LR-32 System...alternatives?

[sofa_king_rad]

The LR 32 System looks great but for a noob, it's not a cheap. Is there some jigs or other options. or is it well worth the money to get teh LR-32?

 

[copcarcollector]

Rockler, Lee Valley and others have less expensive alternatives to the LR32 shelf hole drilling system. Kreg  has a nice little jig as well, I used mine recently with good result. However these other systems rely on a handheld drill, whereas the LR32 uses a router, with a drill you may end up with a slightly off 90 degree hole, but then again they are not very deep in the first place, so not sure it really matters--- Also the LR32 uses a 55" or 95" rail, so you can do a lot of holes with one setup. These other jigs typically let you drill less holes at a time, so you may have to reset the jig several times along a longer work piece
http://www.rockler.com/jig-itreg-shelving-jig-jig-it174-shelving-jig-set-template-self-centering-bit
http://www.rockler.com/pro-shelf-drilling-jig
http://www.rockler.com/bench-dog-shelf-pin-jig
http://www.amazon.com/KREG-KMA3200-...1?ie=UTF8&qid=1462309402&sr=8-1&keywords=kreg+shelf+pin+jig
http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/page.aspx?p=42200&cat=3

 

[AIPDX]

Another lower cost jig:  Woodpeckers Combination Shelf Pin Drill Template
http://www.amazon.com/Woodpeckers-Precision-Woodworking-Tools-SPT-COMBO/dp/B004646WHQ
http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/woodpeckers-shelf-pin-template.aspx

Obviously, LR-32 is a system which bridges small jigs (which are priced in the $100 and under range) with high throughput production tools (which are priced at 3-10k, as far as I understand). It helps when it comes to drilling many holes and for drilling long rows of holes without the expense and space required by stationary tools.

Other known advantage is a nicer quality of holes due to benefit of using a router instead of a drill.

You need LR-32 set, guide rail with holes, and an OF1100 or OF1400 router to be able to use the system.

I was not too much impressed with LR32. I mean, it is a good system which does the job, but somehow I expected a little more "bang for the buck". The first LR32 set which I bought broke down after about 200 holes. The rocker arm got stuck, the lock pin would not go into the hole (perhaps only with a help of a mallet). I took it back to the dealer and got it replaced. The second set worked fine. "Fine" is a relative word, LR32 does not feel quite as refined as I would like it to see. I think it could benefit from a greater smoothness in operation. The rocker arm would not get stuck on the replacement unit, but one could feel some friction there, as if metal grinds against metal when pin goes in and out. I wish rocker arm and mechanism which locks the guide plate on the rail worked smoother. But it does the job, and there are no real alternatives in its class. I needed, I think, about 1000 holes for my project, and it was a relatively fast process to get them all drilled.

The other point to keep in mind is that you can only drill holes at 32 mm center to center, or 16 mm with two passes. You can drill them either 1/4" or 5 mm, but cannot change the distance from these presets. This generally does not make a difference for any practical purposes, but if you want to use the "SAE-based" distance between holes defined in inches (which you will never need if you are not in the US), then you can't. With lower cost jigs, it is oftentimes the other way around, or sometimes you can use both standards.

 

[Kev]

For a quality finish it's well worth the money to get a system with precise indexing and one that uses a router with an appropriate bit. In reality a drill with a stop collar and a piece of pegboard as a template (or make your own with a piece of aluminium) can achieve a working result. If you're in doubt about how far you want to go, you can play at the low end of the continuum and spend less that $30 to see how it works. The real disappointment is when you "leap into the middle" and find you wasted your money and need something better and end up spending even more that you would have if you'd just bitten the bullet.

 

[Holmz]

The first video on this page:http://festoolownersgroup.com/vario...pics/dp-shop-talk-videos/msg456493/#msg456493
Your other good alternatives have been mentioned on post #2, #3 and Kev's.

Whether it is worth it depends on how many, or how often you are pounding out 32-mm holes.

On the far end, and at the highest cost, is a Mafell DD40, and the castlated rail.
If you are doing sheet goods (which are what typically have 32-mm holes), then Lamello's Divario could make sense.

If you are getting a TS55 then you might as well get the holey rail, and decide later.

 

[polarsea1]

I use a True Position TP1935 for shelf pins, drawer and door hardware - you can bore a cabinet box before or after assembly and it's quick:

TP-1935

This is the hot setup for drilling holes for Blum drawer slides, it's billed as an Aventos drilling template but it works with any of the Blum slides I am familiar with: epoxy, Metabox, Tandem.

Blum Aventos drilling template

 

[Holmz]

I use a True Position TP1935 for shelf pins, drawer and door hardware - you can bore a cabinet box before or after assembly and it's quick:

TP-1935

This is the hot setup for drilling holes for Blum drawer slides, it's billed as an Aventos drilling template but it works with any of the Blum slides I am familiar with: epoxy, Metabox, Tandem.

Blum Aventos drilling template

I just got their puck jig yesterday.
I assume the linked jig is just as good?

 

[Tyler Ernsberger]

You don't have to buy the whole lr32 kit.  You can buy the guide plate 494340 for $128.  You can make it fit any plunge router by adding mounting holes.  The only things that you would need is a hole guide rail and a solid carbide cutter that will cost you $20. 

 

[jeh]

+1 on the DD40. A great joiner with the added bonus of being great for shelf pins when combined with their template guide.

 

[FOGNewbie]

The LR 32 System looks great but for a noob, it's not a cheap. Is there some jigs or other options. or is it well worth the money to get teh LR-32?

An in expensive route might be the Kreg Shelf pin Jig. You can connect multiples to get the length you need. The pluses are you can also bore 1/4" pins in addition to 5mm pins in addition to adding shelf pin holes to an existing cabinet. The downside is it would be harder to do the True 32 system.
https://www.google.com/search?q=kreg+shelf+pin+jig+youtube&oq=Kreg+shelf+&aqs=chrome.3.0j69i57j0l4.10961j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Probably more of an addition to the LR-32 than a replacement.

 

[polarsea1]

I use a True Position TP1935 for shelf pins, drawer and door hardware - you can bore a cabinet box before or after assembly and it's quick:

TP-1935

This is the hot setup for drilling holes for Blum drawer slides, it's billed as an Aventos drilling template but it works with any of the Blum slides I am familiar with: epoxy, Metabox, Tandem.

Blum Aventos drilling template

I just got their puck jig yesterday.
I assume the linked jig is just as good?

Yea, It's high quality stuff.

 

[grbmds]

As was said in other posts there are a number of alternatives for shelf pins or locating/drilling holes for hinges. In my research, the lower priced jigs are usually one-purpose jigs, meaning you need a jig for the shelf pins and then a separate jig for the hinges. Nothing wrong with that and, in fact, unless you produce a lot of cabinets or bookshelves, there doesn't seem to be a good reason to spend $500 on the LR32 set plus an additional $130 on the guide rail (if you do not already have it). I've used the LR32 system in a Festool class recently and it does a great job. It's accurate. It's not that difficult to setup, but it's strongest point, to me, is that it is meant for the craftsman who produces a lot of cabinets on a daily basis. I purchased a Rockler router jig for cup hinges a few years ago for less than $50 plus had to buy an extra deep template guide for the router (a couple of dollars). It does a great job for single cabinets or even if you are making several together. It's not a one-time setup tool, but I'm sure that you could do some quick jigs for hinge placement if you were doing more than one cabinet or bookshelf. One of the inexpensive shelf pin jigs would be more than adequate for doing a small number of cabinets. I love the LS32 system, but it's really meant for mass production shops.

 

[Eden1415]

There are lots of different shelf hole making jigs.  You can make your own, and even buy predrilled MDF. Here's the problem, for short lengths, I know I've used  several of them ,they work fine for ad hoc or short runs. However as you move the jig repeatedly errors in alignment creep in.  The LR32 system is based on a European  system on how to layout the cabinet holes so can use standardized 5mm holes 32mm apart, 37mm in from the cabinet face.  Most hinge manufactures build hardware that  fit this pattern. 

The Festool system allows for large shop based manufacturing precision on a job site.  Which in theory should remove the problem of rocking shelves if you put your carcass together correctly. I've adapted my trusty PC 892 router to use the LR32 and love it.  Remember, you don't have to buy the whole kit, just what you need.  For any long runs, on raw sheet goods, I use the LR32 for in place cabinets, I generally use a shortened Rockler jig so I can get it into place to make the holes.  Most manufacture cabinets use the 32mm spacing standard so this work fine.   

 

[ColossusX]

I have the woodpeckers jig.  Love it.  I'm not a production shop, just build some cabinets now and then for built-ins.  Can use a drill or router.  32mm system or some american system that I never use.  Long enough you dont have to reposition much.  Also have the kreg, but it's only like 5 holes and you have to keep moving it, adding errors, unless you buy several of them. For an inexpensive option, you cant go wrong with the Woodpeckers jig

 

[xedos]

If you want a router based system -  the Bosch FSN-OFA 32 with a Colt router ( or other compact of your choice) would be something to consider.  It would be around $375 all in, though you would have the hassle of importing the FSN as it's NAINA.

 

[jeh]

If you want a router based system -  the Bosch FSN-OFA 32 with a Colt router ( or other compact of your choice) would be something to consider.  It would be around $375 all in, though you would have the hassle of importing the FSN as it's NAINA.

Bought one on Amazon from the UK Amazon site. Took two weeks to get here. I have not experimented with it yet, but bought it to be able to run my 1010 on my Mafell rails.

There are alternatives and the one I chose was the Mafell DD40, which with the coordinating templates is trivial to use. The DD40 is also a dowel joiner and I have not seen any strength difference between it and Domino.

 

[Birdhunter]

I wanted to add a vote for the Mafell DD40F Doweler. With the “rail” guide, it is amazingly accurate.

There is some overlap between the functions of the DD40F and the Domino machines. I used both on a recent large complex project. The Dominos are faster and allow glue up adjustments. The doweler is stunningly accurate.

 

[xedos]

I wanted to add a vote for the Mafell DD40F Doweler. With the “rail” guide, it is amazingly accurate.

There is some overlap between the functions of the DD40F and the Domino machines. I used both on a recent large complex project. The Dominos are faster and allow glue up adjustments. The doweler is stunningly accurate.

I think this is better than the lr32 for about the same money, but since the sofa king is new to the game AND was looking for cheaper alternatives it doesn't seem like a good suggestion for him.