Parf Dogs

[andy5405]

To corroborate the words of their inventor, they are brilliant !

Brian

Fall River, Nova Scotia, Canada

I couldn't agree more and one thinks that one could take some of the glory on that one.

Click this link to see when the idea was first discussed on the FOG.

Here's two of the images I posted on the linked thread above in September 2011.

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I just checked the original design folder on my hard drive and I created those drawings in April 2011 and posted them on here on a thread with the word "dogs" in the title. I wouldn't be so bold as to say they should be called "Andy Dogs" but I think I might deserve a little credit. It's also worth noting that at the time the only Festool I owned wast a PS300 and I had never used a TS55, guide rail or MFT. It was all in my head so if Peter's brilliant I've run out of superlatives for myself.

 

[Stone Message]

To corroborate the words of their inventor, they are brilliant !

Brian

Fall River, Nova Scotia, Canada

I couldn't agree more and one thinks that one could take some of the glory on that one. Click this link to see where the idea was first discussed on the FOG.

There are many similar concepts out there but few seem to have been brought to market.

I came up with the Parf Dog concept after reviewing the rail dogs for a UK national magazine. My problem with the rail dogs was that they were a little fiddly but I am a touch arthritic. I felt that a pair of fixed posts was the way forward and hence the Parf Dog with an 8mm thread underneath.

It was interesting to see the many ideas for home made MFT tops on that thread. My mobile bench is nearly complete and I have yet to settle on a pattern for the holes. The only design element that I have fixed is that the outer holes (top, bottom and both sides) and the second row along the top will be placed very accurately for precision right angle work. The position of the majority of the remaining holes will not be critical as they will be used mainly for impromptu jig work or clamping points.

I have made the extension flaps and have put some old MDF top into them but I can replace these if I need a different pattern.

Peter

 

[andy5405]

There are many similar concepts out there but few seem to have been brought to market.

I don't think we are talking about a similar concept, to my mind my idea is identical. I just thought I might be worthy of a little credit.

 

[windmill man]

Would not hold your breath on that one. Plagiarism is common place these days .

 

[Wuffles]

I unwittingly copied your template idea, had no idea you had discussed it before (almost to the letter) - the 30mm guide bush holes and the registration 20mm holes in the corners (my particular take on it anyway). Discussed it at length with Steve Qwas over email too, don't think he'd twigged it had been discussed before either. Only saw your idea when you posted the link earlier. Uncanny. I'll take some photos if you're interested in it and never got round to it yourself.

When getting a new 8x4 sheet CNCd up I got them to whip out a template on half a sheet too so I wouldn't be bothering them again. Works a charm too.

However, that said, anyone with access to the SQL database behind this forum would be able to say which user has seen what post at what time. Just saying.

 

[woodguy7]

Andy, credit is over rated. A percentage of sales, now that's different 

 

[windmill man]

It's the folk that make the most noise that generally claim the idea.  I think I will stick to cutting up 20 mm electrical plastic conduit , to achieve the same results .  Oh heck I should not have let that one out the bag as someone will claim that idea and market them as "saw safe" dogs

 

[windmill man]

Would definitely not hold my breath on a percentage .

 

[peter halle]

Apparently their are some feelings out there about Dog designs.  I would suggest that the parties involved contact each other away from the Forum.  The Forum doesn't have a dog in this hunt.  Also, how about the rest of us not throw any more grease on the fire.

Thanks in advance.

Peter

 

[Davej]

It's the folk that make the most noise that generally claim the idea.  I think I will stick to cutting up 20 mm electrical plastic conduit , to achieve the same results .  Oh heck I should not have let that one out the bag as someone will claim that idea and market them as "saw safe" dogs

Copycat  [tongue] [big grin]. We need to thrash out the royalty percentage  [big grin] [big grin]. 0 percent of nowt = nowt . But being happy with what works for us = happy days
Dave

 

[windmill man]

Peter. We do have a "dog in this hunt" members post on here ideas and tips freely. In my book it's bad form ,if these ideas are taken and exploited. It's even worse if the originator is not given credit  ,for it and the exploiters then pass the ideas off as their own. At least be honest and if you take an idea and develop it , describe yourself as the developer and give due credit to the originator of the idea and this forum as the place where it was posted originally.

 

[peter halle]

You want me to  be honest.  OK.

1.  There is absolutely no proof that anyone took someone else's idea.  Whereas putting round pegs in round holes has been around since the beginning of the first cabinet maker's workbench I sincerely doubt that any dog ideas are patentable.  Otherwise Steve Adams would have.

2.  If someone has an idea that they think might be patentable and saleable - you do not post it on the internet until you have a patent in place.  To do otherwise would be counterproductive.

You are right, this Forum is about freely sharing help and ideas.  Once an idea is out here it is available to the over 3,000,000 viewers monthly.

Peter

 

[greg mann]

Jerry work used 20mm threaded couplings to take advantage of the hole pattern to guarantee square assemblies and I remember reading that way before 2010.

 

[rmwarren]

You want me to  be honest.  OK.

1.  There is absolutely no proof that anyone took someone else's idea.  Whereas putting round pegs in round holes has been around since the beginning of the first cabinet maker's workbench I sincerely doubt that any dog ideas are patentable.  Otherwise Steve Adams would have.

2.  If someone has an idea that they think might be patentable and saleable - you do not post it on the internet until you have a patent in place.  To do otherwise would be counterproductive.

You are right, this Forum is about freely sharing help and ideas.  Once an idea is out here it is available to the over 3,000,000 viewers monthly.

Peter

3 million hits (page views) or unique viewers?

 

[overanalyze]

We all have a million dollar idea in our lifetime...some of us a couple. Some are lucky and capitalize on it and some see it later in life and say I thought of that.....

 

[JeromeM]

It's the folk that make the most noise that generally claim the idea.  I think I will stick to cutting up 20 mm electrical plastic conduit , to achieve the same results .  Oh heck I should not have let that one out the bag as someone will claim that idea and market them as "saw safe" dogs

The 20 mm electrical plastic conduit idea was talked about in 2008 / 2009. I didn't originate it but did post a thread which used them "20mm hole on a 96mm grid system (mft-top-style)"

I'm all for the sharing of information. It's one of the ways we get inspiration for new designs. I try to credit the source where I can.

 

[peter halle]

You want me to  be honest.  OK.

1.  There is absolutely no proof that anyone took someone else's idea.  Whereas putting round pegs in round holes has been around since the beginning of the first cabinet maker's workbench I sincerely doubt that any dog ideas are patentable.  Otherwise Steve Adams would have.

2.  If someone has an idea that they think might be patentable and saleable - you do not post it on the internet until you have a patent in place.  To do otherwise would be counterproductive.

You are right, this Forum is about freely sharing help and ideas.  Once an idea is out here it is available to the over 3,000,000 viewers monthly.

Peter

3 million hits (page views) or unique viewers?

Forgive me.  Page views.  The point is still that if you want to keep a secret you don't post it on the FOG.

 

[JeromeM]

. My mobile bench is nearly complete and I have yet to settle on a pattern for the holes. The only design element that I have fixed is that the outer holes (top, bottom and both sides) and the second row along the top will be placed very accurately for precision right angle work. The position of the majority of the remaining holes will not be critical as they will be used mainly for impromptu jig work or clamping points.

I have made the extension flaps and have put some old MDF top into them but I can replace these if I need a different pattern.

Peter

Having been using my MFT style/inspired bench for the last 4 years, where I copied the 96mm grid, I have found that sometimes the pattern is very useful.

The really important point for me is that all rows are at 90degrees to all columns

 

[rmwarren]

You want me to  be honest.  OK.

1.  There is absolutely no proof that anyone took someone else's idea.  Whereas putting round pegs in round holes has been around since the beginning of the first cabinet maker's workbench I sincerely doubt that any dog ideas are patentable.  Otherwise Steve Adams would have.

2.  If someone has an idea that they think might be patentable and saleable - you do not post it on the internet until you have a patent in place.  To do otherwise would be counterproductive.

You are right, this Forum is about freely sharing help and ideas.  Once an idea is out here it is available to the over 3,000,000 viewers monthly.

Peter

3 million hits (page views) or unique viewers?

Forgive me.  Page views.  The point is still that if you want to keep a secret you don't post it on the FOG.

Either one is a bigger number than I would have expected. That's awesome!

RMW

 

[Slappy]

The point is still that if you want to keep a secret you don't post it on the FOG.

You don't post it anywhere until you at least document a set of plans
THE best way to that is :
draw the plans up in detail at least 3 views from all angles
then give a clear detailed description written out in a narrative  
dated & have a 2nd party witness sign that they observed the documents on that dated
THEN send the package of docs to yourself by registered mail
by you signing for the registered mail in person you have established a legal proof a time/date stamp of the dated materials .
from that moment forward it's your idea legally
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