for doing such a great job on this forum!!!
Danny
Nice job, by the way.
I realize that I am way late to the party, but I can't help but chime in.
I am an IT Director by day, a web developer by night, and have been at it about 20 years. I've had every flavor of Windows, most flavors of UNIX prior to Linux coming out, had a couple of versions of Linux, and been running Mac OS since way before they went the UNIX route. At the moment, I am running Window 2003 Server, XP, Ubuntu, and OS X on machines at work and/or at home. The best, without a doubt, is OS X.
I am a total geek, but I would much rather spend my time designing and building a baby cradle than figuring out which why a stupid driver won't work and searching far and wide for a solution. I make my living with Microsoft and Ubuntu, but 2 out of 3 computers at home are Mac's. They allow me to get work done instead of troubleshooting. The third machine am running is an old laptop that I carry back and forth to work. When it gives up the ghost, you can bet that I will have a shiny new MacBook Pro.
I, too, think that Microsoft is in for a rude awakening. We just opened a new office in Alexandria, VA and I tried, unsuccessfully to get the boss to go total Macintosh. He worried too much about the initial hardware costs and not about software and support costs, which is why I keep having to log in remotely or jump on an airplane to go fix stuff. I know of one company that has 70 Macintoshes and no IT department. I know of no company that size running Windows or Linux that has no IT department. That should tell you something. We did end up going with OpenOffice instead of MS Office, so we at least got to keep some of the money in our pocket. If I had it to do again, I probably could get the boss to go the Mac route knowing what we know now. The XServe is one sweeeet server! Everything is built in and you don't have to keep buying more licenses. Microsoft, on the other hand, asks you to bend over every time you take a breath.
I still don't think Linux is easy enough for the average user and it can be a real pain in the back side if you are having trouble getting something to work.
I almost never have any problems with OS X. My wife is on it and she is a non-techie and is pretty much self sufficient. The only thing I help her with is web site design, which has nothing to do with the OS.
Well, that's my two cents.
Thanks for doing such a great job on this forum!!!
Danny
Matthew Schenker
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Danny,
At first, I just wanted to run away from Vista. Mac seemed like the obvious choice, and the Mac OS seemed pretty smooth and clean. But I could not get beyond my discomfort with the physical design of Mac laptops -- I find the keyboards very clumsy. And who's brilliant idea was it to not have a "delete" key? Huh?
Then I learned that Mac OS is actually a derivative of Unix (BSD to be exact), which got me wondering about alternatives. That led me to Linux, and before I knew it I was easily experimenting with various Linux distributions and asking questions in Linux discussion boards. It didn't take me long to see the benefits of Linux, as compared with Vista and Mac OS. If I want to, I can customize my Linux system to behave just like a Mac (except, of course, for some proprietary software that Apple isn't going to release to the Linux community). I have in fact installed a few elements that borrow from Mac. Or is it that Mac borrows from Linux?
At first, Linux appeared to be difficult to use. But what I learned is that Linux is actually much, much easier to use. Everything is essentially a file and all your information is placed into a simple directory structure. Repositories contain all the available software for your computer, and even keep track of any updates available for what's installed on your computer. By contrast, with Vista, if you want to locate all the pieces that are connected to an application you installed -- good luck figuring it all out. And if you need help understanding anything in Vista...well. If you want to keep track of all the updates to applications loaded into Windows, you have to track each application individually. Then, of course, there is the fact that upgrades to anything in Windows costs you a lot of money, often for untested, memory-hogging, and flimsily designed applications.
Linux certainly is not perfect. I have had trouble getting wireless file sharing working between my desktop and laptop. But I have hope that the next couple of versions of various Linux distributions is going to take care of this. Regarding drivers: this is becoming less of an issue. Some of the major hardware manufacturers are starting to release drivers that work in Linux, and they are getting loaded into the repositories I mentioned above. A few manufacturers, like HP, have excellent Linux support.
And remember, a major computer seller -- Dell -- now produces laptops with Ubuntu Linux installed. From what I hear, it got a very warm reception. This, to me, is a great sign.
Finally, the Linux community is excellent. You have friendly forums (like this one) where dedicated geeks are willing to walk you through any problems you might have. I've posted issues on these forums, and received several great answers within minutes. Except for wireless file sharing, I have resolved every question in less than a day. By contrast, there were issues with Windows I never solved and just lived with them because I had no idea where to get assistance.
Every day I use Linux, I am more satisfied with it.
Matthew
At first, I just wanted to run away from Vista. Mac seemed like the obvious choice, and the Mac OS seemed pretty smooth and clean. But I could not get beyond my discomfort with the physical design of Mac laptops -- I find the keyboards very clumsy. And who's brilliant idea was it to not have a "delete" key? Huh?
Then I learned that Mac OS is actually a derivative of Unix (BSD to be exact), which got me wondering about alternatives. That led me to Linux, and before I knew it I was easily experimenting with various Linux distributions and asking questions in Linux discussion boards. It didn't take me long to see the benefits of Linux, as compared with Vista and Mac OS. If I want to, I can customize my Linux system to behave just like a Mac (except, of course, for some proprietary software that Apple isn't going to release to the Linux community). I have in fact installed a few elements that borrow from Mac. Or is it that Mac borrows from Linux?
At first, Linux appeared to be difficult to use. But what I learned is that Linux is actually much, much easier to use. Everything is essentially a file and all your information is placed into a simple directory structure. Repositories contain all the available software for your computer, and even keep track of any updates available for what's installed on your computer. By contrast, with Vista, if you want to locate all the pieces that are connected to an application you installed -- good luck figuring it all out. And if you need help understanding anything in Vista...well. If you want to keep track of all the updates to applications loaded into Windows, you have to track each application individually. Then, of course, there is the fact that upgrades to anything in Windows costs you a lot of money, often for untested, memory-hogging, and flimsily designed applications.
Linux certainly is not perfect. I have had trouble getting wireless file sharing working between my desktop and laptop. But I have hope that the next couple of versions of various Linux distributions is going to take care of this. Regarding drivers: this is becoming less of an issue. Some of the major hardware manufacturers are starting to release drivers that work in Linux, and they are getting loaded into the repositories I mentioned above. A few manufacturers, like HP, have excellent Linux support.
And remember, a major computer seller -- Dell -- now produces laptops with Ubuntu Linux installed. From what I hear, it got a very warm reception. This, to me, is a great sign.
Finally, the Linux community is excellent. You have friendly forums (like this one) where dedicated geeks are willing to walk you through any problems you might have. I've posted issues on these forums, and received several great answers within minutes. Except for wireless file sharing, I have resolved every question in less than a day. By contrast, there were issues with Windows I never solved and just lived with them because I had no idea where to get assistance.
Every day I use Linux, I am more satisfied with it.
Matthew
Matthew Schenker said:
That's such a good point. My 1st PC was an Apple II. It was a very open system. Unfortunately, Apple has changed so much since then. I kind of see Apple as the Microsoft of the PC hardware world... "control freak" is the phrase that comes to mind. I would hate to see Apple controlling the PC market, just as I hate to see Microsoft controlling the PC software market. Yes, Apple OS may be more "user friendly", but there is a big dependency on Apple when someone does need support. I've heard stories about Apple customer experiences with the geniuses at the Genius Bar. I'm not intending to disparage all the Apple owners that love their Mac's. I'm just voicing my opinions about Apple's business model.
Matthew Schenker
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Eli,
Maybe this is something new? All the MacBook keyboards on current models lack a "delete" key.
To be more specific, Macs lack a "forward delete" key. On PC keyboards, there is a "delete" key, which deletes things in front of the cursor, and a "backspace" key, which deleted things behind the cursor. Macs have the "backlspace" key. But to delete things in front of the cursor, you need to do a FN+Backspace combination. Strange...
The way I took care of that was to wipe out Windows and install Linux! It's still a PC based on its hardware, but its been given a brain transplant.
Matthew
Maybe this is something new? All the MacBook keyboards on current models lack a "delete" key.
To be more specific, Macs lack a "forward delete" key. On PC keyboards, there is a "delete" key, which deletes things in front of the cursor, and a "backspace" key, which deleted things behind the cursor. Macs have the "backlspace" key. But to delete things in front of the cursor, you need to do a FN+Backspace combination. Strange...
Eli said:
The way I took care of that was to wipe out Windows and install Linux! It's still a PC based on its hardware, but its been given a brain transplant.
Matthew
John Stegall
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For some unknown reason I cannot get the downloaded Ubuntu to burn a disk...I keep getting a message that the system cannot locate the disk that I am trying to burn from. I really want to run Linux from a disk before removing Windows. I tried downloading using Mozilla and IE7. I still get the same message. I guess I will have to wait the six or seven weeks it takes to get a free disk.
john
john
John--
OSDisc.com sells ready-made open-source disks. Ubuntu 7.10 is USD 1.95 plus a shipping charge. I got it and Ubuntu 7.10 Server for something like 7 bucks. They ship pretty quickly.
They've got lots of other distros available as well.
Sometimes free costs too much.
Ned
OSDisc.com sells ready-made open-source disks. Ubuntu 7.10 is USD 1.95 plus a shipping charge. I got it and Ubuntu 7.10 Server for something like 7 bucks. They ship pretty quickly.
They've got lots of other distros available as well.
Sometimes free costs too much.
Ned
John Stegall
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Thanks Ned. Free does sometimes cost too much.
I just ordered from the source you supplied and added another disk. $2.95 for shipping works for me!
I just ordered from the source you supplied and added another disk. $2.95 for shipping works for me!
Matthew Schenker
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John Stegall said:
You don't have to buy the CD. There are two steps involved in doing it yourself. They are very simple:
- Download the ISO file from here -- Ubuntu Download Site
- Burn the ISO file to a CD using a CD burning tool
Downloading the ISO takes a little while, as this is a big file. It's an operating system after all!
To burn the ISO file to a CD, use any program that will burn "images" to CD. I used Infra Recorder, which has an easy option for burning images. To get Infra Recorder, CLICK HERE.
After you burn the ISO to a CD, you are ready to test drive Ubuntu. Just put the CD in your CD-ROM drive and restart your computer. That starts a "live" session of Ubuntu. This means that you are running Ubuntu from your CD-ROM drive, and you can see all its features. But it's not actually installed on your computer, so it does not affect anything in your current operating system.
After doing the test drive, you can install Ubuntu. But we can come back to that later!
Test out what I said above and tell us how it goes.
Matthew
John Stegall
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Matthew, the time involved wasn't the problem. For some reason it will not let me burn the CD. I think it is something within my system. I have enough memory, I am hooked up to the net via cable etc. It just does not allow me to burn a CD. I downloaded it from the sites you had already listed as well as others that I found and I still get the same message.
I am not at home so I cannot tell you the exact message but it kept asking for a disk. Anyway, for the small price of under $7 including shipping including a second cd that I need, it was worth it. I may try the link you supplied above tonight to see if I can get a cd burned. I even downloaded the recommended burning software but still no luck.
Thanks,
john
I am not at home so I cannot tell you the exact message but it kept asking for a disk. Anyway, for the small price of under $7 including shipping including a second cd that I need, it was worth it. I may try the link you supplied above tonight to see if I can get a cd burned. I even downloaded the recommended burning software but still no luck.
Thanks,
john
Matthew Schenker
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John,
My guess is that it has something to do with your system, not the Ubuntu CD or software.
Well, when you get the CD, make sure to report back on how it goes.
Matthew
My guess is that it has something to do with your system, not the Ubuntu CD or software.
Well, when you get the CD, make sure to report back on how it goes.
Matthew
John Stegall
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I suspect something is wron too. I will report back because I will have lots of ?s. I tried out a couple of Linux forums and immediately ran into posters trashing each others ideas. A surefire deal breaker for me.
