Should I get a Domino?

[MahalaHomecraft]

I make a lot of cabinets.  In particular I have a lot of cabinet work coming up over the course of the next couple months.  In addition, I'm building a custom bunk bed.  Typically I use pocket hole screws to assemble my cabinet boxes and face frames, and biscuits for making door panels that need to be wider than any stock I can readily purchase.  I use cope and stick joinery for the rails and stiles on the doors.

I found a great deal on an essentially new domino.  I'm pretty sure it's out of warranty, but based on the pictures I saw it looks like it's never even been used.  Let's assume for the moment that my assessment is correct.

I never really thought I'd buy a Domino, but the price tag on this one of $670 is pretty tempting.

So I guess what I'm really asking here is, for building cabinets, face frames, and cabinet doors, are the advantages of the Domino over my current joinery methods significant? 

I own and have owned several Festools, and am of the opinion that their products are not always worth it for me, but when they are worth it, they're really, really worth it.  As a few examples, I own a Makita track saw, and having used the Festool extensively I think it's worth the added cost.  I own an ETS 150 and I love it so much that I've decided my other Festool sanders, the ro90 and ets 125, aren't worth me keeping (I also have a fein multimaster which satisfies my delta sanding needs).  I have an OF1010 with an LR32 which i will never, in a million years, get rid of.  Even if not for how productive it is when drilling shelf pins, that thing is just so much fun to use.  I have a trion which i like a lot, but ultimately I don't think it's worth the cost over, for example, a cheaper Bosch.  The fact that changing the bevel on the Trion requires a tool just never sat right with me.  I have a c12, and again, I like it a lot, but I don't think it's worth the price tag for the types of things i do with a cordless drill.  I also had a centrotec installers set that i sold, which (and i know this isn't a popular opinion around here) I honestly think is just a big waste of money.  I love the stubby brad point bits and the countersink, but aside from that I think it's all too expensive for what it can actually achieve.  The vacuum is amazing.  I love systainers.  I just got the CT wings and man, what a great idea.

So, ye Domino-owning Festoolians, based on my opinions of my past and present Festool collection, and the scope of my work, and that killer price tag... what say you?

 

[Gary in Texas]

Well, you've been around long enough to know the majority, if not all, of the answers you will get to this question is......go for it!

The domino is very useful, can cut fabrication times significantly, it's just a sweet tool to use.

Just remember, you will need dominos and some cutters.  Best option for that is to get the prepackaged domino/bits in the systainer.  Very cost effective, gives you all the cutters for the Domino 500, and a good assortment of dominos.

 

[waho6o9]

Get it and if it's not up to your standards you can sell it

what you paid for it. 

A Domiplate is worth the investment as in makes the Domino
an effective carcass machine. You'll be making boxes quickly and
so accurately it'll make you wonder why you didn't get it sooner.

I appreciate your honest evaluations on Festools' products.

[attachthumb=1]

 

[ear3]

I'm not a professional cabinet builder, so I can't speak to all of the advantages of Domino vs. pocket holing or biscuit joining.  But two operations in particular I've loved having the Domino for over other options.  The first is for fixed cabinet shelves.  They are much stronger with the Domino than a biscuit.  And alignment of the mortises is a snap with the edge dogs on the Domino face.  The other operation is when the sides of the cabinet will be exposed, and so you do a miter joint rather than a butt joint.  I always had problems with the biscuit joiner getting the miters to align well, not to mention holding the joint firm during glue up.  With the design of the Domino, I know I'm plunging at the proper angle, and once the joint is fitted it holds well for clamping and gluing.

 

[jacko9]

Buy it before somebody else get's there first.

 

[Sparktrician]

Unless you know the seller very well and trust him, I'd suggest that you get the serial number and run it by Shane (sho@festoolusa.com) to see if it's on the "hot" list before springing the $$$. 

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

spark - what's that all about?  Is there an actual list of stolen festool serial numbers somewhere?

 

[sancho57]

I think there is.
But to come to a sight with a bunch of festool junkies and ask should you buy one and expect a unbiased answer hehehehehe

Only thing I can honestly tell you is about what happened to me, I was taking this festool end users class annd we all were at dinner with Stevie B. I was going off about how I couldnt see the advantages of owning a domino, it wouldnt fit my needs, other tools like the kreg jjig etc that does the same thing on and on so the following day we used the domino heavily...
2 days later I was tthe proud owner of a Domino 500 kit and the systainer with the dominos kit to.
I told Steve about that and he laughed loudly....with a I told you so look.
So with that being said yea you should get one.

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

jobsworth - only coming here so people can tell me to buy things that I want to buy anyway is a good enough reason to come here for me!

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

Also:  Does anybody have any input on that bunk bed project?  Each of the trays is gonna be made of poplar 2x4 frames.  would dominos be  good substitute for true M&T on the ends?  Maybe 2 or 3 in each 2x end?

 

[Sparktrician]

spark - what's that all about?  Is there an actual list of stolen festool serial numbers somewhere?

Yes.  Festool maintains a registry of known-stolen Festool tool serial numbers.  You (we) can't see the whole list, but if you send the S/N of the tool in question to Shane, he can look it up to see if it has ever been reported stolen.  In other words, watch your butt when buying used Festool goodies. 

 

[PA floor guy]

I too went through this same question in my mind.  I finally did get a domino, there is nothing like it.  I have found so many ways to use this very awesome tool.  Even on flooring installs, I never thought I would need a domino, but now I'm finding great ways to use it for my profession on top of the million uses it already has.

 

[Iceclimber]

I know what Domino you are looking at. Its on CL in New haven. I thought about buying a few of those tools but something seems weird/suspicious. I have watched the tool appear then disappear. Tool be added then taken away then added then taken away. Dialoged via email with the seller and i cant remember what as it was weeks ago but he told me something in that conversation that seemed fishy the next day or days after when his listings changed...

I would want that stolen cereal number list before i purchased those tools...

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

I know what Domino you are looking at. Its on CL in New haven. I thought about buying a few of those tools but something seems weird/suspicious. I have watched the tool appear then disappear. Tool be added then taken away then added then taken away. Dialoged via email with the seller and i cant remember what as it was weeks ago but he told me something in that conversation that seemed fishy the next day or days after when his listings changed...

I would want that stolen cereal number list before i purchased those tools...

Well that sucks.  I use CL a lot, always make sure I go prepared for anything.  It's a good long drive for me so hopefully this doesn't blow up in my face.  I'm heading there tomorrow at like 11.  If you guys don't hear from me by 2 CALL THE POLICE!!!

 

[Scorpion]

A domino is worth full retail for cabinet making and it saves a ton of time. I just finished the assembly of 4 bases and 5 uppers for a study and it made the process more like dominos than the assembly I'm used to. No dadoes this time, less guess work, and once I figured out my measurements everything was so repeatable that I was able to do all the machine work first and assembly last. 

Complex printer cabinet -

Fave frames were easier too. I'm way impressed and originally was very sticker shocked.  I strongly recommend.

 

[Iceclimber]

Im not saying i have this right. Just saying...

 

[wow]

Sorry, this gonna be long.

I assume you're taking CA$H? Then DON'T GO ALONE!

EVER!

I've done dozens (hundreds?) of safe Craigslist transactions, with one this last weekend involving $3500 cash. While things can always go wrong, there are some things you can do to protect yourself.

These kinds of deals are often set up to rob you, since they KNOW you will have a specific amount of cash on you. And there will almost always be more than one of them. If there are more than two of them when you show up, LEAVE - these people may want to do more than rob you. We've all heard stories of people being shot for a pair of tennis shoes. Don't be that person.

From my time doing entertainer security and working with *many* LEO's I'm going to offer some tactical suggestions for the 'Worst Case Scenario' - some obvious, some not:

Before you meet:

1. Ask them (by email, text, or over the phone) for the serial number so that you can "check it against the stolen tools database". My experience is 100% that if they provide the serial number it's a legit deal. And it weeds out maybe 98% of the bad guys. No guarantees, you understand - but it's the single best thing you can do to make sure you're not wasting your time, or - worse yet - risking your life! If they provide a serial number - YOU WIN!

2. Tell them you want to meet in a public place. I like to meet in the parking lot of the local police station or city hall. It's a HUGE psychological deterrent to bad guys, and 'normal' people never give it a second thought. If that won't work, pick another well-lighted place that has LOTS of security cameras. Like right in front of a jewelry store or bank. Visibility is their enemy. It may be intimidating and they may not show (or leave quickly) in which case - YOU WIN!

3. Also explain to them that you want to see the item, and if you like it you will go get the money and come back within 15 minutes. If it's a large enough sum - like it might be for a Domino - tell them that you will have to go to a 'couple' of banks to get that amount of cash, and that's why it will take that amount of time. If they're legit, they'll understand and that won't be a problem. If they're bad guys, you've just moved off their 'easy pickin' list and the meet won't happen. The important thing is that they believe you won't have the cash on you, so typically with the bad guys the deal dies right there. YOU WIN!

When you meet:

4. Have your friend/partner/spouse drive - even if only the last couple of blocks. Think 'getaway' vehicle. Your partner stays in the vehicle with it running and you leave your door open. If you have to dive back in and leave - YOU WIN!

5. Take a picture of them (and their vehicle, if you can) before you get out of the car. It's even better if they see you do it. Send it to yourself or a friend before you get out of the vehicle, since they WILL make a grab for your phone if they are bad guys. If you get their picture AND they know it AND they are up to no good, they will usually just run. YOU WIN!

6. Split the cash between you and your partner. If you are robbed and they run away, they don't get it all and - YOU WIN!

7. If you start to not like their body language, attitude, or demeanor - LEAVE. You might have a pre-arranged signal that you can use to notify your partner - like removing your hat, running your hand through your hair, pulling out your phone (not a great idea unless it's a clunker!) or similar move. If you do that, your partner should honk the horn, and you either excuse yourself politely to 'see what they want' (if that seems the prudent route) or you RUN LIKE HECK to the vehicle and dive in while your partner drives away like a crazy person. Call the cops if you still feel threatened, but DON'T STOP DRIVING.  If you make a quick and clean getaway - YOU WIN!

8. You and your friend/partner/spouse should NEVER be close to each other during the transaction. If you want your partner to get out of the vehicle to hear the transaction, they should try to act 'disinterested' and should stay on the opposite side of the car from you. Or there should be another object between you and them (like a bench or a large planter). Or they should stay around 20 feet away. I was taught that a 'bad guy' can cover 21 feet in under 2 seconds - far too fast for most people to react. Also, if you're standing side-by-side you unfortunately make easy targets. The further apart you are, the less likely you are to become victims. Unless they are Pro's or desperate, they'll move on to easier targets.

After the deal happens:

9. If you're both out of the vehicle, leave the area one at a time, so you NEVER both have your backs to them. This is where a lot of people lose their cash AND the item they thought they just bought.

10. DON'T go straight home. Drive around, stop for coffee/soda whatever - of course always stop at a well-lighted area that preferably has a lot of cameras.

Employ as many or as few of these idea as you wish. I realize that this sounds a little (or a lot) like paranoia, but there's an old saying that goes

"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you!"

Be safe!

 

[sancho57]

Always meet in a very public place, with lots of people around, and get the s/n and have it checked before you go.

I wonder if someone somewhere isnt making cheap Chinese knockofffs of festools ?
Its just a thought, they make knock offs for everything else so why not festools.

But it is a pretty bad state of affairs when ya cant trust people to the point of  being in fear  of being robbed, cheated or worse (social commenttary).
I do hope everything works out for the good and everything is on the up and up .
I thave bought some used festools in the past off of CL. with no issues

 

[Stone Message]

I am not familiar with US prices but isn't $670 a little steep if it is out of warranty?

Peter

 

[Sparktrician]

I am not familiar with US prices but isn't $670 a little steep if it is out of warranty?

Peter

The Domino goes for $850 new (US).  79% of list new price should be a warning in and of itself for a tool that is out of warranty.  I'm 100% with WOW's comments above.  I rarely deal with Craig's List, but on that rare occasion that I do, I go with a friend and both of us are packing (legally).