Centrotech Set Over the Top Pricing

[snaslund]

I can't believe they finally got there but Festool finally came up with a price that I just cannot accept.  That Centrotech Sets pricing is just completely outrageous.  I have no idea how anyone can be expected to spend $425 on a handful or drill bits and drivers.  The other completely crazy thing is that the Imperial Drill Bit set goes for $125 and includes SEVEN DRILL BITS AND A COUNTERSINK.  That comes to more than $15 PER BIT!?!?!

I love the CXS and my other Festools but there is absolutely no way that I can buy into the Centrotech bandwagon at that pricing.  Lets talk cost benefit.  My understanding is that Centrotechs major advantage over the standard hex system is more precision leading to less runout.  Even if I were to buy into that (I am not so sure the 1/4 hex system could not be precisely machined), I have never had that much an issue with runout on drill bits to justify that cost increase.  I also think that for that kind of pricing there ought to be a lot more drill sizes included.  I would also like to see more drill/countersink combo bits or Vix type bits in a set of this cost.  At least in the cabinetry field I am working in, those are the most commonly used items.  Quick, when was the last time someone needed a hook driver?

Just so you guy know I am not just a cheapskate, I have bought into the TS75, CT33, Domino Set, RO150, RO90, ETS125, First Aid Kit.  This one just went way to far in price/performance.  Comments anyone?

Steven Naslund
Chicago IL

 

[Alan m]

welcome to the fog.

i have to agree with you. i think the centrotec set are  vastly over priced. you could make up a set of your own for a fraction of the price

 

[fifo28]

I agree

I have a lot of Festool's and love them all.  The drills were actually hard for me to swallow but once I broke down and used the drill a bit - I got it.  I can't get over the Set.  I actually purchased a number of individual drill bits and a few other items. I am very happy and came no where near the price of the Set.

 

[ajones]

Hi Steve

good first post [scared] no foreplay with you....then [eek] [big grin] [big grin]

 

[Vindingo]

welcome to the fog.

i have to agree with you. i think the centrotec set are  vastly over priced. you could make up a set of your own for a fraction of the price

This is what I have done since I picked up my T15.  I wanted the centrotec set, but couldn't really justify it.

I purchased a metric (3mm-10mm) centrotec brad point set off ebay for $60, got the depth stop countersink, some long centrotec torx bits, and the BHS 65 bit holder.  I think I'm into the centrotec system for $180 or so.  The depth stop countersink was a bit of a luxury at $64, but it is really really nice.  

IMO, the locking bit holder is the only piece that is a MUST have.  I think Wera bits are better than Festool bits, and they fit in the locking holder.    

The set would be nice, but I think I picked up most of what I would really need.  It also all fits into an old sys with the storage attic.        

 

[AlexThePalex]

Lets talk cost benefit.  My understanding is that Centrotechs major advantage over the standard hex system is more precision leading to less runout.  Even if I were to buy into that (I am not so sure the 1/4 hex system could not be precisely machined), I have never had that much an issue with runout on drill bits to justify that cost increase.  

Dunno where you got that impression. Centrotec isn't more precise than any other quality bit.

What makes the real difference is the quick change system. This speeds up your workflow quite a bit.

Centrotec stuff sure is expensive, completely agree. Nevertheless I bought every bit I need, not the full set in systainer, but seperately. But that's how it is with top quality bits in Germany, they are expensive and when it comes to the top bits there, Festool isn't even the most expensive. For instance, Famag costs even more.

I wouldn't want to be without centrotec bits. The good old Jacobs chuck is history for me. I even use the hook driver so now and then. Had one job where I needed to loosen 150 something hooks, it paid for itself there.

Of course everybody is free to buy their own bits from other brands. You don't HAVE to buy centrotec.

   

 

[andvari]

A couple of years ago I spent $70 for a set of 4 (5/8" - 1") brad point drill bits from another German manufacturer, Colt. To me the quality was well worth it.

As far a the set goes, I really don't have a need for most of the contents so I will likely not be buying it. However if you do enough of the type of work it is designed for it may be worth it to you.

 

[mouppe]

I paid $350 for my set. Worth every penny to have everything you need in one tidy set. I haven't touched my old drill bits or drivers since I picked it up a year ago. Forget runout etc., it's the convenience factor, the centrotec chuck and it's all in a systainer.

Got to agree with you about the hook thingy. Rubbish.

Overall, I love it to bits (excuse the pun).

Oh, and welcome to the FOG.

 

[MrToolJunkie]

I think everyone needs to decide whether it is worth it or not for them.  While it is expensive, it is not much more than other quality bit manufacturers (as others stated). 

 

[spikfot]

I got the Centrotec '08 set, since the last thing I needed was sockets and ratchet it was perfect for me. The only part I've not appreciated was the long driver bits, the steel they were made out of is junk. Softest, most easy to destroy tips I've ever used. That said, Considering how much I use the rest of the pieces, countersinks, etc- I'd buy it again.

 

[andy5405]

I love the Festool gear I already own and want other stuff based largely on what I read on here. I get the sanders, the Domino, the MFT, the routers etc although I have never even seen any of them in the flesh. However I have always said that the whole thing with Festool drills and bits leaves me completely stone cold.

Also although none of us would admit to purchasing tools based on aesthetics I also think the Festool drills look a bit pants as well. I might part with hard earned dollars if they at least looked sexy. They are all badly proportioned.

I'll get my coat..........

 

[Guy Ashley]

I get the "all in one systainer" theory and the centrotec principle as a concept but IMHO for chippy's/joiners the contents of the set is deficient in some respects and has a lot of "stuff" that would not get used.

More hinge centering bits in varying sizes would be good, a selection of wood spade bits would be useful.

A lot of money to be spent on things that would not be used.

As a matter of interest, I wonder how they came to the configuration that currently exists? 

 

[hockey_magnet]

I agree that the bits are expensive. The thing is they are expensive whether you buy the set or not. I was careful to price out the individual pieces in the set that I was fairly certain I would use at some point, noe or in the near future. (Don't think I'll ever need that hook driver, though.) Anyway, if you're going to buy into the centrotec syste, at all and you need MOST of the items, the set is actually better value  - you save some $ and you get the systainer as well.

So I think your beef is really the price of the Centrotec components being overpriced, the fact that they are in a set doesn't make any difference.

Chris

 

[snaslund]

Well, I did not realize this was my first post.  [blink]  Anyway, I realize there is a lot of value in the Systainer containing everything in one place.  My problem was that the set was so incomplete in terms of bit sizes and accessories that I would need to have a bunch of other non-Centrotech stuff to meet my needs.  In terms of Festool quality being higher, I get it but I was just looking at a 37 piece hex drive drill bit set from Dewalt that was running $15.00.  The Dewalt stuff was in a nice container (not a systainer though) and they were Titanium bits.  I have used their bits in the past and they were fine.  I also recently bought a set of Colt drill bits made in Germany (they are highly rated and high quality bits).  The pricing there was $30 for an eight bit set.  That is pretty steep but not even close to $425.  Granted, they don't have a Centrotech end on them but I can't believe that would cost that much.

The question I guess is how much higher quality could they be to justify that kind of pricing.  In my opinion, Festool made a completely proprietary move with the Centrotech and are really taking advantage.  The fact that you can make a hex bit fit a Centrotech chuck by rounding the corners and adding a groove tells me that Festool could well have just done a higher quality bit with the standard hex shank.  There are locking hex hex holders in the market, Milwaukee has a good one out there.  I notice that the hex bits fit into the socket that the Centrotech chuck and drill chuck fit into.  That kind of dispels the myth that runout is a problem on the hex form factor.  Here is my thinking if the Centrotech chuck fits into a hex socket then the runout cannot be that bad otherwise the Centrotech chuck would be running out itself.  I would have been much happier if Festool just had a locking hex chuck in the place to the Centrotech.  It would have made the system compatible with a whole world of accessories already out there and available for much less.  I know I can use an adapter but that just makes everything longer which was what I was trying to avoid in the CXS.  I hope I am not coming across here as a Festool hater but the bit set should not cost more than the drill kit itself.

Steven Naslund

 

[spikfot]

I love the Festool gear I already own and want other stuff based largely on what I read on here. I get the sanders, the Domino, the MFT, the routers etc although I have never even seen any of them in the flesh. However I have always said that the whole thing with Festool drills and bits leaves me completely stone cold.

Also although none of us would admit to purchasing tools based on aesthetics I also think the Festool drills look a bit pants as well. I might part with hard earned dollars if they at least looked sexy. They are all badly proportioned.

I'll get my coat..........

Go test one of the drills+ some accessories and get back to us.

Pants?

 

[spikfot]

And great first post snaslund!

 

[windmill man]

Cant remember if i have 2 or 3 Centrotech sets.

Never "paid" for any of them, each was "thrown in"  when buying large amounts of Festools in one hit. These sets are discountable as they are not classed as "tools". Just go in and negotiate hard [smile].

The stuff in them is top quality

 

[Guy Ashley]

Cant remember if i have 2 or 3 Centrotech sets.

Never "paid" for any of them, each was "thrown in"  when buying large amounts of Festools in one hit. These sets are discountable as they are not classed as "tools". Just go in and negotiate hard [smile].

The stuff in them is top quality

[not worthy] [not worthy] Stealth Gloat of the millenium!!! ;D ;D

 

[Brice Burrell]

Lets talk cost benefit.  My understanding is that Centrotechs major advantage over the standard hex system is more precision leading to less runout.  Even if I were to buy into that (I am not so sure the 1/4 hex system could not be precisely machined), I have never had that much an issue with runout on drill bits to justify that cost increase.  

Dunno where you got that impression. Centrotec isn't more precise than any other quality bit.....
   

It isn't that the Cestrotec bits are more precise than regular bits, it's that the Centrotec bits and chuck are far more precise than almost all the other quick change bit systems out there.  Also, it's not the 1/4" hex design that is flawed, it's that there is no uniform standard that all 1/4" hex bits are made to.  This loose standard that the hex are made to can cause a lot of runout.  The Centrotec bits are made to very tight tolerances compared to our regular hex bits.  

Sure Festool could make its Centrotec chuck to fit the 1/4" hex bit but you'd have the same runout that all the other crappy quick change systems have.  Bottom line, Festool didn't make the Centrotec a "proprietary" system to stick it to us, they made it to be a superior quick change system.      

 

[optimistisch]

Hi guys,
I was long time with the FAMAG bits and BORMAX³ Forstner drills an Bosch Professional drills (GSR 10.8 V-LI-2). I was pretty sure that the Bosch would be the right drill for me. Then during the holidays in summer I accidentally bought me an C12 in a classic Systainer as an offer (20% off). So the whole thing started and I slipped deeper in the drill thing then I ever intended to do. Right now I do have a complete set of bits 3-10mm #495128 and the CentroTec Forstner drills set 15-35mm #496390. Additionally I have the 5-Piece Stub Brad Point BKS Wood Drill Bit Set 3-8mm, #495130 and a CentroTec Countersink w/ Depth Control #492523

Lately I bought me a Protool Wood CE Set #637577 with five pcs. wood bits 4-10mm and six pcs. 2" long Torx from T10 up to T40 and a CentroTec Countersink Bit 5-15mm Diameter #492541. The Protool set also includes the CentroTec BHS 65 Bit Holder #492648 as the Protool version. The Festool versions have the green rings and the Protool version carries the orange ring.

Now I do have everything I need or probably[attachimg=#] will need for me projects.

For the guys who want to go more in the details I made a picture from the FAMAG drills. These are very very good drills bits, they are still razor sharp. It is premium class. From my opinion they can not be compared to the above mentioned bits from Colt.

And I put the Festool/Protool CentroTec on the left side the FAMAG hex shank Drill in the middle and the FAMAG round shank (is it called that way?) on the right. All three bits are 8mm size.

and here a closer look

The set of drills from FAMAG are the best drills I ever have used. But the ease of use from the CentroTec system made the victory. It is so easy and elegant to handle that I changed from the very expensive FAMAG bits to the Festool/Protool ones. At all I spend some 390 Euro [crying] for the CentroTec tools without (!) the C12 (that caused all the waste of money  ;D ).  For Festool the 20% off pay off !

Ingo