MFT + TS55 instead of Unisaw, need advise

[kfitzsimons]

I'm considering purchasing a MFT 1080 (new model when available) and the TS55 saw combination to replace my Delta Unisaw.  My shop is in my unheated garage (Ohio) so I'm limited to three season woodworking.  I'm a hobbyist who likes to make basic cabinetry, not fine furniture, although I've made a beautiful TV / AV cabinet in cherry.  Am I making a mistake selling the Unisaw?  Is there anything that can't be done with the Festool combination that can be done much easier on the table saw?  I'd also sell my two Elu routers to get the Festool 1400 router to do the dadoes and rabbits with the guide rail.
What do you think? Anyone else out there gone through this same transformation?  I'd love to gain some space in the garage by not having the Unisaw and dust collector, but I don't want to regret selling the Unisaw a couple of years down the road.
Any input is helpful.
Thanks, Kevin

 

[chughes]

  Well now, in my humble opinion, for my money I'd keep the unisaw.  I have a ts 75 and an assortment of rails.  The 75 is my primary saw for ripping and breaking down in the field and in the shop I use the 75 as a panel saw.  That being said, there are many things that a table saw will do that would be difficult if not impossible for a plunge saw.  I do a lot with moulder heads, dados sometimes are easier with a table saw,  and for repeating smaller cut the table saw is superior.  Each piece of equipment offers redundancy against the other and you could live without the other but I don't. Thats my 2 cents.

 

[Eli]

If you didn't have it already I'd say wait to buy it. But instead I'd say, wait to sell it. Everybody's different in their preferences. Yeah, you could do without it, but let your workflow settle before you decide to ax it. No question there are a few things a tablesaw can be more convenient for.

 

[Daviddubya]

I'm not going to advise you to get rid of a Unisaw - that's your decision.  However, there are some limitations to using the MFT and TS75 (or TS55).  One of the limitations is the depth of cut you can make on the MFT.  That dimension is about 23" using the MFT in its "standard" configuration.  You can increase the cut to about 41" by mounting the fence and rail across the short end of the MFT.  If you have the need to cut anything bigger, like a 4X8 sheet of plywood, then you would use a guide rail clamped to the material.  Making lots of cuts in sheets that are the same size, like when building cabinets, is much faster on a table saw, once the sheets are cut into a manageable size using the rail and saw.

Another limitation to the MFT is cutting repetive rips.  If you are cuttng face frame material, for example, from large planks, it is much faster to set the fence on your table saw and rip as many pieces of the same width as you might need for a project.

Repetitive dados can also be done quickly and accurately on a table saw.  Setting up a cut for multiple pieces with the same dado (like bookcase or cabinet sides) is one setup and then cut all of the pieces on a table saw.  Then again, cutting the same dado in multiple pieces on the MFT is also fast and accurate, assuming the pieces do not exceed the depth of the MFT mentioned above.

Certainly, these operations can be done using a rail and saw/router or the MFT and saw/router, but if you have a table saw you would probably make the choice to do the cuts faster.  In my shop, I use both the table saw and the MFT on almost every project.

 

[honeydoman]

keep your unisaw as mentioned before it haas its uses that are faster than ts75.  and using the ts75 and the mft table has its advantage.  besides you will not be able to get much for your saw.

for the next 6 months which is about the time the new table will come out.  keep track of what you do and don't do with your table saw and the ts75.  and then decide.  keep the saw.  buy a space heater for your garage, or 2-3 and fire them up and your garage will be fine to work in

 

[kfitzsimons]

Thanks for the replies and advice, fellows.  Keep the opinions coming - it's interesting.  At least I have time on my side.  The new MFT will not be available for several months from what I've been told by a Festool dealer.  I do like my Unisaw, it's a matter of space and usage.  I'll keep my options open for awhile.
Thanks again.  I appreciate it.
    Kevin

 

[chughes]

  Is your unisaw on a mobile base?

 

[kfitzsimons]

Yes it is on a mobile base so I can move it around and somewhat out of the way.  The dust collector is also on wheels.  When I add up the items I have for the table saw, it's amazing the space the stuff takes up.  Saw, long side extension table, over-arm blade guard, Biesemeyer cut-off sled (brand new, never used), Dubby cut-off sled, blades and dado set, 1 hp dust collector, heavy duty miter fence, etc.  I would gain a lot of space if I switched to the MFT, TS55 and 1400 router.  Everyones comments make sense though.  A lot to consider.

 

[Daviddubya]

I'll take one of those sleds off your hands.  Just send it along to me and it will have a good home. 

 

[Dan Clermont]

I don't have a tablesaw. My shop is too small and I don't like the way the blade spins!

I can see the definite benefit of a Tablesaw when ripping narrow pieces. I use my bandsaw and a handplane for narrow boards. Works for me but it does eat up some time. I hope to have an MFS soon and will use the TS-55 to rip narrow pieces.

My suggestion is to try and live without the tablesaw for awhile and see what obstacles arise. Then decide if the MFT and maybe an MFS can get the job done for you.

Dan C

 

[Jesse Cloud]

Hey Kevin,
I'm in the same situation you are.  I find myself using the unisaw less and less, but I still crank it up for repetitive rabbets and dadoes and to use a few jigs.  It also makes a great assembly table.

I would offer contrary advice to some that you have received.  Sell the unisaw if you can get a good price, but keep the accessories.  Try living without a TS for a while and if you have regrets, buy another one.  They will make more - and maybe your new one will have a riving knife! 

If you find you don't need the TS, then loose the accessories.

 

[MarkF]

Kevin,
I went a different route.  I started with a TS-55 and MFT and tried to have a tablesaw-less hobby shop for about 6 months.  Repetitive ripping and thick stock are the weaknesses with this system...doable but not easy to be dead nuts accurate on long, narrow rips.  I found a great deal on an older Unisaw.  Refurbed it and added a Beis. fence, extension table w/router insert.  The TS-55/MFT1080 is my crosscut/sanding/anything involving handheld powertools station.  The Unisaw is my ripping, routertable and extra horizontal space to put junk.  The MFT also serves an an infeed table for the Unisaw for extralong stock.  If space is an issue you can use the MFT as an out feed or extension table for your Unisaw.  Search the photos for a way to add wooden extenions to the legs to get the MFT even with your Unisaw or you can disconnect the legs and mount the MFT to a rolling cart even with your desired height.

Mark

 

[semenza]

Hi,

    I would agree with others that ripping thin strips is easier/faster with a table saw. It is definetly do-able though.  I can get them to be very, very close to the same thickness. If I need them dead on the same I cut them a little thicker and run them through my planer to get them all the same. This also takes out blade marks. But for referance I can cut strips down to an 1/8" so close in thickness that you have to put them side by side to see it any difference. I am getting away without a table saw and doing this as a business. I have nothing against table saws , and eventually may get one just to speed up certain operations. But I am in no hurry either. If you really don't want the table saw and are a hobbiest as you describe. I would say that the table saw is not needed.

 

[semenza]

Hi,

    Since you already have the Unisaw, and DC. Perhaps it would be wise to get the Festool stuff before you sell. The Festool stuff won't take much extra space. That way you can have both and make the decision for yourself. The table saw  vs TS + MFT question has come up several times on the FOG. You can find more posts on it by doing some searches. I think that a lot of the decision on this depends on what you build and how you work. Even people doing the same type of work have differing set ups.  The shop set up and other tools you own will make a difference also. For example, in my previous post above - The fact that I have the planer makes it easier for me not to need the table saw.

Seth

 

[fidelfs]

I am a hobbyist and I have all my equipment in my non AC garage.  My garage faces the afternoon sun directly there is no tree or anything for shade.  I live in Houston, TX so I am also limited to 3 seasons.  I don't woodwork during the hot humid humid humid humid summer.

I have many machines in my garage, Unisaw, Rikon Band Saw, Jointer, Planner, Drill Press 15, bench mortizer, Full size bench, MFT, TS55, OF1400, Domino, RO125, Incra 5000, mobile dust extraction, etc.

I had the same idea to go tablesawless and I decided to give it a good try.
I used to love my MFT and TS55 before when I used together with the tablesaw.  I was ripping with my Tablesaw and crosscutting with the MFT.  The day I tried to go tablesawless that was the day I hated the MFT and TS55.
Forget about the limitations about thin strips, deep of cut, etc.  The real limitation is when you are used to the tablesaw speed and power.

The TS55 has a lot of power but is not 220V, there is a big difference.  Try to imagine this:
I have to remove the guide system from the mft for any reason so when I need it I had to square the MFT and the guide.
Lift the rail so I can put the wood.
set the wood to make an accurate cut (in my experience this is very fuzzy the first time vs moving the biesemeyer fence)
Lock the rail system with the front.
lift the TS55 and set it into the rail
Start the cut.
when finish (this is slow if you compare the 220 volts, 3HP Unisaw) remove the TS55.
Lift the rail system,
Remove the wood.
repeat this several times until you rip and crosscut all the wood.
after doing this several time, I hated so much this system.  Let me add something else if you don't have the boom arm you have to wrestle with the vacuum hose.

I love my Festool equipment so I have to go back to my Unisaw and use in bundle with the MFT.  I had never tried angle cuts with the MFT but for I read that is not very accurate , like I said I have never tried but I imagine it is not simple as the Unisaw and dubby.

This is just my experience and I admire the people able to go tablesaless, but I cannot do it.
I always believe to use the right tool for the right project.  My advise is, get the MFT and TS55 and go tablesawless to see if you are confortable with it, if you are ok with that great, if not you can use both the mft and tablesaw.

;D

 

[tvgordon]

I have a Delta contractor's saw and would like to buy a TS55 or 75 and mft this year.  I also thought about selling the tablesaw to free up space and because the TS is a safer saw.  But I plan on using both for a while before I make the final decision.  Without having used the TS, it seems that the tablesaw is better for multiple cuts of the same width and ripping thinner pieces.  Also better for making a parallel cut with a jointed edge, while the TS would be better at sheet goods, cutting a straight edge on a rough sawn board, squaring glued up panels, etc.  I tend to think that they each have their place in the shop, but time will tell.

Tom.

 

[rblaustein]

I'm not going to advise you to get rid of a Unisaw - that's your decision.  However, there are some limitations to using the MFT and TS75 (or TS55).  One of the limitations is the depth of cut you can make on the MFT.  That dimension is about 23" using the MFT in its "standard" configuration.  You can increase the cut to about 41" by mounting the fence and rail across the short end of the MFT.  If you have the need to cut anything bigger, like a 4X8 sheet of plywood, then you would use a guide rail clamped to the material.  Making lots of cuts in sheets that are the same size, like when building cabinets, is much faster on a table saw, once the sheets are cut into a manageable size using the rail and saw.

Another limitation to the MFT is cutting repetive rips.  If you are cuttng face frame material, for example, from large planks, it is much faster to set the fence on your table saw and rip as many pieces of the same width as you might need for a project.

Repetitive dados can also be done quickly and accurately on a table saw.  Setting up a cut for multiple pieces with the same dado (like bookcase or cabinet sides) is one setup and then cut all of the pieces on a table saw.  Then again, cutting the same dado in multiple pieces on the MFT is also fast and accurate, assuming the pieces do not exceed the depth of the MFT mentioned above.

Certainly, these operations can be done using a rail and saw/router or the MFT and saw/router, but if you have a table saw you would probably make the choice to do the cuts faster.  In my shop, I use both the table saw and the MFT on almost every project.

I would echo David's comments.  Sounds like you've put time and effort (and expense) into setting up the Unisaw in a way that maximizes your safety and accuracy.  Can you reproduce that with the MFT etc?  Yes, but definitely not as efficiently.  Unless you just don't like using your TS, or you really feel crunched for space, I would keep it for now.  You can always fold up the MFT when not in use.  I also agree with Dave about switching the fence on the MFT to maximize how wide a piece you can cut.  This comes in handy making cabinets from sheet goods.

 

[sl_1800]

I have a very small dewalt contrators table saw and I don't have room in my garage for a larger one, this is why I just bought a TS55.  At this point I'm sure I will still use the table saw for ripping narrow short boards and the TS55 for long rips from wider material.  It is just to hard to run a 4x8 piece of mdf or such through the small table saw so the TS55 is a blessing.  For cross cutting, the saw of choice will be determined by the amount of cut off vs the size of work piece.  For example if I were taking only a 1/2" off the end of a 28" x 4' board then I would use the TS55.  If I were taking that same 1/2" off of a 2" x 48" board then I would use the table saw.

 

[Dixon Peer]

Keep the Unisaw.  It's a good one, and you can do more with it then you'll be able to do with the Festool setup.  With shims (from Charles G.G. Schmidt) you can fine tune dadoes and plows to the thousandth of an inch for perfect fitting of cabinet carcass bottoms to sides and so on.  That'd be kind of hard with the Festools saw, don't you think, and that's just one application where the table saw excels. You can also put a small molding head on the saw and run profiles.  The table saw is too important a tool to give up in my opinion.

 

[kfitzsimons]

Interesting discussion.  Great opinions from hobbyists to seasoned pros.  After digesting the replies so far, it seems the best thing to do is purchase the MFT and TS55, use it and see if it is indeed, an alternative to the tablesaw.  It will be interesting to see if the new MFT is designed any different that would make it a more viable substitute for the Unisaw.  I'll have to save for a bit longer to make the purchase without selling the Uni. 
Any more thoughts?  You're really helping me think this out.