Domino 500 Additional Stops (Update)

[iamnothim]

Interesting... although the ±1/64" thing seems silly when you think that the depth of the mortise has to be measured in the middle due to an oscillating cutter and it is a bit deeper for glue relief.

Weird. 
I was just reading Some dude hacking an MFK 700.
But I digress.

 

[iamnothim]

I'm not here to question Woodpeckers' engineering, but Dupont posts the thermal expansion range for Delrin which would calculate out to a little over 2 thousandths of an inch change for an inch of plastic over a 30* F shift in temp and that's the high side of their expansion ratings. Acetal plastics have a thermal expansion roughly 5 times that of aluminum. In woodworking terms, virtually non existent. In terms of NASA probably a big deal.

I agree that small expansion/contraction for Delrin would be a non issue when making a mortise.

I'm ignorant...
Just passing on the info.
But then.....  Ya'll are correct

 

[fdengel]

Anyone consider inventing a variable-length tube for this?    [laughing]

A well-made set of these from a company like Woodpeckers is something I would probably pay a reasonable price for.

 

[grbmds]

I'm confused. Why would someone pay a lot of money for something you can make from PVC? The precision doesn't seem important. It's hard to believe that a 1/64 difference, or even a 1/32 difference could possibly make a difference when considering the depth of the mortise. While there might be situations where I wanted to have a longer or shorter mortise depth than is standard on the Domino, I think if it was that important I'd just use the PVC. The frequency of those situations in my life so far wouldn't make it worthwhile to buy an expensive set of machined collars. I have a number of Woodpecker precision measuring tools and love them ,but this seems like overkill on the precision thing for no reason.

 

[iamnothim]

I'm confused. Why would someone pay a lot of money for something you can make from PVC? The precision doesn't seem important. It's hard to believe that a 1/64 difference, or even a 1/32 difference could possibly make a difference when considering the depth of the mortise. While there might be situations where I wanted to have a longer or shorter mortise depth than is standard on the Domino, I think if it was that important I'd just use the PVC. The frequency of those situations in my life so far wouldn't make it worthwhile to buy an expensive set of machined collars. I have a number of Woodpecker precision measuring tools and love them ,but this seems like overkill on the precision thing for no reason.

A lot of it comes down to preference and what's important to an individual.
One example is my Starrett Square.  I love the look, the feel, the accuracy, and performance every time it's in my hand.  Could I buy a square for a lot less that's accurate? Yes.
Same is true for a lot other measuring tools.  Incra, Woodpecker, Vertas, Bridge City, etc.  All these products could be found for less.  Heck, many folks wouldn't pay $500 for a circular saw either. 

For me, it's more than just accuracy or "good enough for .....".  That's the case with these little guys.

 

[iamnothim]

More on the accuracy front.  The kit will contain a couple 1mm bushings as well.
I've passed along all your feedback and the link to this thread.  I'm certain they appreciate it.
If they aren't already I will suggest they register as a vendor on FOG.

 

[bkharman]

I am not sold on the metal on metal idea. Plus having to take the body on and off all of the time would get annoying.

I trimmed down my stop sleeve that shipped with the domino for a couple of depths and it is plenty for me. I can slide it in and off without taking the body off. Works in a pinch.

They are definitely nice looking and good for you starting a beta on them. Good luck!

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[iamnothim]

I am not sold on the metal on metal idea. Plus having to take the body on and off all of the time would get annoying.

I trimmed down my stop sleeve that shipped with the domino for a couple of depths and it is plenty for me. I can slide it in and off without taking the body off. Works in a pinch.

They are definitely nice looking and good for you starting a beta on them. Good luck!

Cheers. Bryan.

First I'd like to say I'm posting because I like the idea and want to engage in discussion.  I called the idea to Woodpecker's attention and they liked it.  Other than a set of stops, I get nothing.

All the comments made in the thread are both valid and valuable.

Hi Bryan,
Here's my take on the metal on metal thing.  The plunge shaft is SS.  The Domino Cylinder is Brass and the tolerances are very tight.

I looked up metal hardness.
316 SS has a Rockwell Hardness value of B91
360 Machining Brass has a Rockwell Hardness value of B78
T6061 Aluminium has a Rockwell Hardness value of B60
It seem to me that the Al is the softest of the metals in play and is more likely to be damaged than the SS it comes in contact with.

I'm no metallurgist but my gut is metal on metal won't be an issue.

It also doesn't move much when you use it.

 

[MaineShop]

Seemed a little passive aggressive with Rick there....

I like the idea. I would like it even more if you could find a way to make them lock over the slide with out having to slide the head unit off. Some kind of hinge pin could probably achieve this although I don't know how you would achieve that 1mm spacer. For that matter the 1mm spacer doesnt need to be a complete ring, it only needs to be a shim. If you went that kind of route you could have the smallest regualr ring be one that flips on and then have many smaller spacers that clip to that, as they dont need to be full rings, or ring shaped. Also the idea of the plastic is a good one, and the way to approach the issue is keep the width of the ring made from the aluminum so that the depth tolerance is maintained and then use a plastic sleeve inside of it so that that it will glide, even better if you can use some kind of self lubricating plastic.

When you ask for peoples opinions use them, don't dismiss them because it is not what you see in your mind.

Adam

 

[NiteWalkerGR]

The reasons you mentioned regarding hardness of different metals is why I wasn't worried about the metal on metal.

And regarding those not understanding the cost?
For a lot of us, a big part of the enjoyment we get from woodworking is buying and playing with new tools toys.  [big grin]

Please pass along to woodpeckers they would get a lot more of my business if they didn't price a fair amount of their tools like bridge city.
This set should be $40, maybe $50 tops.

 

[teocaf]

i agree that pvc sounds best, specially if it's cut so that you can just slip it over without taking anything apart.  just brainstorming: you can get washers, or spacers or whatever they're called and stack them for this as well.  
i think the argument for the machined parts is a bit of overreaching because the finished hole you end up with will not show so it won't make a bit of difference.  i think that half the stuff that woodpeckers makes is extremely useful while the other stuff is just made to feed machined anodized aluminum addictions--there i said it!
speaking of which, my incra ls and mft precision plate just got here so i gotta run...

 

[iamnothim]

Seemed a little passive aggressive with Rick there....

I like the idea. I would like it even more if you could find a way to make them lock over the slide with out having to slide the head unit off. Some kind of hinge pin could probably achieve this although I don't know how you would achieve that 1mm spacer. For that matter the 1mm spacer doesnt need to be a complete ring, it only needs to be a shim. If you went that kind of route you could have the smallest regualr ring be one that flips on and then have many smaller spacers that clip to that, as they dont need to be full rings, or ring shaped. Also the idea of the plastic is a good one, and the way to approach the issue is keep the width of the ring made from the aluminum so that the depth tolerance is maintained and then use a plastic sleeve inside of it so that that it will glide, even better if you can use some kind of self lubricating plastic.

When you ask for peoples opinions use them, don't dismiss them because it is not what you see in your mind.

I have to bring up the photo, while you couldnt get the depths to change you cut the dominos to get the heights you wanted to show for your sample, deception is not the marketing of quality products.

Adam

I apologize for coming off that way.  I love my RTS Self Centering Guide and made a poor attempt at humor with my accuracy comment.
I also apologize if I sound like I'm dismissing an opinion or comment.  I said that in my prior post.
I'm just a wood butcher in a garage.  I've owned my Domino since May 1.  I don't mfg anything and I don't know enough to deceive.  

You are spot on with the 1mm size....   I (THINK) figured it out.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.
To have a full range of values you need three maybe four sleeves.  Two 2mm and one 1mm.
EDIT:  Wrong...Again.
You need a 3mm, 8mm, 13mm, and 16mm sleeve as well as the 2mm and 1mm.  Otherwise they are rattling on the shaft.
With this the Domino would be set to 28mm at all times.

Without a sleeve the depth of plunge obviously gets progressively shallow when you move the setting from 28mm to 12mm
What I finally noticed was more of the cylinder was  exposed as the setting was reduced.

28mm had nothing exposed
25mm would have 3mm exposed
20mm would have 8mm exposed
15mm would have 13mm exposed
12mm would have 16mm exposed

Keeping the Domino depth set to 28mm (max)
To have variables between 28mm and 25mm you need two 1mm sleeves
To have variables between 25mm and 20mm you need a 3mm (Set Domino to 28mm) plus two 2mm sleeves and a 1mm sleeve.
To have variables between 20mm and 15mm you need  a 8mm (Set Domino to 28mm) plus two 2mm sleeves and a 1mm sleeve.
To have variables between 15mm and 12mm you need  a 13mm (Set Domino to 28mm) plus two 2mm sleeves and a 1mm sleeve.
To have variables below 12mm you need a 16mm (Set Domino to 28mm)  plus a two (or more) 2mm sleeves and a 1mm sleeve.

 

[promark747]

Instead of ring-shaped, how about half-circles that slip on and off (without having to remove the fence) and are kept in place with magnets?

 

[copcarcollector]

well I misunderstood where these spacers were added to the Domino, I was not thinking! I agree that maybe they could look into something simpler to remove from the shaft than having to take the entire fence off. I guess its not that big a deal either way. Anyhow, thanks again for the preview! Whatever they come out with I will have to order it...

 

[Rick Christopherson]

well I misunderstood where these spacers were added to the Domino, I was not thinking! I agree that maybe they could look into something simpler to remove from the shaft than having to take the entire fence off. I guess its not that big a deal either way. Anyhow, thanks again for the preview! Whatever they come out with I will have to order it...

I don't know about the DF500, but my DF700 shipped with a plastic C-collar over the rail to prevent it from plunging during transport. It would be the perfect solution (at least for the 700) if chopped into segments.

 

[ishmerc]

Go to a hobby store and get some of these shock spacer for RC car ,they come in different size and just snap it on .

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[copcarcollector]

Go to a hobby store and get some of these shock spacer for RC car ,they come in different size and just snap it on .

Probably a much less expensive option! ISHMERC, do you know the brand and/or part # on those? (I have access to most RC brands, so I can look it up!)

Just found two sets from Traxxas, one is $4 and the other $1.50! I am going to order them and see if they work.

 

[PaulMarcel]

Go to a hobby store and get some of these shock spacer for RC car ,they come in different size and just snap it on .

Probably a much less expensive option! ISHMERC, do you know the brand and/or part # on those? (I have access to most RC brands, so I can look it up!)

Just found two sets from Traxxas, one is $4 and the other $1.50! I am going to order them and see if they work.

...and report back

 

[ishmerc]

Go to a hobby store and get some of these shock spacer for RC car ,they come in different size and just snap it on .

Probably a much less expensive option! ISHMERC, do you know the brand and/or part # on those? (I have access to most RC brands, so I can look it up!)

Just found two sets from Traxxas, one is $4 and the other $1.50! I am going to order them and see if they work.

You know what ,I don't remember which brand is it cause I've so many different RC car and it been awhile since I mess with it .Try the Traxxas T-maxx cause that one of the big 4X4 truck .If your near a hobby People store ,go there with the domino and try it .They're really cheap and if I remember correctly they sell them with a bunch of different thickness in one package .

 

[ishmerc]

Ok I just check real fast since I'm sitting here doing nothing .The one that I use in the picture is from HPI Savage truck  ,they're a large RC company so it should be very easy to find .Unless you've really small hand ,it probably easier to put it on and take it off with a small pair of plier .Here are some more picture showing different thickness .With these spacer and going by 1mm you can do 16 more depth if that make sense .

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