Bead board panels, crown, & base without a miter saw.

[iamnothim]

I probably should have removed the nose/sill before starting, then put in a whole new piece.  But I didn't.  I elected to sister on a small piece with a return.
Hey!  It's paint grade.

I picked up some Saroyan 5527 yesterday...... Too big.  Dang.
I'll get some 5585 in a few days.

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[iamnothim]

I have all the panel trim and inserts cut.  Only five more to assemble.  When those are complete I'll fit them in the frames, square them up and nail/glue them in.  I thought I'd share a technique for the panel trim I learned from Gary Katz DVD "Wainscoting and Paneling".  It worked really worked for me.

All the panel trim is pre-cut and assembled using Fastcap 2P-10 Glue and Activator.  2P-10 stands for 2 parts, 10 seconds.  The stuff lives up to the name.  It's a thick cryano-acrilate glue for wood. The second product is Dave Collins (Collins Tool Co.) "Miter Clamps".  These are amazing. Spread them open with the tool and the clamp digs into the material.

Used together you get very tight joints.  If I didn't watch this video I would have put the trim on piece by piece.  This method saves time and greatly increases accuracy.  Once the frame is made I glue the panel to the back of the frame and tack it down with 23 ga. pin nails.

After today it's crown molding and paint using  General Finishes "Snow White" milk paint then Pre-Cat Urethane top coat.

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[iamnothim]

Question.

Do I back cut this cap?

I have a funny feeling it should have had a self return.  [crying]

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[iamnothim]

All the panels are made!  [smile]

Just need to square them, back them with liquid nails, and nail the perimeter.

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[tiralie]

Do I back cut this cap?

You can trim at 45 degrees away from the case where it is higher than the case.

I have a funny feeling it should have had a self return.

Should have a back band or a thicker case.

 

[iamnothim]

Thanks Tim.
I looked at the cap again and a return would not have looked right.  I will shave back the portions that are proud of the case.

About 12yrs. ago I had my dining room paneled professionally.  Ever since I wanted to give it a try….at least a simple version of a paneled room.

If you are a professional working in the Los Angeles area, the studios  (Disney, Warner, Paramount) wood/staff shops sell moldings to the trade.  At least they did 12 years ago.

They have an amazing collection of profiles for building sets.  Since they need to keep the shops busy while they aren’t filming they sold moldings to pros.  The material in the dining room is from Paramount Pictures and the crown moldings are from Disney.  There are 6 or 7 profiles that make up the kitchen crown.

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[wow]

Holy profiles, batman! I have NEVER seen that many profiles stacked up in one place! Also, the quality of the work looks amazing!

And I'm willing to bet that they didn't use a Kapex, either...

 

[iamnothim]

Holy profiles, batman! I have NEVER seen that many profiles stacked up in one place! Also, the quality of the work looks amazing!

And I'm willing to bet that they didn't use a Kapex, either...

This shot will give that corner picture some context.  Also the crown stack in my family room (Disney profiles).  I could never approach that level of workmanship.

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[tiralie]

Thanks Tim.
I looked at the cap again and a return would not have looked right. 

They can but not in this case.

About 12yrs. ago I had my dining room paneled professionally.  Ever since I wanted to give it a try….at least a simple version of a paneled room.

I saw these on the JLC finish carpentry board. They are impressive.
You have a very nice house with some exceptional design and craftsmanship there.
Tim

 

[iamnothim]

All the crown is up.  Paint grade, it's a "B".  Stain grade it's a "Fail".

I used the Fastcap "Third Hand" set to put it up solo and it worked great.  I'll take a pic because I still have to fasten it between the corners.

I tried and tried and tried to cope the joints with the Collins Foot and my Carvex.  I could not get the hang of it.  I hand coped my laundry room crown but it was a solid triangle.  I also hand coped the cap but it was a cut down version.  Anyway everything is mitered. [sad]

 

[iamnothim]

I saw these on the JLC finish carpentry board. They are impressive.
You have a very nice house with some exceptional design and craftsmanship there.
Tim

Yup.  I didn't realize the JLC site was for the trade only.  After all it's posted in Large Letters right up front.  I figured LA craftsmen might want to know about the studio moldings, so I posted and left.  JLC is great resource site.

I was very fortunate to be able to afford a design / build that brought what was in my mind's eye to reality.  I took the house down to the studs in and out.  A great restoration architect was also invaluable.  Now I'm trying to finish rooms that we couldn't do when the majority of the remodel was done.  After my daughter's room comes refinishing her dresser, then hall linen cabinets, then vanities for the upstairs bath and guest powder.  Down the road I'd like to try plagiarizing a Jory Brigham design for my cave.

Tim !  (Or anyone else)... big question I have is how to finding the joists for nailing the crown to the ceiling.  I can find the studs but my stud finder doesn't seem to find the joists and even when it does I'm not sure they are parallel to the studs.  Will there be a ceiling joist on top of a stud?

I attached a couple pics of the Third Hand in action.  They're great for snugging the crown up before nailing.
This'll be my last post until the painting is done.....

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[9Fingers]

I've installed a little crown in my home and I came across and idea that has worked well for me. Cut a piece to go behind the crown the length of the wall. I will almost fill the space but leave about 3/16 or a little more betwen the back of the crown and the filler strip. You can screw the strip to the studs in the wall and now you have a solid piece that you can nail into anywhere along the crown and pull it tight the the filler piece behind it. The gap allows you to rotate the crown to fit a little tighter to the ceiling or in the corners. Hope that helps.
Looking forward to seeing the final pics with everything painted. Nice work so far!

 

[bkharman]

All the crown is up.  Paint grade, it's a "B".  Stain grade it's a "Fail".

I used the Fastcap "Third Hand" set to put it up solo and it worked great.  I'll take a pic because I still have to fasten it between the corners.

I tried and tried and tried to cope the joints with the Collins Foot and my Carvex.  I could not get the hang of it.  I hand coped my laundry room crown but it was a solid triangle.  I also hand coped the cap but it was a cut down version.  Anyway everything is mitered. [sad]

The Collins foot takes a bit to get used too...  Make sure you have a small blade, slow the speed down and take light cuts at first. Watch Katz and others do it with ease is nice to watch but frustrating to replicate.

Love watching your progress here.

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[tiralie]

.... how to finding the joists for nailing the crown to the ceiling.  I can find the studs but my stud finder doesn't seem to find the joists and even when it does I'm not sure they are parallel to the studs. 

Well there's several ways to do it. As 'ninefingers' has said, put up a backer strip (the better way), or cross nail. Cross nailing is two nails shot at the same point at 45 degree angles to each other. A backer strip takes longer but prevents the crown from moving away from the ceiling or wall. Or just use lots of PL and cross nail it to the wall and the ceiling.

Will there be a ceiling joist on top of a stud?

No way to tell, unless you go up in the attic and figure it out. I don't know how your house was constructed.
Tim

 

[tiralie]

The Collins foot takes a bit to get used too... 

Agreed. You really need to build and use the crown jig to hold the crown while you cope. It really helps a lot.
Tim

 

[iamnothim]

“9” Great advice.  A backer.  Who woulda thunk?  Tim,  I’ll look to see if I need to cross nail any sections.  That’s one of those things I know to do it but didn't think about it at the time.  Getting old sucks.

A couple more pre-paint updates.

I pre-cut all the base and… drum roll… and coped it.  I’m getting better but a miter would probably have been tighter.  It’s something I want to get better at, so I’m sticking with it.  I built a crown fence for the miter saw and used that to cope the crown in position.  I still think my issues were with cutting at the correct angle.  Carvex speed....  The directions said fast.  Then I watched the Collins video again and... his saw was slow.  So when coping the base I cranked the speed down a lot and had better results.  I'm using the blades Dave sent with the foot.  I thought that was nice of him to include them.

I’m not sure what I’ll do with the floors (carpet or hardwood) so I attached the base with a few 23g a pins.  I’ll pull the base, paint it and pin it back in until I put down the final floor.  If ya’ll don’t have a 23ga. pin gun, get one.  I’t amazing how tight the pins grip the piece.  You can’t pull them out you can only clip them.  I bought the PC from HD and use PC pins.  Another tool that helped a lot is a Leica laser ruler.  What a time saver.

I’m off to the hardwood store to get a small piece of bull nose jam.  I hope to buy the correct size this time. [smile]

I’m thinking of bi-fold doors for the closet but I’m not totally in love with any one profile.  There is one that’s close to the panel molding but I’m afraid it might be too busy  ("HL" or "HM" profile).  What do ya’ll think of using shaker?  Bi-Fold Door profiles.  Bi-Fold door styles

Many thanks

Luke
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[iamnothim]

One more thing...

Feel free to critique any part of the job.
It's all good.
That's why I start a thread like this.

 

[tiralie]

I built a crown fence for the miter saw and used that to cope the crown in position.  I still think my issues were with cutting at the correct angle. 

Miter saws on a stand will work but I think they are a bit too high, you really need to be able to get a good view up close and from directly over the top of the crown while coping with the foot.

I’m not sure what I’ll do with the floors (carpet or hardwood) so I attached the base with a few 23g a pins.

Ya, that's not good. You need to know before you start.

I’m thinking of bi-fold doors for the closet but I’m not totally in love with any one profile.  There is one that’s close to the panel molding but I’m afraid it might be too busy  ("HL" or "HM" profile). 

I hate bi-fold doors, the hardware is crappy and the doors never give you a good reveal. I prefer doors on hinges.

What do ya’ll think of using shaker?

Shaker is nice, but that is not the design in that room.  Adding a shaker profile will make the doors look out of place in that room. Use a plain flat door, and apply your panel molding.
Tim

 

[iamnothim]

I’m not sure what I’ll do with the floors (carpet or hardwood) so I attached the base with a few 23g a pins.
[quote author=Tim R.]
Ya, that's not good. You need to know before you start.

In a perfect world.  It's an 1800 sq ft decision for the entire second floor.  Now that I have the base fit, I can pull it off and paint both the base and behind the base so I can adjust the height when I put the floor in.

I’m thinking of bi-fold doors for the closet but I’m not totally in love with any one profile.  There is one that’s close to the panel molding but I’m afraid it might be too busy  ("HL" or "HM" profile). 
[quote author=Tim R.]
I hate bi-fold doors, the hardware is crappy and the doors never give you a good reveal. I prefer doors on hinges.
[/quote]
Agreed.  Hinge doors are superior.  It's a small bedroom with a large bed so I need something compact and I don't like sliders.  Here's what I'd like to do if it's feasible.  Have four door panels.  Instead of bi-fold I'd like to swing the center panel Out on top of the wing panels so they expose a mirror on the inside of the door.  I think I just need heavy duty hinges and some stops.  Will this work?

Correct answer on "shaker"  It was a dumb idea.  I may be able to get recessed panels made to accommodate the "Z" panel molding.  Then there's always making them.  Thinking out loud...  I don't think my OF 1400 will support a cope and stick set large enough... So I'd just use dominos.    What dimension material would you suggest if I choose to make them?

Door Illustration....

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[iamnothim]

On another front...
A few posts back I wrote that I picked up window nose trim that was too big.  I was only going to sister on the ends.
Today I made the 40 mile round trip and picked up the smaller profile.  The one I didn't measure but I was certain it was going to fit.
Fail.  The profile was all wrong.

This afternoon I did what I should have done in the first place.  I took my Carvex to the sill and flushed it off... sort of  (I will not show a view of the right side of the sill).  Naturally the piece I bought was too short but I cut the self return and I'm pleased with the result.  Tomorrow AM.  40 miles.

Also found a nice oak vent cover.  It fits perfectly !!!!  I don't have to cut into the crown !!!
Lose one.  Win one.

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