Poplar Mouldings - Advice Needed

[TulsaWood]

After spending some time this past weekend painting some of the downstairs rooms, my wife is chomping at the bit to get the moldings replaced.  She brought home some samples, and I think they are going to look great. 

I've replaced simple baseboards that were pre-finished, but have never worked with anything like this before. I want to make sure they look as clean as possible after installation.  My wife really loves bright, clean lines, so we are planning to paint these white to lighten up the whole look of the downstairs.

So my question is where do I start?  I assume they will need to be sanded, primed, then painted.  And maybe some sanding between finishes?  We have about 250 linear feet of baseboards to install.  I haven't measured the door casings yet.

The baseboards are pretty flat, with some minor detail on the top edge.  The casings have a few more details, and I assume will take a bit more work to get ready.  I appreciate any advice on how I can setup my workflow.

Here are a couple pics of 2 of the rooms we're working on, and the molding samples.

This is the bonus room, which has a huge brick fireplace on the east wall.  Interesting tidbit:  The original ceiling in this room is vaulted, and the brick goes all the way up.  The previous owners put in this new ceiling with HVAC units above so this room could have a separate thermostat.
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Formal Dining room
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These are the poplar moldings samples we picked up from a local shop.
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Thanks!

EJ

 

[mdelrossi]

you might want to put a block at the junction of the door casing and the baseboard moulding that way when you vacuum or mop you won't damage the door casing.

Yes its a mess. [embarassed]Renovating soon.

 

[wrightwoodwork]

I was just thinking the same.  Do the blocks first I think for them type facings you don't want a square block more a block which has roughly a 30 degree bevel. Then do the facings and finish the room by doing the skirting, job done. I presume you have a kapex or any other chopsaw. Also a nice sharp block plane to help fit the mitres.

 

[Sparktrician]

you might want to put a block at the junction of the door casing and the baseboard moulding that way when you vacuum or mop you won't damage the door casing.

Yes its a mess. [embarassed]Renovating soon.

It's called a plinth block.  They'd look great with your trim styles. 

 

[Billedis]

I changed out all the 3 1/2 in base and 2 1/4 casing in my home and used these 8" plinth blocks at each door.[attachimg=1]

 

[Sparktrician]

You did a great job of matching up styles, Bill.  I've seen some that looked like a gawd-awful mess. 

 

[TulsaWood]

you might want to put a block at the junction of the door casing and the baseboard moulding that way when you vacuum or mop you won't damage the door casing.

It's called a plinth block.  They'd look great with your trim styles. 

I had never heard of plinth blocks.  Thanks for that tip.

I changed out all the 3 1/2 in base and 2 1/4 casing in my home and used these 8" plinth blocks at each door.[attachimg=1]

Very nice job, Bill.  How did you finish those?  Did you paint before or after installing them?  I'm hoping to learn as much as possible before I get started with mine. 

EJ

 

[Sparktrician]

I'd spray them with primer and let them dry before cutting to finished size, then apply the finish coat.  Much faster to getting everything done.  Sherwin-Williams Premium Wall & Wood Primer is quite good. 

 

[TulsaWood]

I'd spray them with primer and let them dry before cutting to finished size, then apply the finish coat.  Much faster to getting everything done.  Sherwin-Williams Premium Wall & Wood Primer is quite good.

I had a strong feeling they would need to be sprayed, but was hoping to save that money for more green tools.    [smile]

I may try hand painting a couple of samples, just to see we can save the money and still achieve a good result.  But I'm not opposed to picking up a sprayer if it gives us a much better looking finish.  Any advice on brands/types of sprayers you have experience using?

EJ

 

[Sparktrician]

I'd spray them with primer and let them dry before cutting to finished size, then apply the finish coat.  Much faster to getting everything done.  Sherwin-Williams Premium Wall & Wood Primer is quite good.

I had a strong feeling they would need to be sprayed, but was hoping to save that money for more green tools.    [smile]

I may try hand painting a couple of samples, just to see we can save the money and still achieve a good result.  But I'm not opposed to picking up a sprayer if it gives us a much better looking finish.  Any advice on brands/types of sprayers you have experience using?

EJ

I currently have a Graco TrueCoat Pro II Electric.  I don't think it's the best sprayer for the job on trim due to the fact that it moves a large quantity of material very quickly, even with reduced-size spray tips.  It gives a very high quality of finish, but too nuch, too quickly for small stuff.  This is a great sprayer for walls, doors and other larger objects, just not the best for furniture or small objects.  A good HVLP rig would be far better.  Even the Graco ProShot Fine Finish would be a good option. 

 

[Brice Burrell]

I had a strong feeling they would need to be sprayed, but was hoping to save that money for more green tools.    [smile]

I may try hand painting a couple of samples, just to see we can save the money and still achieve a good result.  But I'm not opposed to picking up a sprayer if it gives us a much better looking finish.  Any advice on brands/types of sprayers you have experience using?

EJ

Don't worry about spraying, hand painting will be just fine.  It isn't worth the time and money to learn how to run a sprayer for such small job.

I wouldn't sand until after the primer, unless you have some unusually rough pieces.  You'll only need to sand between coats of paint if you end up with some imperfections, runs or ugly brush marks.  I'd prime and put one finish coat on then install.  Then caulk, fill nail holes and the finish coat can go on.

As for the plinth blocks, check to see if the lumber yard you get the trim from has a plinth you like, if not you can make your own.  Not to take anything away from Bill's job but his plinth's are unusually tall and wide.  A more traditional look is for the plinth to be between 3/8" to 3/4" taller than the base and 1/4" to 1/2" wider than the casing.  I'd go about a 1/2" taller.   

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

A brush a good paint will look just fine.

I am not a fan of 99% of plinth blocks. 

I would not use them with those two mouldings.

 

[TulsaWood]

Thanks for the advice, guys.  I'm going to do some testing this weekend with hand brushing them. 

What paint / primer would you recommend for this job?  I've been searching and reading up on the myriad of choices, and there are so many different opinions out there.  I have a feeling I may just need to try a few different products until I find one we can work with.  I would welcome any advice on specific ones to either try or stay away from. 

EJ

 

[Billedis]

Thank you Willy and EJ.  I primed and then put two coats of Sherwin Williams High Gloss Pro Classic Plus paint.  I first cut all the moldings to size before priming and painting.  I used a brush for the painting as if you use floetrol to spray the paint, it takes some of the gloss out.

 

[GreenGA]

I know others have their own opinion, as do I...

We use a plinth block in all room trim-outs; for clients and in my own home.  They provide “support”, or the image of support, for the trim that borders a door.  Plus they provide a proper place into which your baseboard can terminate.  I have seen too many rooms where the end grain of “nice” (read… thick and meaty…) baseboard was visible where it met door trim.  [embarassed] It’s even more important if you also install quarter round or shoe molding against the baseboard.

Since you’re doing your formal dining room, are you going to install chair rail?  If you install chair rail, will you also install wainscoting or at least frames that imply wainscoting?  Are you going to install crown molding?  Are you going to replace the trim around the window(s) with the same casing as the doors; and you should…?  If so, you’ll probably need/want to replace the stool and maybe even the stool apron.  Don’t forget that the horns on the stool need to, or should, extend out past the edge of the new trim.  Depending on the stool overhang, you may need to go with the same material as the crown molding; so it does not look like the stool will “fall off”.

And since I’m “spending” your money,  [big grin] nothing makes a formal dining room stand out like a coffered ceiling.  Even in an 8’ ceilinged room, a coffered ceiling looks great.  [thumbs up]

When we trim out a room, we get the longest boards we can so as to eliminate, as much as possible, scarf joints in the middle; especially near a heat source/register. My supplier has an upcharge for sixteen footers, but not fourteen footers.  YMMV.  When we are forced to scarf, we try to use a domino, or at least a biscuit, for alignment as well as two pocket screws to keep everything together and tight.

I know some will argue it’s not necessary, but we paint all trim, front, back and ends, in two coats of primer and two coats of finish before we install the trim and then do touch-up once everything is installed.  We also rub on a thin coat of PVA glue on all fresh cuts before we “attach” one cut end to something; another cut end, say corners, or a scarf joint.  This thin coat of PVA glue gets sucked up by, and seals, the wood grain fibers so when we glue for real, the joint is not starved for glue; as it would be with only the one coat.

Again, right, wrong or indifferent, this is the way we do it.

Good luck!

 

[TulsaWood]

We use a plinth block in all room trim-outs; for clients and in my own home.  They provide “support”, or the image of support, for the trim that borders a door.  Plus they provide a proper place into which your baseboard can terminate.  I have seen too many rooms where the end grain of “nice” (read… thick and meaty…) baseboard was visible where it met door trim.  [embarassed] It’s even more important if you also install quarter round or shoe molding against the baseboard.

We're planning to keep it simple with clean lines.  We're not planning on using quarter round or plinth blocks, but I may play with some options when I go back to pick up the moldings. 

Since you’re doing your formal dining room, are you going to install chair rail?  If you install chair rail, will you also install wainscoting or at least frames that imply wainscoting?  Are you going to install crown molding?  Are you going to replace the trim around the window(s) with the same casing as the doors; and you should…?  If so, you’ll probably need/want to replace the stool and maybe even the stool apron.  Don’t forget that the horns on the stool need to, or should, extend out past the edge of the new trim.  Depending on the stool overhang, you may need to go with the same material as the crown molding; so it does not look like the stool will “fall off”.

We're going to install baseboards, casings and window trim now.  Crown will come next, after I get some practice in with some scrap pieces around a few corners.  Not planning on wainscoting, although I really like that look.  There is a possibility we may have a wall removed between the dining room and family room in a year or 2, so we'll have to wait and see how that ends up first.

You bring up a very good point about the window stool.  You can see in the picture below that the stool is not wide enough for the new trim pieces.  Would I remove that stool and widen the overhang? 
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And since I’m “spending” your money,  [big grin] nothing makes a formal dining room stand out like a coffered ceiling.  Even in an 8’ ceilinged room, a coffered ceiling looks great.  [thumbs up]

When we trim out a room, we get the longest boards we can so as to eliminate, as much as possible, scarf joints in the middle; especially near a heat source/register. My supplier has an upcharge for sixteen footers, but not fourteen footers.  YMMV.  When we are forced to scarf, we try to use a domino, or at least a biscuit, for alignment as well as two pocket screws to keep everything together and tight.

The coffered ceiling is a really nice look.  I'm gonna have to look into that.  It may be over the top for the style of this house, so I'll have to consult the Mrs. and get her thoughts.

Good call on the joints.  The shop has them in 8', 12' and 16' lengths, so I'll be sure to plan so I have minimal joints.  I'll have to play with joining the sections.  Before I've always just cut them on a 45, tacked them in place, then filled in any gaps before painting.  I may have a few new trick to learn during this job. [blink]

Thanks for all the great advice.  Again, would love to hear any specific recommendation on primers and paints to use.

EJ

 

[Tyler Ernsberger]

I am a trim carpenter in the south and we do not use plint blocks down here at all.  Personally not a fan off them.  You can prime all the trim before you install it.  After its installed fill all your nail holes and caulk.  Then your good to paint.  If you buy a good quality bush and some frog tape and you should be good.  Sherwin Williams makes awesome paint.  I normally get super paint.  My painters rarely spray the trim.  The only time they spray is in new homes. 

 

[Iceclimber]

You want a nice brushed finish try this stuff its amazing. I have been using it for years. Its crazy expensive and you have to use their primer and paint thinner but its sooo worth it. Google images of fine paints of Europe or the old name Shroder.

I do plinth blocks often but not with the scotia atop only a piece of oversized solid stock.

http://www.finepaintsofeurope.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=39