Imperial vs Metric in My Situation

[Patrick Cox]

I have read some of the discussions on this topic and would like to say that I am simply looking for experienced input regarding my personal decision of working primarily in imperial or metric.

I am located in the US and I am a new woodworker.  I recently purchased some Festool tools and these are my primary woodworking tools and obviously these tools are built around the metric system.  So now I need to purchase various measuring devices and some of what I want comes in metric or imperial but not both.  (Like some of the woodpecker rulers as an example.)  My primary concern about working in the metric system is that the wood I will be purchasing will be dimensioned around the imperial system.  But I am not sure if that is a valid concern or not.

So, for anyone here in the US who has some experience with this choice, your thoughts / comments would be appreciated.  (I say anyone in the US as I believe that basically only the US operates in the imperial system.)

Thanks!

 

[blaszcsj]

If you are just starting out I would learn metric. The math is so much easier.  Also majority of plywood is 18mm anyways. The if you are planing material you can mill it down to an even metric number.

I myself am trying to covert all my tools over to metric even past my festool stuff.

Have fun with your new hobby! Where at in Kentucky are you?

 

[GhostFist]

IMO math is math. It's no easier either way. I prefer imperial despite being raised with metric as it's easier to visualize. The gradations are clear to tell apart. With metric I find I'm counting mm, squinty businesses. I also like that imperial is based on the rough proportions of the human body (feet and inches) probably subtle, but I find it assuring seeing as we're building things that our body related to. All classic matters used imperial.

 

[richk]

Summary: Focus on metric, but expect to use both at different times.

I have a science background so I started out comfortable with the numeric manipulations of metric but still did not have a feel for what " X cm's " actually looked like, as I do with Imperial. As a result, when I'm thinking macro, like 'long is this plank,' I still use Imperial and have a tape measure with both to try to develop a better feel for the numbers. When I'm down to details, like 'how many pieces can I get out a plank,' then metric is much easier for calculations and for marking where to make a precise cut.

I use Sketchup for my drawings and that really helps validate that my numbers all add up so the pieces are the right size.

I maintain my cut list in a spreadsheet, so it is really easy to express the dimensions in both systems and switch back and forth as needed.

Switching between cm's and mm's can be confusing but the Fastcap True32 tape measure keeps it all in mm so you're always working with whole numbers, not decimals.

Still a work in progress, however...

RichK

 

[Stephen B]

Yes I know you asked for USA members only to comment, but I would like to make two comments -

It is not really Metric vs Imperial; suggest you choose one and stick to it. As you are becoming a Festool user, I suggest Metric. And the maths is simpler, especially if you stick only to mm. I would leave cms alone for a while, in fact in wood and timber work I tend to only use mm and metres.

I work PT in the timber and paint dept. of what you call a big box store. Despite Australia being Metric for over forty years, some older customers still think in Imperial. They aften become confused when selecting from metric stock. Fortunately I still have a basic knowledge of imperial measurement. Again my point here is that you stick to one system. You will find that at least for imported wood product, much of it will increasingly be metric sized.

 

[DB10]

I had to make the switch, although it was a few decades ago now, but if you do go for it, forget about using CM, just work with MM, & Meters.

Looks like myself and Untidy posted at the same time, but our thoughts on this subject are the same.

 

[GhostFist]

Bottom line. Nothing is more accurate than a story stick.

 

[nclemmons]

If you are starting out and Festool focused, I'd suggest metric.  You'll still run into material at the lumber yard and if you do any work with dimensional lumber from the big box stores. 

Suggest you get a ProCarpenter ruler from FastCap that has both metric and imperial to ease the transition.

Here's the link -http://www.fastcap.com/estore/pc/ProCarpenter-3p112.htm

 

[Max Fracas]

I switched after I bought my TS75.  I remember reading posts about getting an imperial label for the depth scale and I thought an easier approach would be to dispense with imperial and go metric.  I've not regretted it for a day.  I work with hardwood and construction (big box store) lumber and haven't had a problem.  I use "Cut Calculator" on my iPad to generate cutting lists.  I can feed the app imperial dimensions and it'll give me metric cutting dimensions.  I added an Incra LS positioner to my tablesaw and chose the metric version.  Life is far easier than when I had to work with fractions (16th, 32d, etc).  The only time I use imperial now is when I talk to someone (such as my wife) about dimensions of projects.  Go metric and you'll be happy you did. 

 

[Patrick Cox]

If you are just starting out I would learn metric. The math is so much easier.  Also majority of plywood is 18mm anyways. The if you are planing material you can mill it down to an even metric number.

I myself am trying to covert all my tools over to metric even past my festool stuff.

Have fun with your new hobby! Where at in Kentucky are you?

Thanks for your reply. I live in Lexington.

 

[Patrick Cox]

Thanks for all of the replies. It sounds like most would recommend starting out with metric so I am going to look into that a bit further and likely take that advice.

Thanks again!

 

[Steve-Rice]

I'll stick my neck out and be the contrarian on this one...

Having grown up with the imperial system, that's what I'm used to and am most comfortable with, so that's what I've stayed with.  Yes, I use Festool tools, but there is an imperial overlay for the depth of cut on my TS 55 REQ and I have the Seneca thickness gauge on my Domino DF 500. I have a 150mm pocket ruler for measuring Dominos and determining the depth of cut of the Domino mortise, but all my other measurements are imperial. We know that 125mm sandpaper is 5" and 150mm sandpaper is 6", so no big mystery there. My cabinet saw fence system is imperial and all my router and drill bits are imperial, so switching completely over to metric would just complicate the bulk of my work. Besides your customers are not going to be receptive to metric measurements anyway, so why waste your time making your life more complicated? Let's face it, most of the population in the U.S. is using the imperial system, why the heck would you want to swim against that tide, just because a few of your tools are metric?  That makes absolutely no logical sense to me...

 

[ear3]

If you are committed to it, I say go metric.  Even if you decide to stick with imperial, though, you will be forced to learn the basics of metric using Festools.  It's really not that difficult in the end, once you realize that 1" = 25mm (actually 25.4).  Kind of like how everyone in New York knows a little Spanish from seeing all the Spanish adverts riding the subway every day.

Just to add to what [member=29138]Steve-Rice[/member]  said, though.  Keep in mind that for certain things it might be more of a hassle to work in metric.  Steve already mentioned drill bits.  Unless you are committed to keeping a stock of 6, 8 and 10mm bolts on hand, it can be kind of a pain making jigs, or other shop assemblies, where the standard is 1/4-20, 5/16 or 3/8 fittings, which are something you can just run out to Home Depot to get when you need them (ever try rifling through the drawers in the HD hardware aisle with the plastic packets of metric fasteners?).  Also router bits.  Unless you're going to start importing your bits, or buying the super expensive ones from Festool, you will still be using imperial for your router bits.  I'm sure there are other examples.

In the end, though, these are relatively minor issues, and are really no different than when we imperialists occasionally have to fiddle with metric items.

 

[ATXStorm]

It depends on what you are going to build.  If its building cabinets then I would buy metric measurement tools because most of the hardware, wood, cabinet systems, etc are in metric.  If your building a fence, framing, interior/exterior door construction, or DIY kits then imperial measurement tools are easier to use.  I purchased DIY Murphy bed kit for example in which the plans where in imperial.  Also, keep in mind how detailed the work is.  1/16th of inch is 1.56mm.  I don't have ruler in .5 mm markings. 

Storm 

 

[HarveyWildes]

A few years ago I did a project in Ecuador where I trained a couple of Ecuadoran concrete guys (used chisels to pry up nails) to build a set of 50 or so wardrobes.  I did all the plans and jigs.  I was going to convert it all to metric, but my contact told me not to bother because both systems were in common use in Ecuador.  (While I was there I got a couple of cheap Ecuadoran tape measures that had both imperial and metric.  Festool may be expensive, but those were the most expensive tools I ever bought, if you figure in the trip costs as "shipping".)  At any rate, Ecuadorans are used to switching back and forth between imperial and metric because they live in a somewhat schizophrenic world.  We built one wardrobe together, and then I had to head back home.  I was able to go back later and see the results, and they did very well.  As far as I know, they are still being used.  So I think it is possible to be the measurement equivalent of bi-lingual.

 

[Peter_C]

Go Metric!

Most people find metric far simpler to work with. If buying plans etc. most can be ordered in metric.

Whatever you do, don't go both as it is very expensive, as I can attest to first hand. Two of everything for measuring gets expensive.

If you need to switch between the two measuring systems Dewalt's app works pretty well.

I so wished Reagan hadn't killed our switch to the metric system. Our scientists and engineers work in metric, yet we are still living in an imperial hell.

 

[Mort]

Imperial. No matter what you're always going to have to convert stuff to work around the system that everyone else here uses.

Besides, adding fractions isn't that hard.

 

[Cheese]

As clean as it would be to just choose a system and go forth...if you're using Festool, you'll need to be fluent in both languages, metric and imperial. Purchase a Festool router and all the guide bushings are in mm, however purchase a router bit for that router and the diameter is probably in inches.
Fasteners are a lot easier to find in imperial sizes yet plywood is usually in metric. Sooner or later you will be forced to embrace both systems, so do yourself a favor and embrace both of them at an early date.

 

[McNally Family]

Well, if you have grown up in this country, then you already think in "Imperial".  Much like you already think in "English" (assumption on my part).  What you're really asking is if you should now take the time to learn "Spanish", which of course becomes much easier to do once you learn to think in "Spanish". 

While I am very comfortable thinking in Imperial, I am purchasing everything I need now in metric, for both my sake and my Son's benefit, who will be around much longer than I will.  The world is going metric (actually the world is already metric, it is the United States that is "going" metric). 

When I purchase any measuring devices, I search for one that has both scales rather than just one.  Sometimes that is not possible, so I also have a few Imperial rulers on hand for an immediate visual comparison, to it's metric cousin.  This helps me better understand what the equivalent measurement is in metric, by giving me that visual reinforcement of what certain measurements are in metric.

My journey into the world of "metric" began when I purchased my John Deere diesel engine lawn mower.  All the parts are in metric, so when I service the mower each year, the tools I need are all in metric.  The transition in mechanical tools is rather easy.  Much more so than measuring in metric, although I'm sure that in time I will be able to visualize in metric much faster than I can now (as I pour myself a diet Coke, from a Two Liter bottle).. 

 

[Kev]

The major consideration here is aptitude. Some people have no trouble mixing, crossing over, etc. You just need to be comfortable with your abilities, the background you have and your capacity to adapt and change.