Help me go metric

[DoctorCroz]

Metric is better.  I said what I said.

I hope you guys throw out an idea or two, thanks in advance for any suggestions.

I recently made my first Festool purchase which was a Domino because it's perfect and I love it as much as my family.  I also love that it's metric but of course, all my measuring tools are imperial, Starrett combination squares and tape measures. 

What are your guys' favorite small speed squares/delve squares/thickness gauges that have units in metric - favorite in terms of price/accuracy, etc.  Is there something that works just as well as a Starrett or Woodpeckers square?  I'm not opposed to buying either but are there any others out there that would be advised?  As an FYI, I'm not interested in converting over the Domino's stopblocks to imperial because I'd just generally like to use metric units as it works quite a bit better in my own head.

 

[4nthony]

When I switched, I bought a couple rules and tapes that had both metric and imperial measurements. It helped me get into the metric mindset and do a quick rough conversion (1" ~25mm, 6" ~150mm, etc).

I like the FastCap yellow tape measure and the Woodpeckers Paolini Pocket rule in stainless. The Paolini rule has markings on both sides so you can flip it if you need a specific measurement to be at the top or bottom.

 

[ChuckM]

Similar to Anthony, I use simple, unfancy steel rules (some have a conversion table on the back) and, for long lengths over 30cm, the Fastcap (mine is the 16ft version):

[attachimg=1]

I keep one short rule at every station (I think they cost me a buck or two when I bought them many moons ago). I use BOTH units in woodworking, depending on what it's.

 

[festal]

When I switched, I bought a couple rules and tapes that had both metric and imperial measurements. It helped me get into the metric mindset and do a quick rough conversion (1" ~25mm, 6" ~150mm, etc).

I like the FastCap yellow tape measure and the Woodpeckers Paolini Pocket rule in stainless. The Paolini rule has markings on both sides so you can flip it if you need a specific measurement to be at the top or bottom.

Thats what I do but haven't switched to metric fully but having dual stuff is great

 

[smorgasbord]

I really like Shinwa's stainless steel rules. Very nice markings.

Having DRO's on my tablesaw and drum sander was great, since I can toggle between metric and imperial measurements at the push of a button.

I also swapped out the Incra racks on my mitersaw cutoff fence for metric ones, and got new tapes, too. Did the same on my tablesaw sled fence.

But, the biggest thing, for me, was to start designing in metric. Then build to your design.

 

[Packard]

Where I used to work (I’m now retired) all six of the tool and die workers were Polish ex-pats. This was not an accident.  The tool room manager was from Poland and whenever we needed more tool makers, we advertised in the Polish language newspaper.  They were all good workers (but communication was sometimes a challenge).

They all were used to metric.  All our work was imperial.  They all changed.  None ever complained that imperial was inferior.

I don’t see metric as an advantage.  It is a choice.  You are free to choose metric.  I hope you enjoy it.  I doubt the change will improve the quality of your work or facilitate how you do it. 

 

[woodferret]

I have the fastcap yellow tape as well and use it often when bridging between lumber/trim work.  But, I also keep a metric-only tape (blue?) for use in the shop which is my baseline reference.  Actual cutting is done against that.  Not having the imperial on the day-to-day measure stick helps.

 

[smorgasbord]

I don’t see metric as an advantage.  It is a choice.  You are free to choose metric.  I hope you enjoy it.  I doubt the change will improve the quality of your work or facilitate how you do it.

Having made the change recently, I wish I had made it decades earlier.

Imperial Example: Install a knob in the middle of a drawer that is 1' 7&3/32" wide.
1) So that's half of a foot plus half of 7" plus half of 3/32". Or 6"+3.5"+3/64", which is 9.5" + 3/64, or 9 & 35/64"
2) Convert to decimal, divide by 2 then convert back. That's 19.094", so 9.547" is the middle. Convert .547" toa  fraction and add to 9.

Metrix Example: Install a knob in the middle of a drawer that's 485mm wide.
1) 485/2 = 242.5mm

Just way, way easier. And, memorizing numbers that you're measuring is easier. Not having to switch between denominators on the fractions is a life-saver, too. And you can't eliminate fractions and go to Imperial decimal even if you could find scales because so much is done on ⅛", 1/16" or 1/32" increments.

My only complaint is that they didn't metricize angles. A right angle should be 100 degrees, 400 for a full circle. I know scientists use radians, but that doesn't help for most geometries.

 

[Bob D.]

I have gone to working in metric almost exclusively when modeling something for 3D printing. Occasionally I need an imperial measurement and I can enter that easily which out changing anything in the software.

Metric is easier since the printer works in metric. Layers are some fraction of a mm, usually 0.20 or 0.15 mm, so working with multiples of your layer height is good.

If I do model something in imperial then when I go to export it for printing I convert it during output to metric as the slicer software wants to see metric too.

But most everything else I am still using the Imperial system.

 

[HandyDen]

When I switched, I bought a couple rules and tapes that had both metric and imperial measurements. It helped me get into the metric mindset and do a quick rough conversion (1" ~25mm, 6" ~150mm, etc).

I like the FastCap yellow tape measure and the Woodpeckers Paolini Pocket rule in stainless. The Paolini rule has markings on both sides so you can flip it if you need a specific measurement to be at the top or bottom.

+1 for the FastCap tapes and Paolini Stainless steel rules, both in metric and imperial. I also use the Lee Valley wooden folding rule with both measurements quite often. I wont wear a pair of pants (or a kilt) without a rule pocket on the side.

 

[Bertotti]

I have a tape in mm and imperial but I also use those flexible Incra rules I love I can bend them around and lay them flat. I might have to add a couple of the metric or metric and inch ones.

As for squares, believe it or not, I have been using the great triangles from TSO and Woodpecker more than any square. I just keep hoping TSO will add a smaller highly accurate triangle in the 3" range. and I wish I could find a nice 2 or 3-inch saddle square. There was one many years ago with a hinge it would do any angle accurately over a 90-degree edge or 45 or 33 or 27.5 etc. I digress. I have almost entirely moved to triangles.

 

[smorgasbord]

I don't understand why people like the FastCap tape measures. Mine sucks. Here it is in comparison to a Komelon and a Shinwa metal rule:

[attachimg=1]

The FastCap is $8 on Amazon.
The Komelon is under $18 on Amazon.

The 150mm Shinwa metal rule is under $5.50
I also have a 600mm Shinwa metal rule, which is $23.

 

[Bob Wolfe]

Metric 95 % of the time, I have found Fastcap tapes the best for me. I can see white tapes much easier than yellow.

When I was converting to metric I was advised to get and use metric only or imperial only tapes, not both. Much less confusing.

My panel saw, Altendorf WA6, is metric as are all my Festool.

Bob W.

 

[Bertotti]

I don't understand why people like the FastCap tape measures. Mine sucks. Here it is in comparison to a Komelon and a Shinwa metal rule:

[attachimg=1]

The FastCap is $8 on Amazon.
The Komelon is under $18 on Amazon.

The 150mm Shinwa metal rule is under $5.50
I also have a 600mm Shinwa metal rule, which is $23.

I like it because it has metric and fractional measurements on the same tape. Mine is also a bit fragile compared to my Milwaukee tapes. The blade in the combo is just thinner and not as robust, that is something I do not like about it. I do not use it for fine measurements just on larger boards I am breaking down or longer spans that I need one or both measurements from.

 

[mino]

...
I don’t see metric as an advantage.  It is a choice.  You are free to choose metric.  I hope you enjoy it.  I doubt the change will improve the quality of your work or facilitate how you do it.

I think there are two things at play.
- switching from fractions to decimal
  => this is, in general, a benefit for easy of calculation /easy calculation then allows people tend ot bother with better accuracy/

- changing the unit from inch to mm (or cm) while ignoring the feet and yard "things"
  => this is just a unit change, indeed, does not present any qualitative differences

Most people associate Metric/Imperial switch with the Fractions -> Decimal change. As that is where the benefit is easy to see.

But if someone already worked with decimal /just in inches/ there is not much benefit. The benefit comes once Yards and Feet would come to play -> i.e. mostly in cross-specialty interactions. As long as one just makes furniture, or machines something, one can just  well stick to inches and their decimal fractions and be exactly the same position as with millimeters.

Though the big/original draw of the SI system, why it came to be in the first place, was not efficiency. Sure, they chose decimal as it was obviously the better way.
The reason the system came to be was that - at the time - nothing like today's physically-defined /derived from millimeter, heh/ "standard inch" existed to begin. The folks went purely after standardisation to get interoperability across trades and across countries.

The choices made were based on sound analysis, sure. But the system was always about interoperability first, everything else second.

As long as one does not inter-operate much, one does not get much benefit either. Can be even to the contrary as certain workflows lend well to fractions.

 

[Mini Me]

The single best thing you can do to change is design and measure in metric and ignore imperial altogether. I was forced into it because the plans for my workshop were metric and I never went back to imperial. Buy some European made metric tapes and start there, Shinwa rules are damned good as well. 

 

[Packard]

I don’t see metric as an advantage.  It is a choice.  You are free to choose metric.  I hope you enjoy it.  I doubt the change will improve the quality of your work or facilitate how you do it.

Having made the change recently, I wish I had made it decades earlier.

Imperial Example: Install a knob in the middle of a drawer that is 1' 7&3/32" wide.
1) So that's half of a foot plus half of 7" plus half of 3/32". Or 6"+3.5"+3/64", which is 9.5" + 3/64, or 9 & 35/64"
2) Convert to decimal, divide by 2 then convert back. That's 19.094", so 9.547" is the middle. Convert .547" toa  fraction and add to 9.

Metrix Example: Install a knob in the middle of a drawer that's 485mm wide.
1) 485/2 = 242.5mm

Just way, way easier. And, memorizing numbers that you're measuring is easier. Not having to switch between denominators on the fractions is a life-saver, too. And you can't eliminate fractions and go to Imperial decimal even if you could find scales because so much is done on ⅛", 1/16" or 1/32" increments.

My only complaint is that they didn't metricize angles. A right angle should be 100 degrees, 400 for a full circle. I know scientists use radians, but that doesn't help for most geometries.

But can you as easily divide in 3rds, 4ths and 6ths?

10 divided by 3 is messy.

12 divided by three is 4.

There are conveniences in using metric.  There are conveniences in using Imperial.  The biggest convenience is using the system that 95% of your community is using. 

It is just like language.  If you are living in an English speaking country, it is an advantage to be able to speak English. 

If you are living in a country that uses Imperial measuring units, then it is an advantage using Imperial.

 

[pixelated]

I have a metric Stanley tape, but don’t use it very much. My go-to is a metric folding rule I bought from Lee Valley.

I prefer working in metric and hate with a passion trying to count sixteenths, eighteenths,  and quarters on a tape, much less doing arithmetic with them.

 

[Birdhunter]

I have become "ambidextrous" with respect to measurement systems. My Festool stuff (way too much) triggered my inclusion of metric.

I ended up getting Starrett rules and squares in metric to go with my Imperial measuring tools.

That said, I tend to use "go by" story sticks and other non-measurement techniques when I can.

 

[ChuckM]

I don't understand why people like the FastCap tape measures. Mine sucks.Snip.

In what ways do the Fastcap tapes fall short?