Festool Work App

[tigger]

Can anyone PLEASE explain to me why this app is not available in New Zealand?  [blink]

It makes no sense to me especially considering that I have just taken delivery of the CSC 50 table saw and the electronics are playing up. I've seen online that firmware updates are done through this app. BUT, as its not available here I'm stuck waiting for Germany to get back to my tool shop. [crying]

I'm not new to the Festool platform (25 years in) I use Festool exclusively in my business. I suppose I'm just not used to something like this from Festool  [embarassed]

 

[Magpal]

Unfortunately, this is also the case for Norway. Very strange approach to me and I really hope it will be available soon.

 

[mino]

Before anything, I would raise a phone call to your local Festool support contact and make some proper noise. Especially if this is needed to resolve a known bug.

That is the only way to get things moving.
This forum is run by Festool USA who cannot really help you with NZ issues.

-----
I think they made error in making country-specific profiles for the app for some things like support contacts etc. This forces them to first make a profile of a country before "releasing" it and they still did not get to it for all countries.

You can still download the apk though and install it locally - there are various sites that allow that e.g.:https://apkpure.com/festool-work-app/com.festool.apps.powertools

Not sure if firmware update would work that way, but the pairing itself should as it does not need internet connectivity. Do note though that the app is using your "My Festool" account for a lot of things, which may be a challenge if you do not have the program active in NZ.

IMO a better approach would have been to force these links via the "Sales/Shop" companion app *or* have a whitelist (where a profile is available) coupled to a "generic" profile that has just links to a generic festool.com support page. Plus allow basic tasks to be done offline/without a Festool account. The serial of the tool should be sufficient to check for theft, support contract, etc.

If IBM or Lenovo can work this way with $1M kit, surely Festool can ..

 

[Chainring]

[member=61254]mino[/member]

I had to do the apk sideloading thing for a while here in the US and firmware updates, at least for batteries and other tools, worked. I'd guess the CSC 50 will work. Finally, Festool released the app for the US. Hopefully the rest of the world gets it soon.

 

[LazyGretlWoodWorks]

My day job (for the next year or so 'til I can escape), I work in tech doing application and systems programming. I've been in tech most of my life, along with woodworking and carpentry.

This entire concern feels like a "let's use tech because we can" more than it solves any real need.

Sorry you have to deal with this; people working as my... peers?... consistently find ways to shove tech in places it might not always need to be.  

“Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.” -- Dr. Ian Malcolm

 

[mino]

This entire concern feels like a "let's use tech because we can" more than it solves any real need.

Agreed in general but not here.

With the Bluetooth batteries and some more complicated tools - the CSC 50 is essentially a "mini CNC" - is it really "tech for the tech sake" ? I do not think so. Using a standard tech like BT and standard thing like a phone app for this is actually the "low tech", non-proprietary, approach these days.

Besides, Festool actually is the pioneer of advanced electronics in tools. Constant-speed sawing, drilling or routing was a game changer when they introduced it across the board. E.g. the OF 2200 is what it is thanks to that.
I still remember how big a thing this was 25 yrs ago when they sold their first "full-wave" corded tools. I had the Protool variety then and it was night/day compared to the "traditional" competition when using a speed-controlled angle grinder under load. There was just no comparison. I see the CSC 50 in the same way.

Ref. BT and the Work app, I for one love the fact I can query the batteries status. Including cycles and capacity. I will not do this daily, not even weekly, but when I need it, it is priceless. For this reason only I have actually decided to go BT-only even with the small 3.1 packs. Being effectively blind to how good a pack is can be a pain. For one, I no longer need to mark my packs to know which is which ...

To each his own.

 

[tigger]

Thanks. Appreciate your reply.

I've taken all the steps I can with supplier and Festool Rep.
I am still waiting for response from Germany.

Interestingly, my supplier has an overload error while demonstrating the saw for a client in store. He wasn't cutting anything. He just switched it on. [blink] Lost that sale  [crying]

Before anything, I would raise a phone call to your local Festool support contact and make some proper noise. Especially if this is needed to resolve a known bug.

That is the only way to get things moving.
This forum is run by Festool USA who cannot really help you with NZ issues.

-----
I think they made error in making country-specific profiles for the app for some things like support contacts etc. This forces them to first make a profile of a country before "releasing" it and they still did not get to it for all countries.

You can still download the apk though and install it locally - there are various sites that allow that e.g.:https://apkpure.com/festool-work-app/com.festool.apps.powertools

Not sure if firmware update would work that way, but the pairing itself should as it does not need internet connectivity. Do note though that the app is using your "My Festool" account for a lot of things, which may be a challenge if you do not have the program active in NZ.

IMO a better approach would have been to force these links via the "Sales/Shop" companion app *or* have a whitelist (where a profile is available) coupled to a "generic" profile that has just links to a generic festool.com support page. Plus allow basic tasks to be done offline/without a Festool account. The serial of the tool should be sufficient to check for theft, support contract, etc.

If IBM or Lenovo can work this way with $1M kit, surely Festool can ..

 

[tigger]

Cheers Ian

Just frustrating. As I stated before, its just not what I'm used to from Festool.  [unsure]

My day job (for the next year or so 'til I can escape), I work in tech doing application and systems programming. I've been in tech most of my life, along with woodworking and carpentry.

This entire concern feels like a "let's use tech because we can" more than it solves any real need.

Sorry you have to deal with this; people working as my... peers?... consistently find ways to shove tech in places it might not always need to be.  

“Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.” -- Dr. Ian Malcolm

 

[tigger]

Hey Mino

Cheers for the reply. I like the innovation too. I just wished it would work for us. As I mentioned in a reply above. My supplier had a system overload error just by switching on the saw in store to show a customer. He lost the sale because of it. I just hold Festool to a higher standard as they have almost always been faultless as a brand and a tool manufacturer. I own just about every tool they make, and that's not an exaggeration for effect. My supplier sends his customers to my workshop to look at various tools because he doesn't stock everything.
I'm heavily invested for over 25 years. I buy almost every new tool they bring on the market. They are just that good. But what happened here?

I'm used to everything they make just working. With the CSC, this is not the case out of the box. All I need is an answer. I'm confident I'll get one and all will be sorted. This is just so "left field" for me.

Cheers

This entire concern feels like a "let's use tech because we can" more than it solves any real need.

Agreed in general but not here.

With the Bluetooth batteries and some more complicated tools - the CSC 50 is essentially a "mini CNC" - is it really "tech for the tech sake" ? I do not think so. Using a standard tech like BT and standard thing like a phone app for this is actually the "low tech", non-proprietary, approach these days.

Besides, Festool actually is the pioneer of advanced electronics in tools. Constant-speed sawing, drilling or routing was a game changer when they introduced it across the board. E.g. the OF 2200 is what it is thanks to that.
I still remember how big a thing this was 25 yrs ago when they sold their first "full-wave" corded tools. I had the Protool variety then and it was night/day compared to the "traditional" competition when using a speed-controlled angle grinder under load. There was just no comparison. I see the CSC 50 in the same way.

Ref. BT and the Work app, I for one love the fact I can query the batteries status. Including cycles and capacity. I will not do this daily, not even weekly, but when I need it, it is priceless. For this reason only I have actually decided to go BT-only even with the small 3.1 packs. Being effectively blind to how good a pack is can be a pain. For one, I no longer need to mark my packs to know which is which ...

To each his own.

 

[mino]

Hey Mino

Cheers for the reply. I like the innovation too. ...

Fully aligned. In no way was I to suggest stuff breaking/non-working prior to a firmware update is "OK" or even desirable. The comment was more that it is a very advanced tool in a low tech space. A tool which *relies* on non-trivial firmware for its primary function.

Unlike with a drill, the ability to /not a requirement to (!)/ update the firmware by the customer, without a need to ship it to Festool, is a desirable capability. End of the point to me made there.

That and the fact #@&$ happens means that *for me as a customer* I would rather have the possibility than not. I.e., it is not a gimmick. In this case.

The fact the saw is unstable/crashing. Whatever the cause. Is a completely different matter. Actually, it is a service matter where /should the firmware update capability be not present/ the standard recourse for would be to ship it back for a "repair".

Hope turns out good!

 

[tigger]

[member=61254]mino[/member]

Cheers

I've checked the firmware and I have version 6. I noticed on Festool Live on YouTube that Sedge's saw was version 7. Festool Germany's response has been that I download the new version from the Festool App!!!!!!!  [huh]
Ummmm  [tongue] That's kinda the problem!  [big grin]

Anyway, the Festool importer here in NZ has written back and asked them to make the App available in our region. Will see how long that takes.  [tongue]

So the story goes that the CSC 50 was manufactured about a year ago. Boxed up and not released as Festool was waiting for the 8AH batteries. When these took too long, they released it to us on this side of the world with version 6 firmware installed. Sedge from Festool has been using his saw for almost a year and has access to the app so he's been able to update his saw. My saw has been boxed up for a year, so I doubt they would unbox all the CSC'c and update them. So I may be the first to get the saw, but will probably be the last to be able to use it!  [big grin]
I believe 20th September is the release date for North America.

Here's hoping we get the app sooner rather than later

Hey Mino

Cheers for the reply. I like the innovation too. ...

Fully aligned. In no way was I to suggest stuff breaking/non-working prior to a firmware update is "OK" or even desirable. The comment was more that it is a very advanced tool in a low tech space. A tool which *relies* on non-trivial firmware for its primary function.

Unlike with a drill, the ability to /not a requirement to (!)/ update the firmware by the customer, without a need to ship it to Festool, is a desirable capability. End of the point to me made there.

That and the fact #@&$ happens means that *for me as a customer* I would rather have the possibility than not. I.e., it is not a gimmick. In this case.

The fact the saw is unstable/crashing. Whatever the cause. Is a completely different matter. Actually, it is a service matter where /should the firmware update capability be not present/ the standard recourse for would be to ship it back for a "repair".

Hope turns out good!

 

[Coen]

The bigger question is why there is an app in the first place.

The stupid duopoly of Apple and Google needs to die along with the stupid geo restrictions.

Companies should make websites that actually work instead of make platform-specific apps that don't work.

 

[unknown user]

Sorry you have to deal with this; people working as my... peers?... consistently find ways to shove tech in places it might not always need to be.  

Hey there buddy, keep complaining and they will start including blockchain, AI and whatever unicorn tech du jour is popular. Just be glad there are no Festool NFTs  [big grin]

 

[mino]

Hey there buddy, keep complaining and they will start including blockchain, AI and whatever unicorn tech du jour is popular. Just be glad there are no Festool NFTs  [big grin]

Do not provoke The Borg!

 

[jeh]

The bigger question is why there is an app in the first place.

The stupid duopoly of Apple and Google needs to die along with the stupid geo restrictions.

Companies should make websites that actually work instead of make platform-specific apps that don't work.

Ignorance of the difference in capabilities of web apps and native applications is a shame. As for the Duopoly, there is no one stopping anyone from starting another company and developing their own App Store. Microsoft and Amazon tried and failed. Keep in mind there were no apps of any value on any phone other than email and messaging on RIM phones. Apple entered the field and created a phone that people wanted and was unlike any phone on the market. They also created the concept of free software upgrades/updates, which you are not required to take, and an App Store allowing tens of thousands of people to profiteer.

Additionally no one is forcing anyone to use an Apple or Android phone. There are flip phones available for those wanting simplicity.

As for geofencing that is set by the person/company submitting the app although there might be some governments (eg China) that have there own restrictions of certain types of apps.

 

[Coen]

The bigger question is why there is an app in the first place.

The stupid duopoly of Apple and Google needs to die along with the stupid geo restrictions.

Companies should make websites that actually work instead of make platform-specific apps that don't work.

Ignorance of the difference in capabilities of web apps and native applications is a shame.

Yes, sadly.

As for the Duopoly, there is no one stopping anyone from starting another company and developing their own App Store. Microsoft and Amazon tried and failed.

Microsoft dominated the market before Android and the iPhone, but they didn't have a closed system with an "app store". The whole concept of a closed system should die. Governments all over the place went after Microsoft for the tied sale of windows and internet explorer. That is peanuts compared to what Google and Apple get away with. So really... yes; there is "someone" stopping certain parties but not others.

Keep in mind there were no apps of any value on any phone other than email and messaging on RIM phones.

Back time there existed a lot of pda / mobile specific versions of websites that even back then worked faster then the current apps. Like the biggest train company had mobiel.ns.nl that was a text-only website that told me everything I needed to know. I could enter origin train station and destination, also using the station's 2/3 letter abbreviations and it would return a valid travel plan. It took them years after letting they disappeared the mobile website to even integrate taking abbreviations in the android / iOs "app".

Back then phones also came by default with the ability to locally sync mail, contacts, files and agenda... before the trade in personal info became the main goal...

Apple entered the field and created a phone that people wanted

Apple can make literally make a turd and people will buy it as they are a cult.
They (Apple) played it right though. Slowly "upgrading" it with more features, each time getting huge media attention for adding stuff that my 1/10th the price Nokia had at release.

and was unlike any phone on the market. They also created the concept of free software upgrades/updates, which you are not required to take, and an App Store allowing tens of thousands of people to profiteer.

My phone with Windows Mobile received updates before Apple even had an iPhone, so no they didn't create the concept.

Additionally no one is forcing anyone to use an Apple or Android phone. There are flip phones available for those wanting simplicity.

Not true as more and more government services are only offered to holders of either iOs or Android phone.

As for geofencing that is set by the person/company submitting the app although there might be some governments (eg China) that have there own restrictions of certain types of apps.

Yeah well, it should die. If you read this topic... you already know of one good reason why.

 

[demographic]

Hmm, kind of a shame cos the CSC 50 seemed like a decent tool but the Plug and Play seems to be rather more Faff About, Plug, Dont Play, More Faff, Plug, Maybe Play..

 

[LazyGretlWoodWorks]

Hmm, kind of a shame cos the CSC 50 seemed like a decent tool but the Plug and Play seems to be rather more Faff About, Plug, Dont Play, More Faff, Plug, Maybe Play..

Bluetooth sucks, across the board. We, the consumers and the silly retail MFGs catering to us, are using it far, far beyond its specified capabilities and are, most of the time, relying on luck and limited range to get its job done for us.

I work in tech; the collisions and overlap in BT and the signal interruptors are brain-teasingly numerous.

 

[demographic]

Hmm, kind of a shame cos the CSC 50 seemed like a decent tool but the Plug and Play seems to be rather more Faff About, Plug, Dont Play, More Faff, Plug, Maybe Play..

Bluetooth sucks, across the board. We, the consumers and the silly retail MFGs catering to us, are using it far, far beyond its specified capabilities and are, most of the time, relying on luck and limited range to get its job done for us.

I work in tech; the collisions and overlap in BT and the signal interruptors are brain-teasingly numerous.

I'm not sure I'd go that far, the bluetooth xonnection between the battery on my HKCa saw and CTM26 works well, however I'll avoid anything loke the plague if it looks to be unreliable.
Oh and I'm just not dicking about downloading firmware for a battery, thats the manufacturers problem to get right.

 

[Coen]

Hmm, kind of a shame cos the CSC 50 seemed like a decent tool but the Plug and Play seems to be rather more Faff About, Plug, Dont Play, More Faff, Plug, Maybe Play..

Bluetooth sucks, across the board. We, the consumers and the silly retail MFGs catering to us, are using it far, far beyond its specified capabilities and are, most of the time, relying on luck and limited range to get its job done for us.

I work in tech; the collisions and overlap in BT and the signal interruptors are brain-teasingly numerous.

Ghehe, same with the Bosch Bluetooth stuff. I have their GAL 18v-160 C charger. Main reason; you can use it to charge batteries to 50% so they degrade five times slower (compared to storing at 100% charge). You can "connect" with it using an app... two of out three times it doesn't "see" the charger, but after unplugging the charger a few times and restarting the app... it usually comes to live. Then I set the charger to "by default" charge to 50%... but if on a big job... it needs to go back to 100%... then the 'faffing about' starts once again  [huh]