Feisty Female Festool Friday Club….Feedback Needed!

[bobfog]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member]
I did read your post correctly.  Still reads as a stereotype. The foundation of gender roles you refer to start at home not when one gets to grade or high school. I for one, never had the availability of a shop class while in school at any level through high school. My love of woodworking, or DIY in general, was instilled in my watching my mother while growing up.  She tackled a lot of the repair projects we had at home herself and taught me how to use a drill, hammer, and screwdriver.

Just when Seth helped you pull your foot out of your mouth. You went ahead and put it back in. I would love to see where you pulled the stat on your poll of 100 people..... Seems like it was another generalized fact you made up.

I didn't present it as a fact, it's just my personal observation based on women I know (very intelligent women I might add, an entrepreneur, a historian, a psychologist, a nurse, a lecturer/teacher, a doctor and a journalist) vs the male friends/family I know as a comparison.

But, anyway, Seth asked not to go down this line so out of respect for his request, this will be my last reply on the subject, feel free to think of me sitting here with my foot in my mouth.

 

[Girlsintheshop]

Paul G.,

I totally agree about strength.  There are definitely some tools that are easier for me to use than others.  Every time, I would use the Craftsman table saw to break down sheet goods, I'd risk tipping it over!  This is where the Festool Track Saw and MFT/3 Multitask Table have assisted in making it manageable for me as a woman, usually working alone.  I usually do a lot of research on a particular tool, to see it weight and hopefully find reviews from other women.  My Ridgid Grinder is a beast, and I tried to get my husband to do the sidewalk task for me, because it was to much for me.  For safety's sake you have to know your limits, know when to ask for help, or when to just stop and bring in a professional. 

 

[Paul G]

For safety's sake you have to know your limits, know when to ask for help, or when to just stop and bring in a professional.

Yes indeed. And your efforts will help expand those limits one project at a time, which is no different than for anyone else.

 

[JZ Bowmannz]

........... feel free to think of me sitting here with my foot in my mouth.

[eek] [big grin] You just made my day! Thanks.

 

[RKA]

As a counterpoint to Paul's post, maybe there is a better way?  Using brute strength to accomplish a task is one way, but often times there are alternatives.  Maybe they take more time or planning, but in the end it can be safer and more enjoyable.  This becomes a teaching moment.

To the examples Paul mentioned:
Maybe a skil saw isn't a good fit in a particular situation.  Discuss what makes it difficult or dangerous.  Explain how a track saw or miter saw is easier to manage.  Some clamps can give you the stability and control you need. 

Drilling larger holes can be made safer using the clutch and extra handle we all tossed aside when we opened our new drills. 

Maybe (gasp) hand tools can be substituted when a power tool becomes unwieldy?  That framing nailer is fast, but if you only need to sink 4 nails, a hammer is a lot lighter and might be safer.  Since this is all in the context of building furniture and not houses, maybe another form of joinery would be more suitable anyway?  Again, it's about teaching them that there is always more than one way and if something proves difficult, go back and rethink what you're doing. 

I think the point in education is empowerment and removing the barriers (whether real or in our own minds) so we can further our knowledge (and skills). 

Getting back to the original post, I'm thinking about my wife in particular.  There are two barriers (three if you count me, but I'm assuming you've solved that by not inviting the husbands).  First, she's not comfortable around the tools that would be used.  Before she got too deep into any project, I think she would need a little time using some "core tools".  Think about what those would be and come up with projects or just exercises that would build a level of safety, competence and confidence.  In doing that you also squash the fear factor.  Second is around process.  Take a look at some common household items and break down the various pieces, how they would be assembled and built and in what order (heck, even breaking down a piece of ikea furniture could be a great simple visualization exercise).  Talk about gang cutting common parts so you're not relying on a tape measure for accuracy.  Turn them loose to make mistakes and use those to illustrate alternative approaches (and how to recover from those mistakes). 

I think those two barriers covers your basic class.  The advanced class could be a suitable project of their choosing based on their needs or wants.  I think that would be more fun all around.  Maybe in that class you can start to touch on finishing skills (sanding, paint, stain, whatever). 

 

[Girlsintheshop]

I love and appreciate the feedback, various views, encouragement, suggestions, etc.  Keep them coming!

 

[semenza]

[member=62317]Girlsintheshop[/member]  I think this is  a good topic. It will be nice to see this all come together and watch the results unfold.

Seth

 

[Scott B.]

I think its a great idea. Just creating a safe opportunity for novice enthusiasts to learn some tool basics and take on a simple project can be a great confidence builder. That is usually what people lack when starting out...confidence, which comes through experience. So, I would recommend setting people up for success, such that it is challenging but just about impossible to fail.

I am a pro paint contractor by trade and (at the risk of reverse discrimination) would have to say that many of our very best painters over the years have been female. We have observed a strong attention to detail and (for lack of a better term) 'give a crap factor' for detailed work amongst this demographic.

As others have said, I would recommend starting small and locally. We host training workshops in our facilities and it can be a logistical challenge to bring in a group of people from multiple states.

Definitely have to emphasize the importance of safety when working with inexperienced folks.

Good luck to you if you pursue this idea.

 

[charley1968]

Hi!
If i was to start a woodworking class ,i'd start with hand tools. I think working with handtools gives one far more time to contemplate the next step in the workflow, how to arrange the wood for a given task etc. Just more complacency. Plus it doesn't need a release form; you can talk while you're working. And it'll be easier on your wallet, too.
In Germany, a carpenters apprenticeship starts with handwork and it's tested a year or so into your apprenticeship.
Best regards: A.

 

[teocaf]

I think 5 is a very good number for a starting class.  It's not a long wait for each one to get their turn at a tool and they can remind each other what you just said instead of you talking yourself hoarse.
I get what you mean about letting others have a go with your precious tools--always a difficulty, but with such a small group, it will be easy to supervise. 
But it's going to really suck for some of your students when they go home and try to do something on their own after taking your class.  I'm imagining the following scenario where your student goes and tries to "beg, borrow or steal" a saw and finally manages to score a Skil saw from someone.  She's going to look at it and say:  where's the other parts?    Umm, what other parts?  You know the track it runs on and the dust extractor and the good blade and the table with the hole thingies...  The scene ends with her tracking down a festool dealer and seeing the prices for all the items she saw in your shop and she either faints or better yet, she starts thinking:  Let's see now, I wonder what a second mortgage on my first-born would bring, and I wonder how many ways I can dress up Spam, and no one is really going to miss that silverware that great great grandma schlepped in her corset from Lithuania... 

 

[mike_aa]

............So, I talked the hubs into letting me purchase the Festool TS 75 Track Saw for Christmas.  Granted, he never actually knew what it costs....or the dust extractor....or the MFT/3 Multi-task Table, that all came together (wink, wink)!  Thank goodness all the Systainers look alike, so he hasn't noticed the Planer, both Dominoes, or the Rotex 90! The track saw allows me to break down sheet goods and other materials that I can't cut on my Hitachi chop saw.  I've used my multiple Kreg Jigs for years, but the two Domino joiners make it even easier and better quality.

OMG, this sounds so familiar!  [eek]  [big grin]

[member=62317]Girlsintheshop[/member]  Welcome and best of luck in your endeavors!

Mike A.

 

[Wooden Skye]

Good idea, and I think you got a lot of good advise.

However I will give a story of my experience not woodworking related.  I used to be a very high level skier, in college a bunch of us rented a place for a week.  Because of my experience I was asked to teach some of the new or not experienced skiers.  After 1 run I gave up, because I couldn't teach them, because it became frustrating that something easy to me was hard for others.  I say this because some people that can do something at a high level, can't teach, so start off with 1 or 2 people and see if you can teach the skill, answer questions and have a lot of patience.

 

[Holmz]

...
I totally agree about strength.  There are definitely some tools that are easier for me to use than others.  Every time, I would use the Craftsman table saw to break down sheet goods, I'd risk tipping it over! .
...

Well I find that keeping some spinach cans on your person help  [wink]

I think some form of a syllabus or course outline, and goals would help.
It maybe that there are:
- Hand tool use for woodwork.
- Hand tool use for general fixing up stuff around the house.
- Power tool use for wood.
- etc.

So goals, mission, vision could be a good place to start.
It is basically like a business plan, even if it is a not strictly a for-profit business.

 

[Kev]

I'm late in on this.

I'm a big fan of "outcome" or "capability" training.

When it comes to DIY, there's also logical families of capabilities and/or outcomes.

I'd personally gear training/teaching to a series of practical things initially ...

Install a picture hook in wood, plasterboard, masonry.
Make some free standing shelves.
Garden planter, bread board, picture frame.
Bench, steps, coffee table.

Personally (based on the people I know), I would consider a group of 6+ men, but less than 4 women ... simply because of the nature of the gender (I'm not being sexist - just my observation).

 

[leakyroof]

With education experience under your belt, you're ready. Just adjust as you go, be prepared for challenges

 

[teocaf]

...there's also logical families of capabilities and/or outcomes.
...6+ men, but less than 4 women

um, i think you forgot the venn diagram...

what i think we have here is a very complicated case, maude;  lots of ins, lots of outs, and what-have-yous. and let's not forget: this guy treats objects as women, man...

 

[Girlsintheshop]

Thanks again for all of the suggestions & ideas! Now to find the time!  For a first project, I'm thinking we might make an outdoor wine caddy.  I've attached a picture and the plan. 

 

[sancho57]

Im a little late commenting but rather late then never. 1st Id like to say that is a very good idea. Not reading through all the post so I may be repeating what others have said.

I don't recall seeing anything about venue and resources. My suggestion to you is to maybe go to your local woodcraft. Talk to them and discuss the possibility of them letting you hold the class there. Most have spaces and hold classes.

Id set flyers out  as a lot of guys I know go there along with their wives and would be happy if their wives learned woodworking to.

Then he be able to buy even more tools  Tee Hee Tee Hee :>D

To me it would be something they might be interested in hosting.

As it would help with them making some sales, community relations etc.
The woodcraft near me has classes ensuing a scroll saw, small lathe/pen making etc.

Start out by covering the use of the basic tools they more then likely would do the instructing on shop safety etc. Start by making basic joints etc along with a small project coat rack, book ends some small easily assembled project. Then you can start adding to the difficulty as they get more and more experience.

Keep it light an fun.

This is a really good idea I hope it works out for you.

 

[sigmatango]

As a Journeyman Cabinetmaker, also known as a joiner in other countries, my four years of apprenticeship saw a pretty even 50/50 split, female to male in class. I found my lady classmates were often more capable, with a higher sense of what looks good in cabinets and furniture, and more than capable using the bigger tools such as a shaper. Anybody who would imagine that ladies have a tough time with tools would do well to look around and notice the number of men who are absolute butchers with hand and powertools. Being hamhanded has little to do with sex. One year, I had a lady as a benchmate, and that year was the best of the four in terms of collaboration and mutual assistance.
I say, kudos for starting such an initiative. Good luck, and keep on trucking!

 

[Girlsintheshop]

Im a little late commenting but rather late then never. 1st Id like to say that is a very good idea. Not reading through all the post so I may be repeating what others have said.

I don't recall seeing anything about venue and resources. My suggestion to you is to maybe go to your local woodcraft. Talk to them and discuss the possibility of them letting you hold the class there. Most have spaces and hold classes.

Id set flyers out  as a lot of guys I know go there along with their wives and would be happy if their wives learned woodworking to.

Then he be able to buy even more tools  Tee Hee Tee Hee :>D

To me it would be something they might be interested in hosting.

As it would help with them making some sales, community relations etc.
The woodcraft near me has classes ensuing a scroll saw, small lathe/pen making etc.

Start out by covering the use of the basic tools they more then likely would do the instructing on shop safety etc. Start by making basic joints etc along with a small project coat rack, book ends some small easily assembled project. Then you can start adding to the difficulty as they get more and more experience.

Keep it light an fun.

This is a really good idea I hope it works out for you.

Great suggestions!  I wish we had a local Woodcraft or other woodworking store in the area.  The closest one is about an hour and a half away.  Perhaps, I should open my own woodworking store, carry all my favorite tools, and offer classes.  Now if I only had the pocketbook to do so that would be beautiful!! [laughing]

Carrie