Hand plane 101

[ear3]

I read that too, and that's what I understood.  I think it was pretty extreme in this case, though, given that only the corner of the blade was in contact with the stone when at rest in the guide.  Unlike when I hooked up to the cambered roller, where the blade edge is parallel and in full contact with the surface.

Guess I should ask for a new one also because my micro-bevels are all a little skewed. However, in the instructions they indicate that this may happen and that it doesn't make any difference. Given that all my research and experience (somewhat limited) which hand sharpening always showed a "perfectly" straight secondary bevel I was skeptical. Since I go directly to the micro step without removing the chisel from the MKII, I couldn't understand it. I asked that very question of the Fine Woodworking guys and, while I suppose they aren't the final word, they unanimously agreed that this skewing of the micro bevel isn't performance degrading. And, to be honest, my chisels sharpened with the jig are so much sharper than anything else I have used, I stopped worrying about it. (Of course, it could be that my other sharpening methods were just that much worse, but the bottom line is that I'm happen even though the micro isn't straight across.)  Thanks for the heads up though. I might just contact Veritas and ask them about it.

 

[Corwin]

I have the same issue with the micro bevel with the Veritas Jig I purchased earlier this year too. And, I too saw where they mentioned this in their instructions. Still, I do wish the jig worked without skewing the micro bevel like this...

 

[grbmds]

I have the same issue with the micro bevel with the Veritas Jig I purchased earlier this year too. And, I too saw where they mentioned this in their instructions. Still, I do wish the jig worked without skewing the micro bevel like this...

Maybe we should all call register our concerns.

 

[ear3]

Got the replacement in the mail yesterday!  Didn't have time to go through a full process of sharpening, but I did set it up with a square plane blade to check it's registration relative to a flat surface, and found that the new unit keeps the entire edge in contact with the surface.  So it looks like the problem has been resolved. 

 

[ear3]

I'm pretty psyched. Just jointed one face of some 8/4 walnut for a last minute commission I was handed. It's going on a CNC machine 4 fabrication and so it had to be completely true. Because there was a small twist in it I wouldn't have been able to work that out by just skip planing it, but the jack plane came to the rescue.  EDIT: Gonna have to reconfigure my shop dust collection at some point.  The lengthwise shavings I took of this three foot board invariably clogged the 2 1/2" hose of my shop vac.  I felt like a barber sweeping up hair clippings at the end of the day when I cleaned up last night -- the pile of shavings was huge.

 

[Patrick Cox]

Great discussion here.  I am learning a lot!  Since I don't have a table saw, jointer or planer, (and I really have no plans to purchase these large power tools), I am thinking about picking up a couple of hand planes for dimensioning wood so this has been helpful.  I had a question on your bench [member=37411]Edward A Reno III[/member] .  How is the base constructed?  I guess it is sturdy enough for hand planing?  Right now I only have an MFT3 as a work bench but the legs are not really that sturdy.  I am considering building a more sturdy base with storage underneath for the MFT3 but I am also thinking about building a small sturdy "proper" bench for hand tool work.  Just curious how yours is working for you in your new endeavors.

Thanks

 

[ear3]

[member=61142]Patrick Cox[/member] I built the bench last summer as part of a larger reorganization of my workshop to make it more Festool friendly:
http://festoolownersgroup.com/works...rganization-build-thread/msg406230/#msg406230

It works at the moment for the hand-tooling I'm doing.  The legs are just 4x4s and the back sits on a 2x4 anchored to the wall.  It helps to have the legs secured to the concrete floor to minimize vibration.

Although I barely used them prior to getting hand planes, I've discovered that the Veritas bench blades, because of their low profile, are excellent for in-line clamping of material I'm planing.  Since they have limited jaw travel, I simply make half-trapezoidal spacers to wedge in between the workpiece and the clamp.

I am planning a rebuild in the future though to make it more of a hybrid bench.  I would make the top out of solid maple, but keep it to around 5/4 thickness so I can still have a hole pattern covering most of the bench.  The critical additions will be a tail vise and some sort of bench vise in the front.  I'm currently use my grandfather's old detachable vise for clamping small and oddly shaped material, like the baby toys I've been making.  It's barely adequate, but better than nothing.  If I'm running short on time for a major rebuild (which is a distinct possibility surveying the coming year of life and work), I may just muddle through by getting a front vise, and add dog holes to it so I can clamp boards on the flat.

There are other options though to make a power tool bench more hand tool friendly.  There's the Moxon vise (Benchcrafted carries the kit).  There's the Sjoberg vise (I think Rockler sells them).  And there are also simple shop made bench hooks like the kind discussed by the Renaissance Woodworker. 

Great discussion here.  I am learning a lot!  Since I don't have a table saw, jointer or planer, (and I really have no plans to purchase these large power tools), I am thinking about picking up a couple of hand planes for dimensioning wood so this has been helpful.  I had a question on your bench [member=37411]Edward A Reno III[/member] .  How is the base constructed?  I guess it is sturdy enough for hand planing?  Right now I only have an MFT3 as a work bench but the legs are not really that sturdy.  I am considering building a more sturdy base with storage underneath for the MFT3 but I am also thinking about building a small sturdy "proper" bench for hand tool work.  Just curious how yours is working for you in your new endeavors.

Thanks

 

[Corwin]

...  If I'm running short on time for a major rebuild (which is a distinct possibility surveying the coming year of life and work), I may just muddle through by getting a front vise, and add dog holes to it so I can clamp boards on the flat.

You could always "muddle through" by making use of wooden handscrew clamps clamped to your bench to hold your work on edge,  and clamp battens for planing stops along with a doe's foot batten to secure your work on the flat. I've been playing with these methods while I was waiting for my front vise to arrive and before drilling my dog holes, and they do work perfectly fine -- now I'll probably not drill nearly as may dog holes as I had planned.

There are other options though to make a power tool bench more hand tool friendly.  There's the Moxon vise (Benchcrafted carries the kit).  There's the Sjoberg vise (I think Rockler sells them).  And there are also simple shop made bench hooks like the kind discussed by the Renaissance Woodworker. 

Oh, you forgot the Lie Nielsen Dovetail Vise.  [scared]  One really shouldn't go to those LN hand-tool events -- I made that mistake and fell in love with this beast, along with several other items...

 

[HarveyWildes]

A Moxon vise is easy to make, if you don't mind adjusting both sides of the vise.  I made one that I still use for cutting dovetails by hand.  The Lie Nielsen is nice because you can operate it one handed while positioning your board with the other hand.

 

[ear3]

I didn't know about the Doe's foot batten.  That's brilliant, thanks!  I had just been using another board positioned perpendicular to the board being planed about two thirds of the way on the front right side (or a dog, if I was able to use the hole pattern), but this style of batten m akes a lot more sense.

...  If I'm running short on time for a major rebuild (which is a distinct possibility surveying the coming year of life and work), I may just muddle through by getting a front vise, and add dog holes to it so I can clamp boards on the flat.

You could always "muddle through" by making use of wooden handscrew clamps clamped to your bench to hold your work on edge,  and clamp battens for planing stops along with a doe's foot batten to secure your work on the flat. I've been playing with these methods while I was waiting for my front vise to arrive and before drilling my dog holes, and they do work perfectly fine -- now I'll probably not drill nearly as may dog holes as I had planned.

There are other options though to make a power tool bench more hand tool friendly.  There's the Moxon vise (Benchcrafted carries the kit).  There's the Sjoberg vise (I think Rockler sells them).  And there are also simple shop made bench hooks like the kind discussed by the Renaissance Woodworker. 

Oh, you forgot the Lie Nielsen Dovetail Vise.  [scared]  One really shouldn't go to those LN hand-tool events -- I made that mistake and fell in love with this beast, along with several other items...

 

[Holmz]

...
How big the plane he wants to buy? You only need a piece a lapping glass, you can get a bit of float glass about 12" by 4", I put mine in the missus's handbag.
...

Some women have ceiling glass in theirs.

 

[waho6o9]

Got the veritas edge trimming plane in the mail this morning, and so spent some time getting it in shape.  I was kind of surprised to find: 1) the PMV-11 blade wasn't ground with a square edge, and so it took a long time to redo the primary bevel, and 2) there's a small concavity in the sole, .002 at it's maximum right in front of the blade.  Is this within acceptable tolerances?  After honing the blade I was able to make excellent shavings, though I haven't yet tried to push it to the thinnest possible and test whether that concavity is making a difference.  I'm also not 100% convinced the sole is completely square with the edge/fence.  I checked it with multiple engineer's square and could see a sliver of light coming through at the top of the fence, but the plane is so small that I'm not sure if it's just a function of my incorrect placement of the square on such a small surface.  This being my first decent plane I'm reticent to blame the tool first rather than my ability to gauge it properly.  What I'll probably do is plane the edges of two different boards and see how they match up. 

Gonna spend some more time with it later.

Mine was out of square enough to not get 90*, so I went to a machine shop to square it up. I took it for granted they would do it right, back to the machine shop to get it squared.  They finally got it right and all is well.
Veritas was awesome, they said send it back and we'll replace it, or use it for a couple on months if you want and then send it back.
Hello machine shop. No light can be seen anywhere along the fence.

 

[derekcohen]

After seeing how useful just a block plane was on the cabinet I have been building, and having become more comfortable/confident with sharpening blades now that I have the MKii honing guide and a decent set of stones, I'm looking into expanding my use of hand planes.  I realize this isn't a hand tool forum, but there are folks on here with plenty of experience in this area, so I thought I'd post a hand plane 101 question.

I don't know yet if I'm going to go all in at once (like getting one of the three or five plane sets from woodriver, lie nielsen or the like), but right now I'm thinking I'm going to take it one step at a time, and just get a single plane.  From what I' know (which is little when it comes to hand tools), it seems like a jack plane is a good all around "starter" plane.

I'm looking for something that will perform multiple operations.  In the main: occasionally roughing out of small boards that can't be handled on the planer, smoothing the saw marks out of a board edge, and creating bevels in pieces that would be difficult to do with power tools.  As an example of the latter, I'm planning on recreating an Arts and Crafts lamp we have at home, where the base has a beveled edge like you can see in the picture:

The actual one we have has a larger bevel/base that actually extends beyond the capacity of my table saw, which is why I'm thinking the hand plane would be a good option.  I would also note the recent video made by [member=47215]woodman_412[/member] about the beveled Carvex base where he executed it with a handplane -- this would be another example of a task I would want my plane to perform:http://festoolownersgroup.com/vario...pics/dp-shop-talk-videos/msg457628/#msg457628

So a couple of specific questions:

Is the jack plane a good all-around plane for someone in my position?

What's up with all the different options (low-angle, bevel up), and which one is better?

Are Lie Nielsen planes really that much better than the others in terms of their performance, such that their cost is justified (I don't care about aesthetics)?  If not, what's a good, more cost-conscious brand?

What different blades should I get to perform the different operations the plane can do (roughing out vs. smoothing)?

My apologies for all the basic questions -- any advice and knowledge shared is appreciated.

I'm coming in very late here, and I know that you have purchased some of your planes. However I thought I might try and briefly comment on the important planes to purchase.

The three most important planes are a jack, a jointer and a smoother. Have a look at Christopher Schwarz's Coarse, "Medium and Fine" video. This will throw more like on these planes. In short, they form a team: the jack is used for roughing out, and the jointer levels. Finally the smoother polishes the surface. The jack is actually the most used plane, doing about 75% of the work, with the jointer about 20%, and the smoother the last 5%.

The main feature of a jack is the cambered iron, which runs between 8"-10" radius. There really is no point in sending big on a jack. It is a rough plane. The sole does not even have to be flat. This is not a precision plane. Save your money for the other planes. A Stanley #5 is excellent. I have a woodie and a Stanley #605.

The jointer is used to flatten the face of a board and true the edges for building panels. Rule of thumb is that an edge of 3/4" and greater is held in a vise or on a benchtop and planed with the jointer. Adjacent edges can be planed together. This is "match planing". Narrow ends, such as the ends of drawer faces, will be better to plane on a shooting board. Long edges can be jointed using a bench as a shooting board ...

There is a full description of this technique here: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/OneStepBack.html

My personal favourite jointer is the Veritas Custom #7 (40 degree frog). Here it is with the fence from the Veritas Skew Rabbet, which fits as you can see ...

Smoothers? I have a bunch, but the two that get used most are a LN #3 with 45 degree frog, and the Veritas Custom #4 with a 42 degree frog.

Here is the Custom #4 with a Stanley Bed Rock #604 ...

I mention the frog/bed angle because I use low cutting angles to obtain the smoothest finish. The only way they work like this is if you adjust the chipbreaker to control tearout. Tearout may be controlled with a high cutting angle, either via a high bed in a bevel down plane or a high bevel angle in a bevel up plane. They all work, however the low cutting angle+chipbreaker does offer the best finish. It does, however, have more of a learning curve.

I am happy to discuss any type of bench plane (or other handtool). Just shout out.

Below are the bench planes I keep ready above my bench. There are woodies and metal planes. The woodies include a jack I built, HNT Gordon Trying Plane and Smoother, and a smoother I got from Jim Krenov. The metal planes are a Veritas LA Jointer, Veritas BU Smoother, Veritas LA Jack, Veritas Custom #4, LN #3, and Veritas Custom #7. There are three block planes: LN #60 1/2, LN #103, and Veritas NX60. Yes, far too many planes. I hang my head in shame

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[grbmds]

Not a big fan of "sets". I'd suggest buying planes as you meet up with a task you feel you can't so any other way. Flattening rough boards with a hand plane is hard work. While I've seen it done and tried it myself, I would say it would be my choice of last resort. The block plane is one of the most useful planes to have. It performs a variety of functions and is useful for small jobs. Beyond that, what planes you own seems to me to be a function of what you do with wood. I have a smoothing plane; a great plane but I find I don't use it all that much. I also have a jointer plane and, which it also has been useful, I have found that my powered jointer would be my tool of choice because of the consistent and quality of the results I get compared to my work with  a hand plane. I would guess I'd get better with all of these with practice but I have chosen to spend my time on design and actual construction rather than wood preparation. Having said that, there are, of course, parts of projects for which hand tools are indispensable (block planes, chisels, scrapers, smoothing planes).

Buy planes as you feel you will use them rather than to try to fill out a set of must have planes.