Is Festool tools worth the extra money

[Birdhunter]

I think the OP's question of relative value begs the question of how he wants to measure value.

If I were in the woodworking business, value boils down to profit made per unit of time as long as the quality of the work remains constant. The person would have to consider purchase price, maintenance cost, time, etc.

I do woodworking mostly for pleasure and rarely for commission. My value analysis is mostly based on enjoyment of using the tool. If the cost of the tool doesn't make me feel I'm getting ripped off, it doesn't matter that much.few people see my shop so "showing off" isn't a factor. My tools have to perform exceptionally well due to the type of projects I do and Festool stuff does. I can't abide dust and Festool does an excellent job of minimizing dust. So, Festool tools check my criteria boxes and satisfy my value demands.

Also, buying Festool stuff has allowed me to gift my mostly DeWalt tools to a young friend just getting into the hobby. Looking at his work, he will evolve into a much better woodworker than I.

 

[Pykie]

I have most tools you can think of, without doubt the TS55 is the best tool I've owned and have ever owned. I'm a builder based out of Australia, the amount of tedious jobs it's now made ridiculously easy and quicker is countless. Cutting any kind of cement sheet is brilliant, I use it for hanging doors, flooring etc.

The Rotex is right up there in my books as well. I'm yet to have bought something from Festool that I haven't liked yet, so yes, definitely worth the number.

 

[air19]

I've been a hobby woodworker for about 20 years.  Two years ago my wife got me a Festool TS55 tracksaw and the CT36 dust extractor.  I started going into the shop more often again, just because of the joy of using this tool.  Yes there were less expensive alternatives.  But my wife wanted to surprise me and she wanted to make sure the tool would be great and the 30 day return policy totally convinced her she couldn't make a mistake.

Fast forward two years and I have the Domino and joinery is fun again.  I used to use a slot mortiser and got tired of working in a dust cloud for hours at a time.  Now I use the Domino for everything - convenience, accuracy, repeatability, and dust free.  I got a 1400 router to eventually use with the tracks.  I started with one project where I had to handle a large roundover bit going around a desk I had many hours in already.  Didn't feel confident with any of my other four routers.  But the balance and the handle position of the 1400 made it easy.  I smiled for days after that task. 

Then I made the big system jump up to the MFT.  I needed to make a bed and do accurate cross cuts of big pieces (2 feet by 8 feet).  I couldn't handle any of these with my sled on the table saw.  I saw Paul Marcel's videos on the MFT and decided to take another 30 day plunge.  I made the most accurate cross cuts I have ever done.  More smiles.  And in the process I found another hidden benefit of Festool - there massive parts database.  I could literally order any part of any tool and it has opened up new ways to think about the MFT so I can make my own custom versions.  I cruise the internet now looking at other Festool owners who are years ahead of me with their own adaptations and think about other parts I could use in clever ways.  Contrast that with Delta tool owners now who buy a brand new drill press and can't get replacement parts for a product that is currently being sold. 

I balance this TS, Domino, Router, Dust Extractor, and MFT system with lots of other tools from other manufacturers.  This area for me is where the sum of the parts is greater than the individual tools and yes simply a joy to use.  All my battery powered tools are Bosch simply because I have committed to the Bosch battery system.  Any new portable tool I look at has to be a Bosch and for the most part they have good choices. 

It all comes down to what makes you happy.  As a hobby woodwork that's what this is all about.  And in one corner of my shop my Festool tools do just that and more.  And yes they do make me a better woodworker.  And it all started with a 30 day return policy that allowed my wife to try something and get me an amazing gift.   

 

[Rembrand Timber Ltd]

As a dealer I am often told that the customer "just cant justify the extra expense". My response usually goes like this.
I have been selling timber to my clients for about twenty years and only recently become a Festool dealer. The general response I have had from my clients have been, especially for the TS55, that they are delighted with the product it has changed the way they do business (working inside a clients property with the dust extraction) wouldn't want to be without it and often "its paid for itself already"!

Also I know of TS 55's changing hands at over £200 sometimes as old as eight years.

So another big selling point that I use is the resale value of the tools.

There also seems to a trend of customers selling their tool when out of warranty and re-buying into the service all inclusive protection.

So are Festool worth the extra money? YES and you can certainly justify it.

 

[tony_sheehan]

I think maybe  their is other things you would be better off spend you're money on

 

[aloysius]

Are they worth the extra money?

Well.... Yes.  & no.  & maybe.

What's you expectation?  What's your intended use?  How well does Fest's limited range of tools fit these expectations?

I've found some of Festo's range to be excellent for my own uses, especially the HL850 plane, (old model) Rotex sander (hate the bayonet pad fitting on the new, love the edge guarding), the Deltex is a gem, much more aggressive & efficient if not quite as ultimately versatile as the equivalent Bosch GDA.

Users adore the Dominoes, whereas I'm at sixes & sevens over the dubious merits of loose tenons at all:  speed over quality or even economy over tradition are not my particular requirements when jointing.

Some tools are made much better by others, however.  The same could be said to be true for much of the products from any tool manufacturer that you'd care to name.  Each tends to have a particular specialty or expertise in a particular category.

Some Festos are just plain awful, too.  Again, just like any other manufacturer.  In my own opinion, their Kapex, Trion, Rotex 90 & much of their cordless range fall into the latter category.  Other users however will (& do) disagree vehemently.  Different horses for different courses.  I believe one can find "better" tooling at lower prices (i.e. better value) elsewhere.

Above all else Festo, like Rupes, is a specialist sander manufacturer & just like them has a hard-won and probably justifiably good reputation for their sanders.  I also find their vacs to be a cut above the rest too.

 

[EMWLou]

Hello all, I used to be a regular here back when this forum first started. Life took me away for a while, but I might hang out here again for a bit.

There isn't a one size fits all answer for the question at hand here. I am a pro and use Festool everyday on jobsites. I've had this debate with hundreds of other tradesmen throughout the years. I own a lot of Festool gear. Some of them are worth every penny, and others aren't even close to being worth the premium price. There's too many variables to just say yes or no. It depends on what you use the tool for, how often you use it, what are you getting out of it (compensation, satisfaction, more accuracy, etc.), and how thick your wallet is.

Let's be real, everything that can be done with Festool can be done with other tools/methods. I buy Festool for the ease of use, efficiency, dust extraction, etc. While other methods may work, they usually won't combine all the things I just mentioned. I'll just give one example of a Festool product that has been worth every penny and then some to me over the years. When the TS55 (it used to be the ATF55 I believe) first came out, I grabbed one. It was a lot of money for me then and I had a really hard time parting with the cash. Well, I've owned that saw for over a decade now. I have made thousands and thousands of cuts with it. Many of those cuts were made with other carpenters drooling as they watched me. That tool gave me an edge over many of my competitors and has allowed me to land many profitable jobs over the years. I've always been an extremely meticulous worker that produced excellent results, but that saw took me to another level. In the quality of the work I produced, the speed I get in done in, and in the cleanliness of my worksite. If all of my tools were stolen tomorrow, the first tool I would replace is my TS55 and nothing else I own would even come close. Having said all of that, that's just my view and my own experience with the tool. Other people might see it very differently and they are entitled to their view.

To be fair, I have several Festools that I love and others that I wish I never bought. Not that there is anything wrong with them, I just don't feel I've even come close to getting enough return on my investment to justify the purchase. I won't name those tools because I think it would be unfair. Festool is expensive, but you can justify the price if the situation fits. We're all different though...

 

[peter halle]

Hello all, I used to be a regular here back when this forum first started. Life took me away for a while, but I might hang out here again for a bit.

There isn't a one size fits all answer for the question at hand here. I am a pro and use Festool everyday on jobsites. I've had this debate with hundreds other tradesmen throughout the years. I own a lot of Festool gear. Some of them are worth every penny, and others aren't even close to being worth the premium price. There's too many variables to just say yes or no. It depends on what you use the tool for, how often you use it, what are you getting out of it (compensation, satisfaction, more accuracy, etc.), and how thick your wallet is.

Let's be real, everything that can be done with Festool can be done with other tools/methods. I buy Festool for the ease of use, efficiency, dust extraction, etc. While other methods may work, they usually won't combine all the things I just mentioned. I'll just give one example of a Festool product that has been worth every penny and then some to me over the years. When the TS55 (it used to be the ATF55 I believe) first came out, I grabbed one. It was a lot of money for me then and I had a really hard time parting with the cash. Well, I've owned that saw for over a decade now. I have made thousands and thousands of cuts with it. Many of those cuts were made with other carpenters drooling as they watched me. That tool gave me an edge over many of my competitors and has allowed me to land many profitable jobs over the years. I've always been an extremely meticulous worker that produced excellent results, but that saw took me to another level. In the quality of the work I produced, the speed I get in done in, and in the cleanliness of my worksite. If all of my tools were stolen tomorrow, the first tool I would replace is my TS55 and nothing else I own would even come close. Having said all of that, that's just my view and my own experience with the tool. Other people might see it very differently and they are entitled to their view.

To be fair, I have several Festools that I love and others that I wish I never bought. Not that there is anything wrong with them, I just don't feel I've even come close to getting enough return on my investment to justify the purchase. I won't name those tools because I think it would be unfair. Festool is expensive, but you can justify the price if the situation fits. We're all different though...

Welcome back!  Remember you well. Well written honest post.

Peter

 

[YASMINSDAD]

Invalid question.

Yes and No.

The universe, contrary to popular opinion, is a shade of grey, not black and white.

Some Festool tools are the best value for money tools you can buy simply because they do things more efficiently either in and of themselves or by enabling in a more efficient workflow pattern) whilst some, obviously are less good value and some quite poor value.

Festool cannot be the best at everything, notably their battery technology lacks behind the market leaders and some of their solutions are far from perfect but some of their solutions are simply peerless.

The question you should be asking is 'do I NEED this Festool tool?' And the answer to that should be divided into two parts, do I need it because it is economically more efficient (will it make me more money over time?) OR do I need it because it fits in a systainer, has a plug it hose and a warranty I trust, makes me feel good and matches the rest of my stuff?

Both parts are valid.

For the most part I have been resistant to buy Festool where I don't need to, to the point where I probably should have bought some tools earlier. The great thing about Festool is that you can buy it, try it out and if it doesn't work as you thought it might you can normally resell it later on for a comparatively small loss. All craftsmen and professional skilled workers do this, very often the only way you can positively check if an idea works is to buy it and try it out, at least in the USA you have the fantastically brilliant consumer protection that allows you to return some items after 28 days, if I was over there I would buy everything to try it out! Sadly in the UK developing your workflow and tool solutions can be an expensive mission.

I say for the most part because I have a serious Systainer/Tanos addiction.

As I am mobile and work onsite with several hundred kilos of very expensive tools the systainer system is the best thing for me Festool have ever created. I now have several mini MFT MDF tops made that turn my boxes into mobile benches, everything about systainers is completely brilliant despite their relative fragility and non resistance to some solvents. Unless you mainly do first fix for second fix work they are just unbeatable.

Extractors. I went through several Feins and Trends (both very good) before buying my CT22, why? Because of the long life bag. I empty my bags maybe ten times a week so it's really a no brainer and my extractors, expensive as they are are miles ahead of anything else on the market due to that one simple feature. That's Festool.

And lights. Especially the SysLite Duo. It may appear expensive but it really isn't, it's actually quite cheap. Want a compact genuine 8,000 lumen durable LED light with excellent heat sink that fits in a systainer with the worlds best tripod? Buy a Syslite OR wait for someone else to make one.

OK, the Rotex is great but for the uncomfortable position of the gear selector (please change on the new version and make it EC so it gets less hot, thanks) it's the best, the new Makita derivative looks good for those who use it less but I have tried the previous Makita, Metabo, Mafell, Bosch and DeWalt versions and the Rotex beats all of them, by quite a margin.

Want the best finishing sander in the world, buy an ETS EC, OK, they could have made it almost perfect by allowing you to turn off the infuriating anti vibration feature and yes not offering the option to change the 150mm pad for a 125mm pad is mean in a very Festool type way but it's still incomparably brilliant, like a Mirka Ceros or Deros only just better.

There are some things that are comical, like SYS power hub, why not make the power take off work independently of the vacuum motor? Then a £4 multi plug adaptor does mostly the same job, personally I made my own, I can keep 30m of extra cord inside.

Someone said art is what you like and in the same way the 'worth' of Festool tools is what you like, whether that is purely an economic, ergonomic or scientific argument and or simply an emotional one doesn't matter.

It's ok to not buy Festool because you can buy something somewhere else that does the same job as well or cheaper just as it's also ok to buy a Festool tool simply because it matches the rest of your kit and you like their ethos. Either/or or both.

I have several tools, many of them Festool that (usually after a particularly arduous or complicated task) make me involuntarily smile at how good they are at what they do, how much they help me in doing what I do and how so totally *****d I would have been without them.

I'm not entirely sure how you work out the cost benefit ratio of that.

 

[Nlj]

Is this still a live forum? 
My experience with first purchase of festool: NOT IMPRESSED.  Over priced and regardless of the hype, no more functional or user friendly than any of the other brands at less than half the price.
I purchased the vac, router and stand: pushing $3000.00.  Over priced, doesn’t provide any better performance than 20 year old tools in the shop. Too much fiddling around trying to set up. Production is no better than other brands. 
This may be something for a one owner shop but definitely not for employees to figures out on the job site.  Learning curve is silly.  And units, except vac, look to be too fragile and temperamental for various works to use on various sites.
I will. It recommend anyone to purchase these again.
Just my experience.

 

[Nlj]

Not sure what happened.
Last comment is: I would not, will not recommend this product for purchase again.
I am disappointed with it.

 

[Nlj]

Thought I might ad: I have been in construction and working with wood casement projects for over 40 years.  Yes, even back when carpenters used handsaws and plum bobs , when Delta tools were top of the line. So yes: I know a good tool when I’m using it. 
These tools don’t measure up to that standard.

 

[Bob D.]

Yes, it is still live. Most likely most don't feel the need to respond to your leading post.

To me (I am speaking for myself not on behalf of the forum or Festool as I have no
association with them) it sounds like you should return everything and look elsewhere.

From the sounds of it I don't think you will ever be happy with your Festool purchase
so for your own peace of mind research and buy something else.

 

[mrboult]

lol $3000 for a router, table and vac? How much better did you expect it to be than a cheaper setup? Which router did you get? I assume by “table” you mean the festool router tables/CMS thingy I don’t know much about. . .

Festool vacs might be quieter, more powerful, longer lasting with great filtration and with various useful accessories available and systainer compatibility, but in terms of sucking from a tool, what did you expect to be better?

The routers are generally loved because of their easy adjustability and setting, things that get a little lost in a table I’d imagine.

The CMS is likely the mist expensive router table there is. Useful if you also use the saw insert, or have other MFT table that (I assume) match the height and/or connect to MFT tables. But on its own, compared to a regular router table, I imagine the cost is hard to justify.

For all your experience, I’m not sure how good you imagined a router table setup could be? You’ve given no examples of what you’re doing and what the issues are. Dropping $3000 in one go was on you man, maybe you’re still in the returns window? Good luck

 

[xedos]

The router and vac will hold up fine on jobsites if not abused.  Now, you're not got to be able to chuck it about and drop it on the ground in the dirt from the window scaffolding like those old metal Stanleys and B&D  models of yesteryear. 

Sure the routers are a bit fiddly to set up in comparison to others.  But, that's mainly because it's foreign to you and others' compared to the traditional Porter Cable types.  The euro manufs. take a different approach to lots of things. Be glad you didn't have to buy a metric one !  And the handle arrangement is just no to some's liking no matter how much time in the saddle they get with it.  My take is that they really aren't the best tool for "rough" router work outside.

The real "value" is hidden in the system - which is also one of the negatives.  Being able to roll a vacuum with 5 systainers into an elevator and up to a unit to work , and then swapping tools out to one cord/hose connected to the vac has value to many carpenters.  Others couldn't care less about those features and might look at the systainers as a liability.

No other make has the 30 day return for any reason policy, something that is tailor made for situations like this. 

 

[Michael Kellough]

“This may be something for a one owner shop but definitely not for employees to figures out on the job site.”

Correct. There are yellow tools for people who aren’t personally invested.

There is eBay for people who bought tools they find disappointing.

 

[Mario Turcot]

Typical and senseless.

3 years later, someone create an account and make 3 negative posts.

 

[ben_r_]

LOL Why was this thread bumped?!

 

[Bob D.]

I hate the non adjustability of the speed on the barrel grip jigsaw.  You set the speed by clicking the dial to a predetermined speed and it runs at that speed constantly.  But with my Bosch top handle jigsaw, it has a trigger that varies the speed depending on how hard I pull the trigger.  At various times on all cuts I want to speed up or slow down the blade, starting, turns, corners, I want a different speed.  Can't do that with the barrel grip jigsaw.

Yes, that is something I miss about my Bosch jigsaw too. But I still have the Bosch so not totally gone. However it is something about the barrel grip saw that I didn't realize I would miss and if I had thought of it swapped it for the other model inside the 30 day window. I use it but miss the instantly adjustable speed on the variable trigger on the Bosch on which you could set the top speed on the dial and then vary within that range using the trigger.

 

[rubber_ducky]

IMO the most import take away from the bumper’s $3000 experiment is that one should google if ___ is worth the additional expense before dropping big $ on ___ instead of the other way around.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk