Festool LR32, how-To

[Brice Burrell]

Thanks for the pictorial, Brice.  I guess I just wasn't reading the instructions that came with my LR32 correctly.   :

You were reading them clearly, its just that they aren't very clear.

Is 22.5mm from the edge a standard for the Euro hinges (I use Blum)?  How do you deal with face-frame vs Euro cabinetry?  For instance, my doors are all 1" wider than the cabinet opening width due to my 1/2" overlay.  Does that mean I'd need to set the offset guides to 35.2mm (25.4/2+22.5)?  My next project (garage) will likely be frameless, but the wife prefers traditional face-frames.

  Best advice here, read the instructions that come with your hinges they will be very clear on the layout.

 

[Brice Burrell]

Brice,
Regarding your goof, I find it safer to travel in reverse, so you push the hose, not pull.
Give'r a try if you havn't already
Mirko

Mirko, now you tell me! Just kidding, I have run miles of shelf pin holes in melamine, so I did pick this up along the way. I had the router placed on the rail all the way to the right to get it in the picture, then I just started running it from there. Normally I would start from the left and work my way to the right. This is however, the first time I drilled a hole in the wrong place (well, with this jig anyhow  ;D ) figures it would happen when I post it on the net!
Mirko is right,  I am glad you pointed this out, I forgot to put it in.

 

[John Stevens]

Nice job, Brice, but when you do the edits for the final draft, you might want to mention:

1.  In regard to cabinet sides, the LR-32 is designed to work with sides that are even multiples of 32mm.  If the user deviates from that, it's a lot more time-consuming to use it.

2.  In regard to cabinet doors, the LR-32 is designed to work with doors that are "full overlay" in the top to bottom direction (which is why I put "full overlay" in quotation marks) to fit sides that are even multiples of 32mm.  (The LR-32 will also work regardless of whether the cabinet door is "full overlay top-to-bottom" as long as door length is an even multiple of 16mm, but the odds of that are slim.)  If the user deviates from that, it's a lot more time-consuming to use the LR-32.

3.  The setting of the side stops for the hinge cup hole will depend on the hinge, the thickness of the cabinet sides, and the overlay of the door (side to side).  Definitely need to check the mfr's recommendations, and it helps to do a few mock-ups with some scrap if you haven't previously used the particular hinge with material of the thickness that you're using.

Regards,

John

 

[Brice Burrell]

Nice job, Brice, but when you do the edits for the final draft, you might want to mention:

1.  In regard to cabinet sides, the LR-32 is designed to work with sides that are even multiples of 32mm.  If the user deviates from that, it's a lot more time-consuming to use it.

This is why I wanted to do the tutorial, people really seem to misunderstand the LR32. John, that is incorrect, the jig was not designed for even multiples of 32mm. This "how-to" looked very easy, did it not, and not too time consuming, right? My door and cab side were not multiples of 32mm. This is why I made it very clear that the jig needed to be indexed on the same end of the work piece every time, in the tutorial the "top". The LR32's instructions also tell you to index the jig the same, they just do a poor job of it. If you use multiples of 32mm the jig is no longer left or right specific, meaning you can index it from either end of the work piece, at the cost limiting the size to multiples of 32mm. So, that brings up the question, is it faster to use multiples of 32mm, I say no, it does take out a little thinking, but not really easier. Unless you use Mirko's jig, see his great jig.http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=452.0

2.  In regard to cabinet doors, the LR-32 is designed to work with doors that are "full overlay" in the top to bottom direction

This is true, and I should have made that more clear.

........to fit sides that are even multiples of 32mm.  (The LR-32 will also work regardless of whether the cabinet door is "full overlay top-to-bottom" as long as door length is an even multiple of 16mm, but the odds of that are slim.)  If the user deviates from that, it's a lot more time-consuming to use the LR-32.

Again see above.

3.The setting of the side stops for the hinge cup hole will depend on the hinge, the thickness of the cabinet sides, and the overlay of the door (side to side).  Definitely need to check the mfr's recommendations, and it helps to do a few mock-ups with some scrap if you haven't previously used the particular hinge with material of the thickness that you're using.

Absolutely, John is right, you do need to make a mock-up.
Thanks John.
Brice

 

[Mirko]

The intended purpose of my jig was to make doing multiples as quickly as possible, and at the same time, in a Carefree manor. I really do not have to think every time I need to drill a door.
I have worked in custom millwork shops for 16 years, and everyone of them has a system, I began my trade just as the CNC machines from europe, were beginning to make an impact in north america. I watched as each shop, one at a time began to swich over to CNC machinery. The younger people cought on quikly but the "old Timers" could not give up there systems, so they where in a way, forced to move on.
I am somewhere in between I was fortunate to learn the European system early on. Once I finished my apprenticeship the Company that sponsered me was at the stage were 50 % of the people working there were in an office type setting. The reason for this was if your good, you go work in the office programing.
I was a purist who liked the idea of the CNC machine, but could not work in a shop that had you in front of a machine loading parts, or walking around supervising.
I finaly settled at a shop that had two of these CNC routers, but there was only one guy in the office, and the reason for that was the people that were working in the shop had all the experience and the guy in the office along with the two machine operators, where just tools. This system worked great because the people with the passion for woodworking had all the control, we simply could aproach the CNC operator with are sketches and he would route out our parts for us.
This became the perfect balance of new and old to form the best system for what we were trying to produce.
To sum up what I am trying to say is, to me, the Festool system is doing what the CNC industry did, but this time it is suited for the small one man shops. I continue to be surprised by these tools and the level of quality they can produce.
Its fair to say that The LR32 can produce the same quality as a CNC machine(250,000$), the TS plung saws cut like European CNC panel Saws(150,000$)and the dust colection and sanders are better that what most shops have (NO JOKE) I could not do what I do without these tools, is the bottom line. The efficiency that it brings to a one man shop is really amazing!
ramble ramble yadda yadda

Mirko

 

[John Stevens]

...the jig was not designed for even multiples of 32mm. This "how-to" looked very easy, did it not, and not too time consuming, right?

I've owned the LR-32 for a couple years and have used it almost exclusively on cabinet sides that are not multiples of 32mm.  I'm glad that you found your "demo run" to be easy, but after you use your LR-32 on cabinet sides of many different lengths, you might find that--depending on the length--it can be fairly inconvenient (i.e. time consuming) to clamp the guide rail to the work piece while simultaneously clamping the work piece to a stable surface such as the MFT or a work bench.  In those situations, I think it's very convenient (i.e., time-saving) to have a stop firmly butted up against each end...hence the advantage of sticking to cabinet sides that are multiples of 32mm. 

Regardless of that, your reply to my post has helped me see the obvious--that different people have different ideas about what is "very easy" and what is "a lot more time consuming."  It's your tutorial, so you get the final say.

Regards,

John

 

[Hotwheels]

I have been on the fence about the LR 32 -- I have some kitchen cabinets to make as well as some library shelves. A shelf drilling method is important, but if the i LR 32 takes more time and effort with non-multiples of 32mm, then it makes me think again. On the other hand, there do not seem to be too many other options ... If you have used the LR 32, is there a need to consider modifying cabinet design so that everything is a multiple of 32mm? This means some adjustments in materials and setup for other machines, or at least that is the way I read it.
Thanks

 

[Michael Kellough]

... If you have used the LR 32, is there a need to consider modifying cabinet design so that everything is a multiple of 32mm? This means some adjustments in materials and setup for other machines, or at least that is the way I read it.
Thanks

Adopting the 32mm system is the most practical adjustment and easier than you think. If your cabinet plans are not presently a multiple of 32mm the maximum adjustment you'd have to make is about +/- 5/8". Not a big deal unless all your parts are already cut.

(If I remember correctly)...You only NEED to use a multiple of 32mm IF you have panels that are longer than your guide rail AND you want to use the end stop blocks from both ends. If you work up from just one end (with a short guide rail) you'll have to make a measurement to maintain the 32mm pattern but the length of the workpiece doesn't have a be a multiple of anything. If you are doing a bunch of pieces just make a gauge stick to offset the guide rail up from the start end and there won't be any chance of measurement errors.

 

[Brice Burrell]

.......but after you use your LR-32 on cabinet sides of many different lengths, you might find that--depending on the length--it can be fairly inconvenient (i.e. time consuming) to clamp the guide rail to the work piece while simultaneously clamping the work piece to a stable surface such as the MFT or a work bench.  In those situations, I think it's very convenient (i.e., time-saving) to have a stop firmly butted up against each end...hence the advantage of sticking to cabinet sides that are multiples of 32mm......

  I agree with you that clamping is the most inconvenient part of the LR32 system. John when you use multiples of 32mm do you still clamp, if not, I can see how that would be way easier, I don't think I would trust doing that way.
Brice

 

[Brice Burrell]

Adopting the 32mm system is the most practical adjustment and easier than you think. If your cabinet plans are not presently a multiple of 32mm the maximum adjustment you'd have to make is about +/- 5/8". Not a big deal unless all your parts are already cut.

Agreed.

(If I remember correctly)...You only NEED to use a multiple of 32mm IF you have panels that are longer than your guide rail AND you want to use the end stop blocks from both ends.

This is a true statement, but I don't think this is a good reason to use a multiple of 32mm. See below.

If you work up from just one end (with a short guide rail) you'll have to make a measurement to maintain the 32mm pattern but the length of the workpiece doesn't have a be a multiple of anything. If you are doing a bunch of pieces just make a gauge stick to offset the guide rail up from the start end and there won't be any chance of measurement errors.

  The easy way, after you run all the holes you can with your rail, put the side stops back on, side the rail down, with the router still on the rail but back to the first hole, now line up the router bit with your last hole plunge the bit into the hole to line up your 32mm offset ( edit: this is done with the router turned off), put a clamp on rail on the far side. I leave the sidestop on the end that is not clamped, you will have to drill some holes, stop and relocate the sidestop.

 

[Brice Burrell]

I have been on the fence about the LR 32 -- I have some kitchen cabinets to make as well as some library shelves. A shelf drilling method is important, but if the i LR 32 takes more time and effort with non-multiples of 32mm, then it makes me think again. On the other hand, there do not seem to be too many other options ... If you have used the LR 32, is there a need to consider modifying cabinet design so that everything is a multiple of 32mm? This means some adjustments in materials and setup for other machines, or at least that is the way I read it.
Thanks

  John, you have options, search the net, they are out there. I happen to like the LR32 . To answer your question the only adjustment you would need to make is the length of the sides and doors of the cabinets.

 

[John Stevens]

John when you use multiples of 32mm do you still clamp, if not, I can see how that would be way easier, I don't think I would trust doing that way.

Yeah, you still need to clamp to keep the whole workpiece & guide rail from moving, but with the end-stops taking care of the side-to-side movement, it's easier to find ways to locate the clamps and keep the whole shebang on the front edge of the workbench or MFT, close within arm's reach.  Simplification of the clamping decisions is one of the great values of Mirko's method.  Between his thread and Michael Kellough's post above, the light bulb has gone on, and I'll probably stick to 32mm increments in the future.

Regards,

John

 

[Brice Burrell]

I added some video of the LR32 in action. On YouTube,

I hope to start a new thread on the modified use of the LR32, using it with jigs, differant clamps and with multiples of 32mm. It should be fun. Well I have to get back to my taxes :'(

 

[Dave Ronyak]

I received my LR32 and basic router hole drilling jig last week.  I am happy to see that Festool updated the router guide plate so the same product number can be used with a 1010 or 1400 router.  I have not actually used it yet to make any holes, but did the basic calibration of the guide rail stops, put the guide plate on the guide rail and adjusted the black plastic followers on the router guide plate so their was no slop, then mounted and centered my OF 1400 router just to make certain everything worked as it should.  One nuisance I encountered was rubbing contact of the bottom of the router guide plate with the LR32 guide rail just outside (towards the rubber edge strip) of where the guide plate is bent up and over the ridge formed in the guide rail.  On my guide plate, there is no contact between the bottom of the black plastic followers on the guide plate and the top surface of the guide rail.  Is my plate slightly bent?  Should those black plastic followers bear on the rear green Teflon strip?  To eliminate the metal-to-metal contact between the guide plate and the rail, I placed a couple of small pieces of 3/4" self-adhesive UHMW PE tape on the bottom of the guide plate.  Now the plate glides very smoothly relative to the guide rail.  Another way to address this same problem would be to add some tape to the bottom of those black plastic followers, or to remove those followers (they are screwed on) and shim between them and the guide plate so the bottom surfaces of the followers would contact the back Teflon (green) strip on the guide rail and prevent any metal-to-metal contact between the guide plate and the guide rail.

Dave R.

 

[Dan Clark]

I added some video of the LR32 in action. On YouTube,

I hope to start a new thread on the modified use of the LR32, using it with jigs, differant clamps and with multiples of 32mm. It should be fun. Well I have to get back to my taxes :'(

Brice,

Thanks!  It never fails to amaze me how well a short video can quickly reveal process details.   

What kind of camera did you use to take the video? 

Regards,

Dan.

 

[Dan Uhlir]

Thanks Brice

                That was cool.

 

[ejantny]

Watching the video helped me save some time setting up and faster routing the holes. Thanks for taking the time to create the video.

 

[Brice Burrell]

  Dave, you can see in the picture that my base rubs a little too, its not a problem for me. I think we are talking about the same place?? You can't tell from this pic, but the black plastic followers on the guide plate don't touch the guide rail. If you think you have too much friction you can call Festool, they may well send you another one.

Dan C, Dan U and EJ, I'm glad the video helped, this how-to really needed some video to show just how easy this is.

Dan C, the digital camera I used for the video was the same one I used for the pictures, my 3 year old Canon power shot A510, about $200. Just outside the shot I had two clamps lights with 100 watt bulbs right above my MFT and the video is still a little dark  :

 

[John Stevens]

I added some video of the LR32 in action.

Great video, Brice, thanks for making it and sharing it here.  Looking forward to your new thread.

Regards,

John

 

[Dave Ronyak]

Brice,

Great photo!  It shows metal to metal contact exactly where I was trying to describe.  A couple of short pieces cut from adhesive backed PE tape fixed that contact for me.  I've got to try and see if I can mount my Domino on that base and use it with the LR32.

Dave R.