Hanging a T-Loc

[Mettes]

Just a proof of concept.

Might use this to outfit my next van. It needs about 90mm of clearance above to be taken out.
Hanging the systainer is possible with one hand, taking it out requires two.

You lose some space in between the systainer, but you can easily clear out the van when you need to.  Can be made modular, something like Jmb's new van

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[jonny round boy]

Nice proof of concept, but I don't think I'd rely on it in a van, I think the plastic at the back of the lid would break.

It'll hold for static loads (like your demo) but with the dynamic load in a van, with the systainer & it's contents bouncing about, I don't think it would hold.

 

[jmbfestool]

I'm loving the idea!!!

Like mentioned for a VAN I would be concerned.

However for workshop it seems perfectly strong enough.

You could improve  this by transferring the load to a second Timber bellow. This might make it strong enough for use in the van

So the weight of the T-loc once it's in place would rest on the timber below and the timber you made would just stops it from tipping forward and doesn't actually hold the weight.

 

[overanalyze]

Very very clever. I like it!! Thanks for sharing.

 

[semenza]

That is a cool idea! I would think about adding something to keep the front from bouncing up and unhooking.

Seth

 

[Mettes]

The support that JMB mentioned had also crossed my mind, but it would mean that I would have to make different sizes of brackets, for each size of systainer.
The way it is here is universal.

Now an other night has passed, the perfect time to tinker about such things and this is the result...

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... This way I can hang the classic systainer, weight is supported and with the handle pressed against the aluminium it can't jump up.
I would have to make different sizes for each size systainer.  But this way I won't have to buy +30 new T-Loc's to replace the classic.
It's not interchangeable with the T-Loc, but I would only have to change the "cleat"

 

[cblanton42]

I like the aluminum but unless you have a free stack already, won't that get expensive?  The load is at the front of the systainer, not the back so even though this looks good I don't think the wood is supporting much at all. The original systainers are designed to use all four latches for securing the lid and carrying, this design seems to put more of the stress only on the two front latches.  In a moving environment like a van I see disaster unless you come up with a way to support the fronts of the sustainers.  Also, aren't you losing 90mm PLUS the height of the handle?  It seems like you'd lose a lot of space vertically with this design resulting in 1 or 2 less systainers per stack.  Not trying to find fault with your project and I may be missing something but certainly an interesting thought process of hanging them, looking forward to what happens with this idea!
CB 

 

[Mettes]

CB,

Thanks for your reply.

The reason that I posted this was exactly to get opinions and remarks.  To see if my idea is valid or could be improved, so keep it coming, no need to hold back!

Now to address some of your questions:

Price:
  at the moment i'm buying aluminum at €3,13/kg a flat of 4×50mm weighs 0,54kg/m, you need about 380mm for each systainer, that works out to be €0,64 a piece, or $0,72.  So that's not to bad.

losing height:
Is less than 90mm in this configuration, the height of the handle suffices.  I think that when you consider a shelve and some space to take it in and out your looking at the same distance in between systainers.

load:
the total weight is supported by the wood underneath, that's just physics.  There is a momentum, rotational force, of the systainer wanting to "sag" at the front, this is countered by the aluminum strip which works against the lid. The two latches prevent the lid from opening, but there is not a lot of stress on them, I don't think it's more then when you carry the systainer.

The big question is:
"Will it hold when driving?"

I think it will, after all the systainers on their own aren't loaded that heavy.  I sometimes carry a stack of 5 Sys I loaded with screws and the Sys at the top, the handle and lid, need to take all that weight.  So when you hang them one by one, I don't think there's a problem.
I can't seem to find a maximal load bearing capacity for a systainer.  The Sys-toolbox II is rated for 14kg/30.9lb maximal load.

 

[Mettes]

That is a cool idea! I would think about adding something to keep the front from bouncing up and unhooking.

Seth

Seth,

In the new iteration of the "Hanging Systainer", this is taking care of.  The handle resting against the aluminum locks the systainer firmly in place.  I'm surprised that at how firmly this is, yet the handle can easily be lifted up.
Thanks for your opinion!

Hans

 

[Mettes]

I'm loving the idea!!!

Like mentioned for a VAN I would be concerned.

However for workshop it seems perfectly strong enough.

You could improve  this by transferring the load to a second Timber bellow. This might make it strong enough for use in the van

So the weight of the T-loc once it's in place would rest on the timber below and the timber you made would just stops it from tipping forward and doesn't actually hold the weight.

JMB,

It was your post about your new van and the individual boxes for each systainer that got me thinking.  I really liked the idea of separate, modular boxes.  But I thought it was a lot of work to make all those boxes.  Granted it's a one time job, but it has to be done.

Hans

 

[jmbfestool]

I agree.  It was time consuming making individual boxes.

I have been thinking ever since of a better way and I have come up with a couple of ideas.

Your idea has inspired me to think differently.

I have even been thinking of combining my ideas with your ideas.

I just need to find some time to implement them.

That's the beauty about my van racking I can if I decide a better system to just remove the module boxes and replace them with something different very easily.  Or even go hybrid and for some boxes use the module boxes and other have a more slim system.

 

[Jak147]

Hans
I think this idea has great potential, if ever you needed to carry something large then simply removing your systainers would probably give all the space u need as the actual racking takes up no real space.

as you rightly point out all the load is carried by the timber and the Ali is just a retainer, therefore could the aluminium be fixed in a way that allows it to rise and fall. I'm thinking a fixing slot instead of a hole. A chamfer on the front edge would allow the sys to be pushed straight in (think door latch) and then lifted to remove the sys. Each sys in the stack would rest on the locking member of the unit below...... Oh god I can see a remodel coming for my vehicle now

 

[cblanton42]

Hans,  I took a long hard look at my old and new systainers.
    1.  Are you hanging a T-LOC, an old style systainer, or both?  These are very different at your connection points, the old systainers don't have any lip at all, just smooth, flat and SLICK.  You show both in the pics so assume you need to hang both?
    2.  I don't understand how you can get the systainer to sit on the wood.  Since the aluminum is fixed, how can you get the systainer to sit on the wood below it and still have much left to hook onto the aluminum?  It doesn't seem like you would have much to bite to but if it was slotted to slide down to the systainer, you could sit the systainer on the wood and then slide the aluminum down to it maybe?
    3.  You're right, most aren't that heavy by themselves but I still think the moving/flexing/expanding/contracting van will slowly but surely loosen up the wedge with your handle and be a real problem.
    4.  Since you already have it mocked up, take it out and mount it in a van, make a few laps around the neighborhood at warp speed, slam on the brakes and take a few turns waaay to fast.  If it holds, you got a winner!! 
Good luck, I hope it works
CB

P.S.  JMBFestool  How long did it take you to do that?  Impressive but it had to take forever!!
   

 

[bkharman]

I am sure it will hold just fine and it a Sys does crash, it can handle it.
That being said, I wouldn't hang it from the back like that. You are building a lot pressure back there on the hinge area. I had thought a while back that it would be really slick to have a French cleat wall and brackets that match the bottom of the Systainer and hold it in place. I am sure you could figure a way to put it all together to your liking. I don't really travel daily with my tools so I don't need a setup like yours but thanks for sharing.

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[Mettes]

Hans
I think this idea has great potential, if ever you needed to carry something large then simply removing your systainers would probably give all the space u need as the actual racking takes up no real space.

as you rightly point out all the load is carried by the timber and the Ali is just a retainer, therefore could the aluminium be fixed in a way that allows it to rise and fall. I'm thinking a fixing slot instead of a hole. A chamfer on the front edge would allow the sys to be pushed straight in (think door latch) and then lifted to remove the sys. Each sys in the stack would rest on the locking member of the unit below...... Oh god I can see a remodel coming for my vehicle now

I get what you're saying and that should certainly work.  If the drive test fails it could be a possible way to improve the design.  But I will try it like this first, what you're suggesting is a little more work.  If it works like this, then there is no need to make it more complex. 
Great thinking, and I will keep it in mind, Thanks!

Hans

 

[Mettes]

Hans,  I took a long hard look at my old and new systainers.
    1.  Are you hanging a T-LOC, an old style systainer, or both?  These are very different at your connection points, the old systainers don't have any lip at all, just smooth, flat and SLICK.  You show both in the pics so assume you need to hang both?
    2.  I don't understand how you can get the systainer to sit on the wood.  Since the aluminum is fixed, how can you get the systainer to sit on the wood below it and still have much left to hook onto the aluminum?  It doesn't seem like you would have much to bite to but if it was slotted to slide down to the systainer, you could sit the systainer on the wood and then slide the aluminum down to it maybe?
    3.  You're right, most aren't that heavy by themselves but I still think the moving/flexing/expanding/contracting van will slowly but surely loosen up the wedge with your handle and be a real problem.
    4.  Since you already have it mocked up, take it out and mount it in a van, make a few laps around the neighborhood at warp speed, slam on the brakes and take a few turns waaay to fast.  If it holds, you got a winner!! 
Good luck, I hope it works
CB

P.S.  JMBFestool  How long did it take you to do that?  Impressive but it had to take forever!!
 

CB,

My first try was with the T-loc and I made a cleat to match the profile of the systainer, an angle of 45° and 7mm high.  It could hang unsupported at the bottom.

My second attempt is with a classic systainer.  Here the weight is supported by a 20mm thick piece of wood and the aluminum prevents the systainer from dipping it's nose.  The aluminum is extended 20mm below the piece of wood below and when the systainer is put in place it engages with the lid for about 8mm, so there is 12mm between the systainer and the wood above.
The board which holds everything together and the back of the systainer rests against has a dado.  The dado is 8mm deep and approximately 60mm wide.  This dado allows the systainer to be rotated up and from under the aluminum.

So there are two "versions", the second attempt can be altered to be used with a T-loc, the only difference is the distance from the board at the back tot the front of the aluminum.

Next step is to get it on the road and test it...
I'll be mounting it in the family car to test, I'm "in between" vans at the moment.
Will let you now how it goes.

Hans

 

[jmbfestool]

Ever since I made my racking I have been thinking how could I make them fold away.

Been thinking combining your hook method with a fold out bit which supports the front would work.

It would come down diagonally from to to the bottom front of the Sys/t-loc

 

[cblanton42]

Hans,
    Ok, Now I see what you did, I didn't realize the gap/dado was there for tilting, now I understand how you hook it AND get the weight on the wood below.  Keep us informed how it goes, I have two "fixes" in my head if they end up needing support in the front. 
CB 

 

[bkharman]

I have been thinking about this even more and have another thought. What if you made a "reverse cleat" where you hinge and an area below it is recessed 10-20mm and when you hook the top to your plate, and swing the Systainer down, the rear of it would sit on that 20mm shelf. You would have two points of security and that cantilever effect would be fairly strong. Hell, if you don't want the recess, slap some very strong Velcro on the wall and your Sys.

Cheers. Bryan.