Inserting a bit into a Festool Router

[BigCountry73]

Hello all,

A quick...possibly dumb question -

When inserting a bit into the Festool Routers do you bootom out the bit or leave a gap? I know on my other routers I would leave a gap, but I wasn't sure about the Festool routers. I know with my table mounted router I place a small rubber grommet into the collet to keep the bit from bottoming out in the collet.

Thanks,

Keith

 

[Stone Message]

I was always taught to raise the bit a fraction so that it does not bottom out but have never thought if it could be different for Festool routers.

Maybe this should be an "Ask Festool" one.

Peter

 

[GarryMartin]

You should never bottom out a bit in a router, but you'd have to go some to do it in an OF 1400 or OF 2200 has they have depths of 2.25" and 3.5" respectively.

In general, insert as much of the cutter shank as possible, at least up to the mark on the router shank (if your bit has a mark), but don't let it bottom out.

This post has more details http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-how-to/router-bit-shank-install-depth/msg255270/#msg255270

 

[tbellemare]

Bottoming out a bit in a router collet prevents the collet from tightening.

Tom

 

[Rick Christopherson]

The fear of bottoming out router bits started with the original Hitachi M12V router because its spindle bore was only about 1-inch deep. This made it very easy to have a standard router bit touch the bottom of the bore and prevent proper tightening of the collet.

It has been a long time since I measured them, but if memory serves me, Festool routers have spindle bores that are nearly 2 inches deep. It is almost impossible to bottom out a standard router bit in a Festool router before the head (cutter part) touches the collet nut (which is also bad, but you can at least see when you do this.).

Edit: Oops. GarryMartin already linked to one of my past postings on this topic. Follow the link, as it contains the actual information I alluded to here.

 

[BigCountry73]

Thank you all for the replies. I figured it was standard practice NOT to bottom the bit in the collet. It appears that Festool made that foolproof too!

Thanks again!

Keith

 

[JeromeM]

The only router collet that is safe to bottom out the bit is a quick change collet.

This is because all others will move down slightly when tightening the collet. However as the quich change collet tightens from the side bottoming the bit makes no difference to the bit position.

 

[promark747]

I've also read that another reason not to bottom out the bit is because it can transfer more heat to the motor if it is actually touching.

 

[gkaiseril]

Not bottoming the bit, might not allow the Collet to self-center the bit. If it bottoms out and the possibility of the chuck bottom angling the bit. This misalignment could also prevent the collet from securely holding the bit.

Some place a space ball or small O ring in the chuck to keep the shank of the bit from bottoming out.

 

[EV]

Every cutter has a minimum insertion mark on the shank in the shape of a capital "K", regardless of a shank diameter. Now I have been tought to insert a cutter to a point where "K" mark meets collet nut face. These mark in my understanding not only minimum but also there for another reason, vibration. Vibration can occur, when cutters shank ( especially that of a long series cutters ) doesn't get inserted to a minimum "K" mark. Density and thickness of the material being machined can also play a huge role in the finish from the router cutter, but lets not forget that cutter rotational speed and user feed rate can also create allot of vibration and as a result chatter marks on the financed product.

By using your router more and more you sure enough will learn it's and your cutter collection characteristics and their "sweet spots" .

Regards

EV

 

[Bohdan]

The a lot of the newer routers have deeper collet capability than the length of the cutters so it is possible to insert the cutter deeper than you should. I accidentally inserted a 1/2" shank 1/2" diameter long series cutter in to where the collet clamped on the cutting edges - no more cutting edges. Also possible with 1/4" shank 1/4" diameter cutters.

 

[JeromeM]

Every cutter has a minimum insertion mark on the shank in the shape of a capital "K", regardless of a shank diameter.

Sorry you are wrong. Most of the router bits I've just checked (10 from a variety of makers) do NOT have minimum insertion marks of any kind. Only the Festool bits that I have have a K mark

 

[Rob-GB]

Every cutter has a minimum insertion mark on the shank in the shape of a capital "K", regardless of a shank diameter.

Sorry you are wrong. Most of the router bits I've just checked (10 from a variety of makers) do NOT have minimum insertion marks of any kind. Only the Festool bits that I have have a K mark

No. You are mistaken sir's, router cutters from other companies like THIS ONE ,some others also have graduating marks so you can install the bit at the same point if you have to replicate set ups.
Colletts only grip with a few millimetres at the business end and the upturned K mark is the suggested maximum insertion point to alleviate any wobble in the cutter while allowing for the plunge capacity of most routers they may be used in. These marks often have to be ignored a bit if you are using a home built router table that is quite thick. If the K mark was the absolute rule then companies would save a fortune in material costs by reducing the shank lengths.
As for the bottoming out of the bit....most good routers will have deep shank wells, Festools do, the issue with 'bottoming out' is that tightening the collet will sometimes push the bit lower, if it can't then the collett may not grip as well as hoped (just as a dirty/rusty collett may not work well)  and all collets tighten from the side, how else would they work?

Rob.

 

[JeromeM]

Every cutter has a minimum insertion mark on the shank in the shape of a capital "K", regardless of a shank diameter.

Sorry you are wrong. Most of the router bits I've just checked (10 from a variety of makers) do NOT have minimum insertion marks of any kind. Only the Festool bits that I have have a K mark

No. You are mistaken sir's,
 

Rob are you addressing me? Or EV? Or both of us?
Because if you are addressing my post I can assure you that I am not mistaken in that most of the non Festool router bits I have, from a variety of makers do not have any insertion marks. And the only bits that have are Festool
Your giving an example of a company that has insertion markings doesn't change the fact that most of my non-Festool router bits do not have them

You say that all collets tighten from the side and in that you are not understanding the difference in the way that quick change collets function.

Quick change collets do not need spanners once they are fitted they use a socket cap screw which tightens horizontaly so the router bit doesn't move down when being tightened. Thus bottoming the bit before tightening makes no difference.

Regular collets grip all round the bit and the tightening force comes from the taper being forced down into the taper in the shaft, so the router bit has to move down while its being tightened. The movement is small but it's there, so if the bottom of the bit touches the bottom of the shaft before being completely tightened you have a potential serious problem.