BMW has patented a new screw head designed to prevent non-dealer repairs

[Packard]

Packard...Packard...Packard...do you still believe in the Easter Bunny? that particular "strong stance" will only last as long as until it doesn't. Does that sound familiar?

I did not want to sound prejudiced against any ethnicity. Hence, the quick retraction. (Plus, Google says it’s true, so it must be.)

 

[Vondawg]

I think they look cool….that being said I might not have felt the same way in the 80s&90s when I was riding BMW motorcycles
And couldn’t of work on something

 

[Crazyraceguy]

John Deere does not release any information on the engine control systems for their equipment. The dealers are the only ones with access to the information necessary to make repairs.

Tom

They are one of the leading reasons that the "Right to repair" litigation is going on right now. For them, it's not really about tools, it's the software and tech data. The big debate seems to be whether you actually "own" the thing you buy anymore. Pretty much along the lines of the subscription model, that seems so common.

The one that really bugged me was with the auto market. When certain, "super popular" models were really scarce, they would require the buyer to sign an agreement, that you could not sell it, for a period of time.
Chevrolet dealers did it with C-8 Corvettes.
Ford did it with Broncos.

Do you really own it, if you can't sell it? Forcing/requiring compliance with terms/conditions seems usury, and I would question the legality. "For Sale" with restrictions like that doesn't sound right.
The only one I could reasonably see is quantity. Ticket sellers/concert venues have done that for decades. That was about re-selling too. There is/was all kinds of legal wrangling about that, depending on location.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I do have to admit that after helping him work on some of the vehicles, the Mercedes cars are exceptionally well built almost to a fault. From a mechanical engineers perspective...the Mercedes are truly works of wonder but you have to ask...after the initial purchase, who can afford to maintain them for any amount of time? Thus the reason my neighbor picks them up on the cheap and revitalizes them himself.

I ran into that a few times back in my body shop days. The MB stuff was way over the top. Many things were not available as individual parts. They had to be purchased as assemblies.
I worked on an S 500 that had been rolled. There was some damage to part of the wiring harness, connecting to the moon roof. It required replacement of the entire cabin harness. One of the motors was also damaged, none was available. The only way to get it was to replace the entire track structure/assembly. That involved removing the headliner. Fortunately (or not?) the windshield was also broken, otherwise it's impossible to remove it.

 

[leakyroof]

I ran into that a few times back in my body shop days. The MB stuff was way over the top. Many things were not available as individual parts. They had to be purchased as assemblies.
I worked on an S 500 that had been rolled. There was some damage to part of the wiring harness, connecting to the moon roof. It required replacement of the entire cabin harness. One of the motors was also damaged, none was available. The only way to get it was to replace the entire track structure/assembly. That involved removing the headliner. Fortunately (or not?) the windshield was also broken, otherwise it's impossible to remove it.

Still the same currently for Benz. Occasionally they have repair kits, but more often it’s a whole assembly or nothing.
Class example, the newer wiper arms have a plastic sliding lock on their ends to secure the wiper blade, if the plastic slider fails, falls off, you buy a new whole arm which comes with the lock- only way to get it.

Prices can be sky high - recently quoted 4 stock rims and tires on a 2023 S Class that the Customer had bought used , it had oversized aftermarket rims on it. Which were rubbing on the upright spindles of the front suspension due to the width and offset being wrong for the vehicle. Someone had even ground off some metal from tge spindles to help clear the inner bead of the rims .
Only two hours labor for the quote, but parts and labor came to a quote of almost $12000.
Yes, 12 grand. Needless to say, the Customer declined.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Still the same currently for Benz. Occasionally they have repair kits, but more often it’s a whole assembly or nothing.
Class example, the newer wiper arms have a plastic sliding lock on their ends to secure the wiper blade, if the plastic slider fails, falls off, you buy a new whole arm which comes with the lock- only way to get it.

Prices can be sky high - recently quoted 4 stock rims and tires on a 2023 S Class that the Customer had bought used , it had oversized aftermarket rims on it. Which were rubbing on the upright spindles of the front suspension due to the width and offset being wrong for the vehicle. Someone had even ground off some metal from tge spindles to help clear the inner bead of the rims .
Only two hours labor for the quote, but parts and labor came to a quote of almost $12000.
Yes, 12 grand. Needless to say, the Customer declined.

The was another one, a few years later, it was an S 600 V12. That one had front end damage. The cast aluminum oil pan was cracked, a piece missing. We sent it to the local dealer, for that type of repair. it came back with a bill for 7K! This was in 97-98? We finished the bodywork and paint and moved it along, but a charge like that, where there was virtually no visible change, was a bit shocking.

 

[Packard]

You buy a new S-Class Mercedes and it includes 4 wheel steering. But only if you pay a subscription. The mechanicals are there, but Mercedes has to enable it.

So when you advertise the car for sale 4 years later, can you write “includes 4 wheel steering”?

I think we can blame Sirius radio for this whole concept.

I find the whole subscription business model offensive. I understand it. I don’t like it.

 

[Mini Me]

I have family connections in dealerships for multiple brands and the Chinese have not endorsed subscriptions for features in their cars so far. I find the manic right to repair in the US a bit surprising as without a lot of specialised training to use the equipment having the access is useless. My son has had 2 years of training to reach a certifiable level of competency to work on Volvo & Polestar vehicles and that is just to get understanding of the tech stuff and then being able to apply that knowledge in actual diagnosis.

He is one of the top EV techs in Oz and even his knowledge falls short and he like every tech fixing this stuff require specialised back up from manufacturer help desks so I can't see the average owner even with the access and equipment being able to fix anything. His next block of training will be LIDAR systems when Volvo & Polestar sort out how to get out of the mess they have created with that little monster they have created.

Right to repair......go for it as in practise having the right does not automatically mean you can do it. I doubt the RtR supporters have given much thought to the knowledge needed, how to gain the knowledge and the time needed to do the training. Even the trained guys have huge problems and need specialised manufacturer help and at times some vehicles take months to diagnose and repair and I do mean that literally. There are going to be a lot of disappointed proponents of RtR when the are given the access they are fighting for. You have to have hands on practical training and not just read a workshop owners repair manual.

 

[leakyroof]

I have family connections in dealerships for multiple brands and the Chinese have not endorsed subscriptions for features in their cars so far. I find the manic right to repair in the US a bit surprising as without a lot of specialised training to use the equipment having the access is useless. My son has had 2 years of training to reach a certifiable level of competency to work on Volvo & Polestar vehicles and that is just to get understanding of the tech stuff and then being able to apply that knowledge in actual diagnosis.

He is one of the top EV techs in Oz and even his knowledge falls short and he like every tech fixing this stuff require specialised back up from manufacturer help desks so I can't see the average owner even with the access and equipment being able to fix anything. His next block of training will be LIDAR systems when Volvo & Polestar sort out how to get out of the mess they have created with that little monster they have created.

Right to repair......go for it as in practise having the right does not automatically mean you can do it. I doubt the RtR supporters have given much thought to the knowledge needed, how to gain the knowledge and the time needed to do the training. Even the trained guys have huge problems and need specialised manufacturer help and at times some vehicles take months to diagnose and repair and I do mean that literally. There are going to be a lot of disappointed proponents of RtR when the are given the access they are fighting for. You have to have hands on practical training and not just read a workshop owners repair manual.

Yes- Had a Jaguar that took over a year to repair, but not due to me…. I actually correctly suggested what was wrong with the vehicle about 2 weeks into my time with it after taking over from another technician.
Corporate USA and UK kept insisting the issue was something else entirely- even made us replace a wiring harness that encompassed 1/3 of the vehicle, which as I predicted, did nothing to solve the issue.

They never apologized for the waste of time and money after a year went by and I , and another Tech within the Company back at the USA headquarters, figured out what I’d been right about all along .
To top it off, everyone had been following a wiring diagram that had a fatal error in the diagram for the starter circuit, it just wasn’t right. So, everyone was working wrong from the start- UK never apologized for the diagram error either.

 

[Cheese]

Yes- Had a Jaguar that took over a year to repair, but not due to me…. I actually correctly suggested what was wrong with the vehicle about 2 weeks into my time with it after taking over from another technician.
Corporate USA and UK kept insisting the issue was something else entirely- even made us replace a wiring harness that encompassed 1/3 of the vehicle, which as I predicted, did nothing to solve the issue.

They never apologized for the waste of time and money after a year went by and I , and another Tech within the Company back at the USA headquarters, figured out what I’d been right about all along .
To top it off, everyone had been following a wiring diagram that had a fatal error in the diagram for the starter circuit, it just wasn’t right. So, everyone was working wrong from the start- UK never apologized for the diagram error either.

Just curious, was the Jag made in the UK or in India?

 

[leakyroof]

Just curious, was the Jag made in the UK or in India?

UK. Sedan… Started as a comedy of errors on the part of the Customer letting simple things get away from them, then led to the car passing through one independent shop , two dealers , of which we were the 2nd ones.
And went to hell in a hand basket once Corporate got involved with Technical Hot Line and engineers back at Mahwah NJ and the UK.
Absolute shambles of an operation- so embarrassing

 

[luvmytoolz]

Absolute shambles of an operation- so embarrassing

Not as embarrassing as the new Jag redesign and marketing launch I'll bet though!

Pretty impressive to tank a century old company and drop 97% of your revenue!

 

[Cheese]

UK. Sedan…

Ugh...that's really ugly. also how unfortunate from a manufacturers stand point.

 

[smorgasbord]

Story is getting out:

 

[Cheese]

Wow...this guy sounds like he's a personal friend of Candice Owens...conspiracy monger anyone?

 

[onocoffee]

Wow...this guy sounds like he's a personal friend of Candice Owens...conspiracy monger anyone?

I think Rossman is one of the good ones out there. He's constantly calling out organizations and corporations on their tech shenanigans. He's also very vocal about Right To Repair. He's a New Yorker so that should explain part of his personality.

 

[luvmytoolz]

I think Rossman is one of the good ones out there. He's constantly calling out organizations and corporations on their tech shenanigans. He's also very vocal about Right To Repair. He's a New Yorker so that should explain part of his personality.

Plus the fact he took Apple and their underhanded tactics on and won! He does some really great break downs on hardware, and he actually supports small reviewers from being silenced by companies.

 

[Packard]

Story is getting out:

The guy makes perfect sense.

What does not make sense is why he is talking so fast.

Do note that at the end of the video he talks to his cat at a more measured pace.

When I was in journalism school, I had a girlfriend who was in broadcast, and she had trouble delivering the voice of the script.

I identified the problem and pointed out that she, like most people, can read much faster than they can speak. She had to learn to read aloud at a slower pace than she could read to herself.

I had her record an announcer that she liked, then transcribe it. Then I had her read the transcription aloud with the final word at the exact time that the original announcer did. So if it too 2 minutes for the announcer to read the script, then her reading of the script had to take 2 minutes also.

Once she got that down pat, I had her read the script aloud for 15 seconds. She would read that 15 seconds aloud to make sure she was on pace.

This guy should do the same. He earns money for these videos, he should aspire to a professional level delivery.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

The guy makes perfect sense.

What does not make sense is why he is talking so fast.

Do note that at the end of the video he talks to his cat at a more measured pace.

When I was in journalism school, I had a girlfriend who was in broadcast, and she had trouble delivering the voice of the script.

I identified the problem and pointed out that she, like most people, can read much faster than they can speak. She had to learn to read aloud at a slower pace than she could read to herself.

I had her record an announcer that she liked, then transcribe it. Then I had her read the transcription aloud with the final word at the exact time that the original announcer did. So if it too 2 minutes for the announcer to read the script, then her reading of the script had to take 2 minutes also.

Once she got that down pat, I had her read the script aloud for 15 seconds. She would read that 15 seconds aloud to make sure she was on pace.

This guy should do the same. He earns money for these videos, he should aspire to a professional level delivery.

For the most part, I bet he thinks he is talking to people just like himself, may not be too far off. Though once your audience gets that big, it is bound to change.