Festool CMS discontinued

Dyldo Baggins

Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2019
Messages
2
Hi guys. First time poster. Long time reader.

The CMS router table seems to be discontinued here in Australia. And I'm told it will be happening in Europe as well.

Is there something new in development? I'm wondering if I should hold off on spending big money on a solution in the short term and wait?

Thanks
 
Hi,

I can't say anything on new developments, obviously only Festool would know. But yes, the CMS is being discontinued. I've heard it doesn't meet certain new? requirements set out by (European?) lawmakers. But I can't tell you more, I didn't look into it.

Kind regards,
Oliver
 
Gah,  this is something that needs more info stat.  I've been planning to buy one and even import parts from Europe.  Between not being at a stage where I fully need it yet, and the lack of metric routers in the US, and lack of some of the inserts, I've been holding off.  If any of this is true, that's now on indefinite hold.

If it's a case that they will be bringing out a new generation of it, and maybe make it more global compliant, then great.
 
Cheese said:
Maybe [member=57769]TylerC[/member] can chime in about this.  [big grin]

Neither of the CMS tables have been discontinued in North America. (I can’t speak for other countries, but they were on the European websites that I checked.) We haven’t announced any changes.
 
If they discontinue the current version and make it better that would be a shame as I'm still setting mine up that I acquired from Bob Marino a few weeks back. .however new models usually mean more money and I can't begin to imagine a $2k table for the set.

The CMS is one of those quirky tools that seems like it has one foot stuck in the past design wise. Kind of like the OF 1000 or OF 2000 before they were changed to the 1010 and 2200. I'm only using mine for the OF router module but if they could redesign the table saw module to fit the current VL and GE bases and introduce to North America. . [cool] I know, wishful thinking.
 
If they kill it off, but bring the CS series saws to NA, and take the same chassis as the CS saws and make a router system from that, with the add ons interchange, that would probably be manageable.

I've started considering maybe going for a CS70 (smuggle it in), but that then leaves me without a router option.

I know a lot of folks don't get the CMS, but for me and I think a lot of folks, it works to fill a need as there isn't really anything else that is small, modular, sliding table, etc.

They have made a mess of it in NA, between imperial routers, telling folks they can't use the OF2200,  lack of inserts, it definitely could use help.  Even if they alter the idea a little and it was something like a CS70 insert and a OF2200 based insert,  where it is no longer a kit that adapts the free standing tool, but is dedicated modules that drop into a common chassis, that could work, especially if it gets around safety issues. 

Still, if they have killed if off in one market, it's basically dead
 
Just for the records, it is gone. Not longer available in Germany.

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

festool.co.uk / festool.com as well.

[attachimg=3]

Kind regards,
Oliver
 

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Same on .NL Festool site.

I contemplated buying the CMS extensions some time ago, but some were out of stock. If the whole CMS gets scrapped I'm definitely not going to buy them.
 
Well, that's a major blow.

I'm glad I hadn't bought anything yet.  Now it leaves the question is what happens next.  I was going to build my working setup largely around a cms setup as I mentioned above.  Of course Festool denying us Metric routers is what held me off from buying a festool router, which then nullified buying a cms, and general chain reaction from there.

Not sure what I'm going to do now, as Festool just threw out a core part of "the system".  I really hope the announce and bring out something to replace it fast. My concern is with the delay to the new world, it could be years.

I had a lot of plans for using this, one of the reason I bought festool stuff was to be able to use it in the CMS. With that gone, things very well would have tipped to Maffel.

I'm going to keep some hope that this is because they have a new version coming, maybe in combination with a new series of routers.  Bit frustrating as no one really makes an equivalent to a CMS for router setup.  Just random kludges of stuff. 
 
DeformedTree said:
Of course Festool denying us Metric routers is what held me off from buying a festool router, which then nullified buying a cms, and general chain reaction from there.
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.
 
Svar said:
DeformedTree said:
Of course Festool denying us Metric routers is what held me off from buying a festool router, which then nullified buying a cms, and general chain reaction from there.
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.

Per Festool it was no longer a sticker and could not be changed.  Secondly it didn't matter, sell me the router you make everywhere and what I wanted. No one should have to fix/modify a tool out of the box.  I'm not going to go support the decision to block metric in N.A.  I want to be able to buy the tool I want any day and run with, just like those outside N.A. can. You can change stickers all you want, the package/serial number still is "imperial".  Further it doesn't matter now, the CMS is dead with no word on replacement, so I'm not going to be buying anything CMS or router, etc related until either there is a replacement or festool makes some sort of statement as to what is going on.

My impression is when Festool discontinues, it means the product line is gone. If they were bringing a replacement, they would have announced something first and the old would slowly go away.

Companies like Festool need to learn that buyers plan out things on long timelines and interdependencies.  Soon as you start throwing wrenches in things like 1) random unit of measurement changes in some countries. 2) Sell a system buy don't sell the whole system in some countries (CMS was great example of this),  3) Tell some countries you can't use it as others do (OF2200 in CMS in N.A. banned). 4) Randomly discontinue tools with no idea if things have a replacement or not.  This makes it very hard for people who would buy to hatch a plan. It makes them very cautious to buy as they don't know if they will make purchase 1 and 2, just to have purchases 3, 4, 5 made impossible and thus leave them with 1 and 2 and be incomplete/incompatible.

We all know companies keep plans tight lipped, and aren't going to speak about a lot of things that come up. But they do need to understand they need to show people that they won't be screwed in their purchasing plan.  This is key when the core of your product and the whole pitch is a system.  You got tracks, and you got a CMS and you got the tools the interchange between them.  That's an area you can't just go kill off a part here and there.    It's not like killing off a sander or drill where there really isn't a system to it other than maybe the battery, but still the other tools aren't dependent on the one that just got discontinued. Plus you just buy one from someone else.  Those areas a companies like Festool can do more "whatever". 

Again I hope they are just in the process of an update.  Could be replacing CMS with the CS type system, that could work ok. Just need to tell people if that is the case. 
 
DeformedTree said:
You can change stickers all you want, the package/serial number still is "imperial".
What bearing does it have on its functionality? I tend to get what fits the task and my wallet and get to work. If you keep chasing perfect setup or matching packaging you'll never get anything done. Products get introduced and discontinued all the time, you need to make the best of it.
CMS is still available from US dealers, typically Festool carries parts for 10 years after tool is discontinued.
 
DeformedTree said:
My impression is when Festool discontinues, it means the product line is gone. If they were bringing a replacement, they would have announced something first and the old would slowly go away.
It's possible that new safety regulations gave them similar problems (as with the CMS-TS) for the OF setup, so they had to change things. Same is likely for the CMS-PS plate where the blade extends upwards, without any protection, from where you're likely to collapse onto when having a cardiovascular event.

My guesses:

Something sawstop will replace the TS part, fixed inside a table similar to what they demonstrated the last months.

The CMS-BS-120 didn't seem to sell that well at all.
Likely history.

The PS plate can be OK for certain things but a bandsaw is way superior in both functionality and price/performance unless you need to saw inside holes.
Likely history.

And we have to admit that the CMS-OF is a quite dated design that had been surpassed by many, if not most, other available router tables in both in functionality and price/performance.
Possibly a new dedicated table, or history and 'go buy shaper'.

As it's Festool this dosn't impact availability of spare parts, so the ones that already have one will likely not be shafted that hard as with other suppliers when these drop a product. While it might not be good that the current CMS goes away without further information... I understand the reasoning behind it (desperately needing an update, both for security legislation and usability/precision) - we'll see what will happen.
 
I just got my CMS GE Set in April secondhand. Had I paid retail I'd probably be annoyed by this 'news.' I've used it a fair bit already and sure it's quirky but if you can get past that it is really capable. If they come out with a better version that's great. I can't really imagine what it would do better for routing tasks. A lot of the shortcomings I read about turned out to be overblown in real world use, at least so far. The 10 year parts availability is nice although there aren't really any wear items on something like this.

Like [member=15585]Svar[/member] I've accepted any tool I buy I'll have to make changes to better suit how I intend to use it. My miter saw got a light and new hold down. My MFT table I scrapped the fence hold downs and went with fence dogs. DeWALT DW745 on the way and I'm already scheming a new zero clearance insert and modular outfeed table.
 
If I were FT ( I'm just guessing and looking at this logically or illogically depending on your POV)

I would add a router expension to the the new CS 70. Simular to te ones that they currently have which you can either use with the table saw or as a free standing stand alone unit. Im thinking it could easily be adapted to the CS 70.

So what would stop FT from adding a plate to fit their routers?
well thats what I'm thinking though.

I have been know to be wrong a time or 2.
https://www.woodcraft.com/products/tgp2-27-in-line-router-table-kit

it can be adapted to a bench top router table plus it has a alot of  Kewl accessories for it to, and different tops phenolic, cast iron etc.
https://www.woodcraft.com/products/cast-iron-benchtop-router-table-kit

 
Svar said:
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.

Svar...just take a deep breath and relax.  [smile]

DeformedTree has an opinion and you have an opinion...you’re both entitled to that opinion.

Besides, while you can change the scale on the router, you can’t change the indexing wheel on the height gauge. It will still index in .1 mm increments.

Similar situation to the HKC when I first purchased it, as it was marked in imperial measurements but it only indexed in metric increments.

I spent almost an hour trying to get my IMPERIAL HKC to index in imperial increments. And then I figured it out...the HKC was a gelded tool. That’s still a sore point with me.  [sad]
 
Cheese said:
Svar said:
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.
Besides, while you can change the scale on the router, you can’t change the indexing wheel on the height gauge. It will still index in .1 mm increments.
Yes, but metric is exactly what he wants.
 
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