dealers that refuse to stock full festool line

[grbmds]

Probably should tell the store managers they aren't satisfying your needs. They don't necessarily read this. Rockler and Woodcraft, as well as all other tool and woodworking stores, really do depend on their local managers and staff. While I don't regulary use the Rockler in one of the cities the another poster does use regularly, I feel it has its purpose. There have been some things over the years that Rockler sold at a better price or just weren't readily available any other place at the time. With the internet, it becomes increasingly difficult for retail stores to make it. That's why, if you tell them they aren't serving your needs or they don't have the necessary expertise to warrant buying from them as opposed to another store or online, if they don't take that and improve, they will eventually just not exist. I have never felt that woodworking stores, in general, can be lumped under the good or bad category. I have a favorite Woodcraft store. It's my favorite because they always provide suggestions and good advice. They give me things to think about when I'm buying a tool or some other woodworking supplies. Therefore, I buy a lot of stuff there. Of course, that is their true function as a retail store; to sell enough to be profitable. However, they do it with class at the Madison, Wisoconsin Woodcraft store.

 

[greg mann]

The varied experiences with Rockler and Woodcraft stores reinforces my sense that a store by store evaluation, while taking longer and being more expensive at the start, would have been better. I did say I felt signing up Rockler corporate wide was probably not good, I am sure there are individual Rockler stores that handle the Festool line well. Same goes for Woodcraft. There may even be a few Home Depots out there that would do a good job, as hard as that may be to accept.

 

[peter halle]

One thing that the large organizations such as Rockler and Woodcraft offer is centralized distribution from their own warehouses as well as online sales.  That would be attractive to a tool manufacturer.

Now how the organizations handle everything else is something else.

Peter

 

[greg mann]

One thing that the large organizations such as Rockler and Woodcraft offer is centralized distribution from their own warehouses as well as online sales.  That would be attractive to a tool manufacturer.

Now how the organizations handle everything else is something else.

Peter

Do they use their own distribution centers for Festool or do they order directly from Festool at the individual store level? My guess is some Festool stock for online sales from their centers but each store is on its own ordering from Lebanon. Could be wrong, but that's my guess.

 

[Paul G]

One thing that the large organizations such as Rockler and Woodcraft offer is centralized distribution from their own warehouses as well as online sales.  That would be attractive to a tool manufacturer.

Now how the organizations handle everything else is something else.

Peter

Do they use their own distribution centers for Festool or do they order directly from Festool at the individual store level? My guess is some Festool stock for online sales from their centers but each store is on its own ordering from Lebanon. Could be wrong, but that's my guess.

IIRC, my local woodcraft does both ways.

 

[tiralie]

I started building European-style System 32 cabinets in 1947 following my graduation from prep school and enrollment in NYU, I shared a fifth floor loft with 4 other NYU engineering majors. However, I was pragmatic enough to also rent half of the basement, the portion facing Waverly Place. Before WWII the building took out its coal furnace and boiler, buying steam from ConEdison. So I was able to take advantage of the old coal shute down which my plywood was delivered.

Following GrandPa's lead, I treated my lumber and hardware suppliers very well. In 1947 top quality cabinet grade plywood was still in short supply. So I asked my lumber dealer what I could do to make their life easier, beside paying my bills on time! What my lumber dealer wanted from me was as much advance information as to the specifics of my needs. Same was true of my cabinet hardware suppliers. As I booked a new job to be done 6-8 weeks in the future, I ordered my plywood, hardwood and hardware with specific delivery dates. So they had all that time to find what I needed.

ccarrolladams:
I always enjoy reading your posts.
Thanks.
Tim

 

[Stephen B]

Post 36 by ccarrolladams
The practices discussed in this post, can be applied to a small business or even a DIY/ owner builder such as myself.

My nearest Festool dealer is 150km from my home. However I am in that area at least twice each month. Although I can order via internet, I prefer personal visits as these often result in a better deal even with consumerable items and personal  visits also strengthen the relationship. Distance means that I need to stock a wider range of sandpaper discs for example, and I check and think about my needs before each visit. After all he is not 20mins away.

This dealer is also aware of my future plans for big ticket items over the next twelve to twenty four months.

Whilst I am an extremely extremely  small fish within his overall  sales, I am recognised  by most staff and can genuinely discuss my needs.

When it comes to my timber and hardware needs, well I do work part time in a timber/hardware store with obvious financial and stock planing advantages.

 

[K119Phil]

[not worthy] Dr. Adams, sir, always an inspiration.

 

[ShawnRussell]

[not worthy] Dr. Adams, sir, always an inspiration.

That was my feeling as well.
@ccarrolladams your post is an inspiration to any discipline and could be used in any relationship, commercial or personal.

 

[andy5405]

I weighed into this thread earlier and said something along the lines of "if your local shop is rubbish, just order online, what's the problem?"

I've been looking into setting up an online shop for years and did some more research recently. I read somewhere that the UK is way ahead of most of the world in the availability and ease of online shopping and certainly and wondered how easy and effective online shopping is in the US.

We are a small country so we have one shipping rate for the whole of the UK. The only exception to that tends to be some of the smaller islands north of Scotland.  What happens in America? Someone mentioned having to order from 3000 miles away though still in the same country. Does shipping vary massively depending on distance?

We're also close to Germany so if stuff has to come from there we're not too disadvantaged. That said a UK dealer told me recently that availability from Germany (particularly for spares) has got a lot worse over the last 2 years.  

My favorite dealer didn't have stock of a Rotex 150 recently. I was going to order online anyway as it was easier than a 50 mile round trip to my 2nd favorite choice so I shopped around for price. Amazon was the cheapest so that's what I went with. My other two options mentioned above would have been around £40 dearer. As I said one was ruled out on availability and one involved driving. It wasn't even the driving as I can't be trusted in a bricks and mortar store. It's all too tempting.

The most obscure item I ordered recently was sandpaper in lots of 10. Even that wasn't hard though it isn't even a standard Festool product. I found one store that does just about everything available in every grit with easy online ordering and next day delivery.

 

[Paul G]

Andy, a dealer could offer a more detailed answer but yes shipping rates and times vary depending on distance when using UPS and FEDEX. USPS has some solutions that standardize the rates but it depends on size. And Alaska and Hawaii have their own issues as well not being contiguous US. Also the rules regarding shipping certain things like liquids, chemicals, ammo, etc will limit options as well. Further complications that are emerging involve local taxes like sales or hotel taxes levied by neighborhoods, cities, counties etc with something like 7500 different rate zones changeable at the whim of local political action. All that being said e-commerce is alive and well here but the shipping issues at times can be frustrating for consumers. An example here is buying anything Mafell, it all comes out of Maine and I'm either waiting a week for ground shipping or paying a bundle for air rates.

 

[mouppe]

Andy, a major difference between the UK and Canada/ the US is VAT/ sales tax. In the UK it is charged everywhere, but in North America it varies from state to state and often online it is not charged altogether if you are shipping out of state (generalizing here).

This alters significantly the competitive landscape here.

 

[gkaiseril]

Andy, a major difference between the UK and Canada/ the US is VAT/ sales tax. In the UK it is charged everywhere, but in North America it varies from state to state and often online it is not charged altogether if you are shipping out of state (generalizing here).

For Illinois and many other states, there is a Sales Tax charged by in state retailers, and a Use Tax that an individual should pay when good are purchased out of the state of residence and then shipped or brought into the state of residence. The Use Tax has the same rate as the Sales Tax. Illinois for many years has had a separate form for the collection of the Use Tax but is now asking taxpayers to provide this information and payment on the state tax return.

Companies like WoodCraft and Rockler that have brick and mortar stores or other physical presence within Illinois are encouraged to collect salse tax even on internet purchases and if they do not, then their physical assets within the state can have a tax lien affixed to the assets.

There are over 500 sales/use tax districts within Illinois and if one buys a car outside of Cook County, then the county comes after the Cook County resident for their 0.5% sales/use tax.

You may need to talk to your personal tax advisor to understand how this may apply to you and your state of residence.

 

[Dan Clermont]

We are a small country so we have one shipping rate for the whole of the UK. The only exception to that tends to be some of the smaller islands north of Scotland.  What happens in America? Someone mentioned having to order from 3000 miles away though still in the same country. Does shipping vary massively depending on distance?

We are a Festool dealer 3000 miles away from the poster who needed paper for his RS 2E and although it costs more for us to ship that far compared to the guy 30 miles away we still offer free shipping at the $150 thresh hold.

Our store is very heavily focused on the Festool line so we do try hard to stock everything possible including some common parts

Dan Clermont
www.ultimatetools.ca

 

[andy5405]

Those replies are a real eye opener. I had no idea that selling between states and even counties within states was so complicated. We have 4 countries within the United Kingdom and laws and taxes apply to all of them. My first reaction is that you could drop the U out of the USA for some aspects of your life as it doesn't sound so united in this context.

However we have some strange ideas here. Take say football rugby and cricket and most international sport for example. We play as separate countries so it's the English, Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish international teams. Then  when it comes to the Olympics we're Great Britain and all the countries play in one team. Andy Murray who won Wimbledon last year (first Brit in 77 years) is considered Scottish when he loses and British when he wins.

 

[greg mann]

Those replies are a real eye opener. I had no idea that selling between states and even counties within states was so complicated. We have 4 countries within the United Kingdom and laws and taxes apply to all of them. My first reaction is that you could drop the U out of the USA for some aspects of your life as it doesn't sound so united in this context.

However we have some strange ideas here. Take say football rugby and cricket and most international sport for example. We play as separate countries so it's the English, Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish international teams. Then  when it comes to the Olympics we're Great Britain and all the countries play in one team. Andy Murray who won Wimbledon last year (first Brit in 77 years) is considered Scottish when he loses and British when he wins.

Probably the other way around if your in Scotland.

 

[gkaiseril]

Those replies are a real eye opener. I had no idea that selling between states and even counties within states was so complicated. We have 4 countries within the United Kingdom and laws and taxes apply to all of them. My first reaction is that you could drop the U out of the USA for some aspects of your life as it doesn't sound so united in this context.

In the short 200 year history of the country many compromises have been made that spell out what the states control and what the federal government controls and most favor the states.

I heard a news broadcast about Canada and the very ornate door knobs in Vancouver City Hall being replaced by lever handles due to accessibility issues and how Vancouver has its own building code while the rest of Canada has a national standard building code.  In the U.S. there are national model codes that many municipalities adopt but not all. The concept a national control is not par the U.S. history. In fact if one looks at the settling of the U.S. it seems odd that the colonies could even live together on one land mass let alone come to agreement on anything.

 

[Paul G]

Those replies are a real eye opener. I had no idea that selling between states and even counties within states was so complicated. We have 4 countries within the United Kingdom and laws and taxes apply to all of them. My first reaction is that you could drop the U out of the USA for some aspects of your life as it doesn't sound so united in this context.

However we have some strange ideas here. Take say football rugby and cricket and most international sport for example. We play as separate countries so it's the English, Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish international teams. Then  when it comes to the Olympics we're Great Britain and all the countries play in one team. Andy Murray who won Wimbledon last year (first Brit in 77 years) is considered Scottish when he loses and British when he wins.

Considering the UK is smaller in size than California with a greater population, and a much different history than the US, the political dynamics are quite different between the two countries. The USA reminds me of a highly dysfunctional family that argues a lot with competing ideas and interests and barely gets along, but when someone else messes with the family we unite and direct all that fight onto the aggressor. When it's over we soon start arguing again. My relatives in other parts of the globe have a difficult time understanding it.

 

[mouppe]

Those replies are a real eye opener. I had no idea that selling between states and even counties within states was so complicated. We have 4 countries within the United Kingdom and laws and taxes apply to all of them. My first reaction is that you could drop the U out of the USA for some aspects of your life as it doesn't sound so united in this context.

In the short 200 year history of the country many compromises have been made that spell out what the states control and what the federal government controls and most favor the states.

I heard a news broadcast about Canada and the very ornate door knobs in Vancouver City Hall being replaced by lever handles due to accessibility issues and how Vancouver has its own building code while the rest of Canada has a national standard building code.  In the U.S. there are national model codes that many municipalities adopt but not all. The concept a national control is not par the U.S. history. In fact if one looks at the settling of the U.S. it seems odd that the colonies could even live together on one land mass let alone come to agreement on anything.

Yes, Canada has a national building code, but it's not legally enforceable and its adoption by the municipalities and provinces varies from place to place. Normally it forms the basis for the provincial code, with local amendments where necessary, such as climate requirements.

 

[jacko9]

I sometimes try my local dealers (Woodcraft and Rockler) if I need something right away but, if they don't stock the item I'll contact Tom even if he has to order the item.  Most times Tom has what I need in stock and if I plan in advance, I'll buy from him most of the time.

Jack