Festool Customer Service

[oldie]

Hi Barnyard. 
What a pain – well, shock anyway.  Fully understand the emotions. 
Sometimes, things just seem to pile up don’t they?

Not my intention to offend, or, teach granny to suck eggs here – almost
random thoughts on my part.  You’ve put a lot of effort in trying to sort this. 
 
Are you able to test the setup on a different circuit?  Just wondering that’s all –
recognise have checked ‘current’ circuit very thoroughly. 

How quickly does this static manifest itself – pretty quickly, or, does it seem to build up over time. 

Reason I ask is, that you do have a local dealer. 
Maybe, with Festool support, can get the setup to that dealers – hence replicate, or not, the static prob’s being experienced. 

If that could happen, perhaps any down-time will be reduced. 

Best wishes
Richard (UK) 

 

[BarnyardTim]

Good ideas fuzzy, I'll try it out. I'm trying to think of a way to "test" the continuity from hose through vac to ground but I don't know a lot about electricity and I've been zapped enough already, don't want to add any more!

 

[oldie]

[big grin]
I know, I know. 
What sort of person am I?
That did laugh out with you sayin' don't want more shocks... [embarassed]
Conjured up an image of you jumping round the workshop in 'shocked' frustration. 

Richard (UK) 

 

[tjbnwi]

Tom,

This unit was purchased from an authorized online retailer, as I needed the domino XL asap and my local dealer did not have it and said it would be a few weeks until they placed an order. The vac was purchased with the domino to take advantage of the 10% discount. I'm located in the Pittsburgh, PA region.

Tim,

The reason I asked where----was if you were closer you could have used one of my CT's while yours was being serviced.

As much as it seems bad, I can understand your local dealer not being there for you on the CT issue. Contact the on-line dealer see if they'll help you out.

Tom

 

[Brice Burrell]

Tom,

This unit was purchased from an authorized online retailer, as I needed the domino XL asap and my local dealer did not have it and said it would be a few weeks until they placed an order. The vac was purchased with the domino to take advantage of the 10% discount. I'm located in the Pittsburgh, PA region.

I'm in Pittsburgh, I can loan you a Festool vac if needed.

 

[semenza]

Way to go Tom and Brice  [thumbs up]

      Nothing like the FOG for a place to find help !

Seth

 

[Rick Christopherson]

Of course, they told me that the non-Festool tools could be the problem.  This is not accurate, as it is the hose that is shocking me, not the tool. 

Before sending in  your vac, you should know that there is still truth in the assumption that the other tool is causing the shocks. That's because you are holding the tool and your body is being elevated to the static level of the tool. The vac hose is remaining at ground. So when you contact the grounded hose, you get the shock.

It's exactly the same reason why you get shocked turning on a light switch after dragging your feet across the carpet. It isn't the light switch that has the static buildup. It is the light switch that is grounded and taking away YOUR static buildup.

When you are using a non-Festool tool, it may not have a conductive (anti-static) dust port. So it will be isolated from ground. Because you are holding the tool, you will begin to build up some of the static charge caused by the tool. When you touch the hose, the charge is discharged back to ground.

 

[McNally Family]

Of course, they told me that the non-Festool tools could be the problem.  This is not accurate, as it is the hose that is shocking me, not the tool. 

Before sending in  your vac, you should know that there is still truth in the assumption that the other tool is causing the shocks. That's because you are holding the tool and your body is being elevated to the static level of the tool. The vac hose is remaining at ground. So when you contact the grounded hose, you get the shock.

It's exactly the same reason why you get shocked turning on a light switch after dragging your feet across the carpet. It isn't the light switch that has the static buildup. It is the light switch that is grounded and taking away YOUR static buildup.

When you are using a non-Festool tool, it may not have a conductive (anti-static) dust port. So it will be isolated from ground. Because you are holding the tool, you will begin to build up some of the static charge caused by the tool. When you touch the hose, the charge is discharged back to ground.

I wonder if you could explain to me why, when shopping at Sam's warehouse club, I get shocked (static spark), each time I open the metal cooler door where they have the eggs?  It is only that one cooler; none of the others do this.  It is on a concrete floor, and I am wearing tennis shoes.  It surprises me each time (I'm not a trainable monkey I guess).  Would it be some sort of short within the cooler?  Am I running the risk of being electrocuted, should I happen to be standing in spilled water one day?  Should I notify someone with Sam's?  Am I asking too many questions?

 

[danbox]

I have a cheapy dewalt orbital sander that I use out on site sometimes, if I connect this up to a Henry vac, well it's a good job that I don't have a pacemaker because I would not be here now with the shocks that this setup gives out. 

 

[Roseland]

I've never had a shock using a Festool tool with a Festool extractor and just a Festool antistatic hose.

But I do have a 6ft/2m extension non-antistatic hose (non-Festool), and I've had horrible shocks when that's in line.  I've now bought a longer Festool antistatic hose!

Andrew

 

[BarnyardTim]

You guys are awesome!!!  Thank you so much for the generous offers of loaning me a vac.

I decided to do some more investigation this afternoon to see what I could find.  I tested the resistance from the hose cuff to the ground prong on the vac and got no reading.  If I moved it from the cuff to the hose proper, then I got 1.3-1.7 ohms.  I don't know a lot about electricity, but it seems like the ground connection from hose through vac is functioning.  I thought that the cuff was to be anti-static as well??  Maybe I'm misinterpreting my results, but maybe I owe Festool an apology [embarassed]

 

[tjbnwi]

You guys are awesome!!!  Thank you so much for the generous offers of loaning me a vac.

I decided to do some more investigation this afternoon to see what I could find.  I tested the resistance from the hose cuff to the ground prong on the vac and got no reading.  If I moved it from the cuff to the hose proper, then I got 1.3-1.7 ohms.  I don't know a lot about electricity, but it seems like the ground connection from hose through vac is functioning.  I thought that the cuff was to be anti-static as well??  Maybe I'm misinterpreting my results, but maybe I owe Festool an apology [embarassed]

Do the same test with the cuff connected to a tool. Check for the dust port on the tool to the ground. Because the cuffs swivel, there may not be a constant connection if the tool/hose is not moving.

At least you got to vent.

Tom

 

[Rick Christopherson]

I wonder if you could explain to me why, when shopping at Sam's warehouse club, I get shocked (static spark), each time I open the metal cooler door where they have the eggs?  It is only that one cooler; none of the others do this.  It is on a concrete floor, and I am wearing tennis shoes.  It surprises me each time (I'm not a trainable monkey I guess).  Would it be some sort of short within the cooler?  Am I running the risk of being electrocuted, should I happen to be standing in spilled water one day?  Should I notify someone with Sam's?  Am I asking too many questions?

There's not enough information to give you a definitive answer, but I can speculate a little.

If the shock is brief, like what you'd expect from a static shock, then it is likely that the cooler is not grounded and there is a capacitive/inductive charge building up on the handle. The shock is from you neutralizing that charge.  It's not immediately dangerous, except that it suggests that the safety aspect of the cooler is compromised.

 

[TylerC]

[member=60774]BarnyardTim[/member] There's never a need to apologize. My job is to help. If you end up finding that it is a problem with the CT, let me know. (I have a long and well-documented track record of being wrong about things myself. My wife will vouch for this.)

 

[McNally Family]

I wonder if you could explain to me why, when shopping at Sam's warehouse club, I get shocked (static spark), each time I open the metal cooler door where they have the eggs?  It is only that one cooler; none of the others do this.  It is on a concrete floor, and I am wearing tennis shoes.  It surprises me each time (I'm not a trainable monkey I guess).  Would it be some sort of short within the cooler?  Am I running the risk of being electrocuted, should I happen to be standing in spilled water one day?  Should I notify someone with Sam's?  Am I asking too many questions?

There's not enough information to give you a definitive answer, but I can speculate a little.

If the shock is brief, like what you'd expect from a static shock, then it is likely that the cooler is not grounded and there is a capacitive/inductive charge building up on the handle. The shock is from you neutralizing that charge.  It's not immediately dangerous, except that it suggests that the safety aspect of the cooler is compromised.

Thanks for the fast response.  The shock is fast and sudden.  It seems like I can almost hear it (might be my imagination).  I think I will mention it to someone, because it is not normal, and can't be replicated on the other coolers. 

For now, I will just let my Wife get the eggs, as she is heavily insured anyway.....

 

[Rick Christopherson]

I decided to do some more investigation this afternoon to see what I could find.  I tested the resistance from the hose cuff to the ground prong on the vac and got no reading.  If I moved it from the cuff to the hose proper, then I got 1.3-1.7 ohms.

I'm surprised you got any reading, but the fact that you did, definitively tells you that the vac itself is not at fault. The reason why you don't normally get a reading from conductive plastics is because they normally rely on a large surface area for their conductivity. A small point-contact is still typically going to be high resistance.

Your resistance readings don't definitively point to the cuff as being the problem, but they also don't eliminate it as a cause either. Either way, what I said in my previous posting still applies. You have an electrical disconnect between the hose and the tool. This could be in the cuff, or it could be in the tool's port.

If this occurs with any (all) of your tools, then you know it is the cuff. If it occurs only with certain tools, then it is more likely to be the tool.

 

[Rick Christopherson]

I think I will mention it to someone, because it is not normal, and can't be replicated on the other coolers. 

Yes, mention it. But mention it as a missing ground, at least for now. There's not enough information to know whether it is more than just that yet.

 

[McNally Family]

I decided to do some more investigation this afternoon to see what I could find.  I tested the resistance from the hose cuff to the ground prong on the vac and got no reading.  If I moved it from the cuff to the hose proper, then I got 1.3-1.7 ohms.

I'm surprised you got any reading, but the fact that you did, definitively tells you that the vac itself is not at fault. The reason why you don't normally get a reading from conductive plastics is because they normally rely on a large surface area for their conductivity. A small point-contact is still typically going to be high resistance.

Your resistance readings don't definitively point to the cuff as being the problem, but they also don't eliminate it as a cause either. Either way, what I said in my previous posting still applies. You have an electrical disconnect between the hose and the tool. This could be in the cuff, or it could be in the tool's port.

If this occurs with any (all) of your tools, then you know it is the cuff. If it occurs only with certain tools, then it is more likely to be the tool.

I just purchased the Festool RS 2E sander, and on the underside of the silver dust port, it was missing a small square patch of the silver color, exposing the darker grey body color.  The missing patch was consistent in shape, eliminating the idea of it being a scratch.  I naturally freaked out and was convinced it was a manufacturing defect, but further investigation with Festool (Bob Marino and Festool Service Manager), determined it was an intentional act by Festool to improve the electrical connectivity of the tool to the anti-static hose.    So the problem can exist with certain Festool tools.

 

[rst]

McNally, I've done a ton of work in industrial and commercial site where you could get rapped off a ground wire.  When I first started doing automatic door service that little tweak and sparking scared the doo doo out of me.  After talking to the electronic electricians I was told that this happens when the gauge of of the ground wire is not sufficient to carry the load and is common in large installations where there are extremely long lines and some scrimped on wire gauge.  Scary but not lethal...usually  [embarassed]

 

[Nat X]

Mort,

Here's an analogy you might understand. You need a new car wanting "the best" as far as quality and reliability you choose a BMW. Shortly after purchase, something lets go in the engine. You take it down to the local BMW dealer and they say: Mort, don't worry we will evaluate and repair free of charge, however we can't evaluate here we need to ship it back to Germany to be evaluated but don't worry we will pay the shipping. We can't provide you with a loaner BMW as that's not our policy, and no you can't have one of the 25 others that are sitting on the lot. Maybe you can go by a cheap Chevy to use while we evaluate yours.

If you actually want to go with a car analogy, this thread is more like you calling up BMW headquarters, telling the receptionist that your car is defective and demanding that they dispatch mechanics directly to your house immediately or else you're going to write an angry letter to your congressperson.

I know of no manufacturer of anything anywhere in the world that sends out free replacements without setting eyes on the defective product unless said product is so cheap that the return shipping isn't worth the expense to them.