Festool CMS Router Setup

[Stone Message]

Rick,

I have your manual - an excellent piece of work, like all the others - I did know about the solution but forgot it. I spent zillions of years in the military, and even had a US ID card, and it was so easy then to be reminded of my name by checking the ID card. Thank goodness I can still rely on my credit card for that vital reminder.

Keith

 

[Rick Christopherson]

That was funny....and you got me for about 2 seconds. I found myself quickly diving for google to find out why your moniker was Peter Parfitt if your name was Keith. Duh!  [scared]

We did once have a member here that used the name of an obscure sports hero for his moniker because he didn't want to use his real name.

 

[sancho57]

Hi Ron,

I feel that in a small workshop you are better off with the stand alone CMS as it can be tucked in a corner when not in use, collapsed down if need be or even hung on a wall. As someone, perhaps in this thread, said - having the CMS-VL on your MFT3 makes it bigger, more awkward and difficult to change from one task to another.

Will I see you at D&M on Sat 11th?

Peter

I certainly hope so. I got a clean white shirt to wear while I eat my hotdog :>D

I can see your point, I have a small shop and stand alone CMS. But my thinking is, In a small shop if you attach the VE unit to the MFT you would not have to remove it, fold it up and set it aside and repeat when you have some big stuff to assemble. Then again I got a small shop with 2 MFTs, stand alone CSM, with a ct 22 w/WC and ct 26 w/ boom arm, kapex mft and kapex set up ( used to have the extensions set up but it was to much) and a alot of different guide rails including the 5000 GR and a lot of bessey K body clamps and systainers full of festools. So my shop is rather cramped

 

[sancho57]

Rick is spot on - I kick myself for not realising the same thing as I had to adjust mine when I did the panel raising demo.

Peter

Oh don't kick yourself Peter. After all, real men don't need to read no stinkin' manual.  [tongue] [tongue] [big grin]

Teehehehe.  [big grin] Page 22 of the CMS Supplemental Manual.

Can I kick him ? [big grin]

Actually Rick i didnt think of that. I just was using the largest router bit for panel raising with a back cutter that could fit in the hole. It almost hit the green ring. I thought I had make a sacrificial fence to stop it from hitting the CMS fence. Ill try moving the stops next time.

 

[tjbnwi]

I'm curious. For all those people saying that you have to remove thumbscrews to change router bits, or that the fence is too narrow.....have you not loosened the Fence Limit Screws?

I've never had to remove the fence to change bits, and I've used the largest panel raiser that can fit in the table where it almost touched the green ring for the OF2200.

[attachimg=1]

I have loosened the limit stops and can slide the fences completely off the sub fence. There are still times I have to loosen the sub fence to change the bit. I have a 3-5/8" CMT panel raising bit that I have to use with an auxiliary fence to clear the lower boss on the left side of the CMS sub fence.

Tom

 

[Sparktrician]

I frequently have to remove the fence to remove the reducing rings when I change bits.  I have the fence halves opened up as far as they'll go. 

 

[Rick Christopherson]

Doublecheck your setup (both of you) because you should be able to remove any ring and any size bit without removing the fence.

 

[Rick Christopherson]

I have loosened the limit stops and can slide the fences completely off the sub fence. There are still times I have to loosen the sub fence to change the bit. I have a 3-5/8" CMT panel raising bit that I have to use with an auxiliary fence to clear the lower boss on the left side of the CMS sub fence.

Tom

Oh, the issue isn't about having to loosen the fence. That is a given for changing bits. The original comments were about having to remove the fence.

 

[GarryMartin]

Any chance you or someone can get me a thickness dimension, i.e. what thickness plate would be needed?

Not an easy one to answer as the plate is different thicknesses at different points due to the ribbing/support etc., but mostly where you'll care with regard to creating your own insert, it is approximately 4.5mm.

(Not very good) photo of underside of plate to give you an idea.

[attachthumb=1]

 

[wow]

Any chance you or someone can get me a thickness dimension, i.e. what thickness plate would be needed?

Not an easy one to answer as the plate is different thicknesses at different points due to the ribbing/support etc., but mostly where you'll care with regard to creating your own insert, it is approximately 4.5mm.

(Not very good) photo of underside of plate to give you an idea.

[attachthumb=1]

Thanks for taking the time to do that.

An underside like that is certainly not what i expected. I think I need to try to see one in person - if that's even possible. You'd think that in a metro area of ~3 million people you'd be able to find a dealer who has one on display...

 

[missionman]

I have a CMS and it is a very good router table and like most Festool items you have to get used to the quirks.  But that said if you buy one also buy an after market offset router bit wrench as trying to remove/install wider router bits with a standard festool router bit wrench is nearly impossible.  The space between the router bit and the opening in the surface plate get s so small that it is impossible to get the wrench down to the nut.

 

[Stone Message]

I have the OF2200 in my CMS-OF unit and have no problems getting large cutters in and out - my largest has been a panel raising bit.

Peter

 

[Sparktrician]

Doublecheck your setup (both of you) because you should be able to remove any ring and any size bit without removing the fence.

There were two issues to be illustrated.  First, using a 3-3/8", 15° raised panel bit (shown in the first two photos), I could not use the rings, period (and have to remove the outer ring), and the boss on the left side of the fence's center section (which Tom mentioned also) interfered with raising the bit to normal full height.  I filed off part of the boss to clear the bit, and have seen absolutely no problems resulting from that minor mod.  Second, in the fence's normal (for me) position at "22" on the fence's scale, with the fence halves all the way out (in my normal setup, just enough to clear the 3-3/8" bit), it's not possible to remove the outer reducing ring without loosening the fence hold-down screws, and if I'm going to loosen them, I might as well call it removing the fence.  Semantics, I know.  The inner reducing ring is a no problem thing.  This applies to changing bits as well. 

 

[wow]

Doublecheck your setup (both of you) because you should be able to remove any ring and any size bit without removing the fence.

There were two issues to be illustrated.  First, using a 3-3/8", 15° raised panel bit, I could not use the rings, period, and the boss on the left side of the fence's center section interfered with raising the bit to normal full height. 

i don't understand the problem, Willy - it only intereferes with the bit the FIRST time you use it!

[big grin] [poke]

 

[Sparktrician]

i don't understand the problem, Willy - it only intereferes with the bit the FIRST time you use it!

[big grin] [poke]

Two points, Wayne!!! 

[big grin]

 

[grbmds]

Hi Ron,

I feel that in a small workshop you are better off with the stand alone CMS as it can be tucked in a corner when not in use, collapsed down if need be or even hung on a wall. As someone, perhaps in this thread, said - having the CMS-VL on your MFT3 makes it bigger, more awkward and difficult to change from one task to another.

Will I see you at D&M on Sat 11th?

Peter

This probably has been discussed before, but, besides being able to move the stand alone CMS to a corner, any other advantages you see to the stand alone?

 

[Stone Message]

There are times when you might need an out-feed table which might be difficult with the VL version. With the full version you can use the MFT3 as an out-feed or even in-feed table.

You never know whether one day you might want to operate away from base but only need the CMS-OF and no MFT3.

What happens if you are doing a series of cuts on the MFT3 and each piece needs a wiz on the CMS as well. It could be that the two tasks are incompatible with the VL option.

One day you might need to sell the unit and I bet the stand alone version will sell more quickly and give you a better return on your investment.

I think that the decision should be based on "capability" or "potential" and a separate MFT3 and CMS-OF have far more possibilities in both areas.

Peter

 

[tjbnwi]

I have loosened the limit stops and can slide the fences completely off the sub fence. There are still times I have to loosen the sub fence to change the bit. I have a 3-5/8" CMT panel raising bit that I have to use with an auxiliary fence to clear the lower boss on the left side of the CMS sub fence.

Tom

Oh, the issue isn't about having to loosen the fence. That is a given for changing bits. The original comments were about having to remove the fence.

I think it was the first time I set the CMS up, I figured it was just a matter of removing the stop and just having to loosen the retaining bolts to change the rings/bits. Only times I remove the fence is when I transport the CMS or use the TS-75 insert in the table.

Tom

 

[grbmds]

There are times when you might need an out-feed table which might be difficult with the VL version. With the full version you can use the MFT3 as an out-feed or even in-feed table.

You never know whether one day you might want to operate away from base but only need the CMS-OF and no MFT3.

What happens if you are doing a series of cuts on the MFT3 and each piece needs a wiz on the CMS as well. It could be that the two tasks are incompatible with the VL option.

One day you might need to sell the unit and I bet the stand alone version will sell more quickly and give you a better return on your investment.

I think that the decision should be based on "capability" or "potential" and a separate MFT3 and CMS-OF have far more possibilities in both areas.

Peter

Thanks for the information. I am not quite ready yet to make that kind of investment as I have a router table I built myself a number of years ago with an Incra positioner to position the fence. It's not a CMS  but has been a great tool with a 30+ year old Makita router mounted. Dust collection is a problem and I think the CMS would be a bit more accurate and I think the future investment may be worth it, but I will likely wait till the Makita router dies. It seems like it may last forever and it is very powerful of one made so long ago. No variable speed but I just do the cuts in increments instead.

Randy

 

[Stone Message]

There are times when you might need an out-feed table which might be difficult with the VL version. With the full version you can use the MFT3 as an out-feed or even in-feed table.

You never know whether one day you might want to operate away from base but only need the CMS-OF and no MFT3.

What happens if you are doing a series of cuts on the MFT3 and each piece needs a wiz on the CMS as well. It could be that the two tasks are incompatible with the VL option.

One day you might need to sell the unit and I bet the stand alone version will sell more quickly and give you a better return on your investment.

I think that the decision should be based on "capability" or "potential" and a separate MFT3 and CMS-OF have far more possibilities in both areas.

Peter

Thanks for the information. I am not quite ready yet to make that kind of investment as I have a router table I built myself a number of years ago with an Incra positioner to position the fence. It's not a CMS  but has been a great tool with a 30+ year old Makita router mounted. Dust collection is a problem and I think the CMS would be a bit more accurate and I think the future investment may be worth it, but I will likely wait till the Makita router dies. It seems like it may last forever and it is very powerful of one made so long ago. No variable speed but I just do the cuts in increments instead.

Randy

Super glue in the bearings might do it !

Peter