six-point socket's tidbits of Home Improvement, small projects and other stuff.

[six-point socket II]

There are problems with the host I use to share my pictures. Sorry. I re-uploaded them, directly to the forum now.

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Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[RKA]

The first set of pics showed up fine for me Oliver (and still do). 

 

[six-point socket II]

Yeah, Thanks Raj! Looks like the host fixed that security certificate issue.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[six-point socket II]

Hi!

Wow, it's been a month since I last posted here.

Let's start with the water damage issue, it's still pending.  [crying] [eek] [blink] [scared] [scared] [big grin]

Then, I had a Dr.'s appointment a couple of days after my last post here, which led to a second, which led to ... The good news is I'm getting treatment & medication and the diagnosis explains quite a few of my past issues as well as current. I got quite the warning to put it mildly, not unexpectedly and because of my own faults I might add.

For the past few weeks I'm getting new compression bandages twice a week, and this will continue for some time until my legs have healed, then it will be compression stockings. I'm walking quite a lot as this helps with the healing process and limit my time sitting at the computer.

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I got around to get some rather trivial stuff done. I finally replaced all of the window handles.

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And then a family member asked me to torque the wheel bolts of her French kangaroo after she had the tires changed at a garage. (Not sure how this is done in the US, but when you have a garage change your tires here, for liability reasons they put a line on the invoice that you have to re-check/re-tighten the bolts after the first 50km.) So I did her the favor of checking them real quick. Obviously not one was loose or less than the 110 Nm required. I guess we all know how it's done at those shops anyway.  [scared] [eek] [big grin] ... But any day I can get the TechAngle out, is a good day for me.

So at least some tool content from me, for now that's all.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[RKA]

Glad you're on the mend!

Question, are the shops in Germany even a little more diligent about hand torque-ing lug nuts/bolts?  I take it from your comment they are not, which would be a little surprising given how much stricter they are about vehicle inspections than here in the US (this is a pet peeve of mine because it causes other costly damage which shops never take ownership of). 

 

[six-point socket II]

Hi Raj,

Some certainly do.

Speaking of stricter inspections, I've not encountered a technician/inspector tearing down hubcaps and looking at the wheel bolts on cars like this with steel rims. Obviously they look behind the wheel and from beneath, I don't know if they could find/determine a problem with a single wheel bolt during those inspections. Different story if there's visible damage or if they're locating a problem.

I'd say right now, at the peak of tire change season, and especially at the tire shops/ tire exchange places there is not much, mostly no, hand torque-ing. They just rattle away and over torque. Not necessarily up to the point of damage/ probable damage, but way beyond specification. They think they "feel it". And obviously don't want to spend the extra time ... It's sad. Time is money when they have to meet certain numbers to break even/make profit on their town's cheapest tire change flat rate offer ...

To me, the first issue coming to mind is that even if you know how to change a tire, at a certain point you're not going to get the bolts off with on-board tools. Especially when they are not only over torqued but it's a couple of months into the season, snow/water, salt ... There is no way you get those bolts off without real tools.

And then, obviously at some point it's damaging and all the way up to a real safety issue.

Coming back to that Kangoo, I'm pretty sure - although I can't measure it - these bolts have been tightened to 150 Nm at least.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[Peter_C]

Hope you continue to heal quickly!

Any shop worth their price is using "Torque Sticks" at the least, if not hand torquing wheel lugs. Especially with aluminum and magnesium wheels. Torque sticks still need to have the impact gun used dialed in by testing with a hand torque wrench until the desired spec is achieved. My Snap-on pneumatic impact is super powerful, but also offers a way to feel the torque, and works excellent with torque sticks. My cordless Milwaukee impact is reasonably powerful, but I can't feel what it is at, and I haven't tried it with torque sticks. It was purchased for doing construction. Mostly because it failed to break loose the axle nut on my Audi that my pneumatic cut free immediately, for changing an outer CV boot.

Over tightening lug nuts is a major cause of warped brake rotors.

You have more tools to buy Oliver You don't need the entire set though, just a few. Or continue to use the awesome torque wrench you already own.

 

[semenza]

Most places I have been for tires just blast them on with an impact until it doesn't turn anymore.  [eek] I don't think I have ever seen anyone checking the torque. Wrong, of course but that is what I have encountered.

Seth

 

[Svar]

Most places I have been for tires just blast them on with an impact until it doesn't turn anymore.

Yes, but don't the impacts they use have torque setting?

 

[dltflt]

Advertisement.

Hi!

Sadly our local market for agricultural products (tools, chemicals, animal stuff, lifestyle products ... not a farmers market) is closing it's doors in a week or two and they're having a sale right now. So I went there yesterday to pick up some stuff. When I came across a shelve of Peugeot Saveurs Moulins (mills) I couldn't resist the discount and bought two more. I love these, and now we have an additional set to use by the BBQ.

That is a good looking knife.  Knives are one of my other addictions.

The night came and I relaxed with a cigar on the patio. Over the course of the day the 2nd party string light had arrived.

Then came today. A couple of hours ago, my better half said to me: "Honey, can you please exchange the broken light assembly/bulb in the basement storage room?" My reply was: "Yes, sweetheart." And downstairs I went.

Switched of the lights, waited a minute or two and got the broken light assembly/bulb out. When I touched the cable it felt still quite hot not just warm.

Of course I didn't have a new light assembly/bulb, when I looked for it - so I had to hurry a little to get to "home depot" in time, to get some new light assemblies/bulbs, before they close.

Back home I took some temperature measurements. ( ° C )

Lights switched on, no bulb in the one that was broken.

Lights switched on, taking temperature measurements on one that wasn't broken.

Lights switched on, new light assembly/bulb inserted.

Verifying results.

Not quite sure what to make of this yet. All of the cables stay at or around 30° C only the first one gets easily over 60° C over the same amount of time. Not normal.

It's not really a super high risk right now, the light assemblies/ bulbs heat up to 110° C but I'd like to find out what's up with that one cable. (They are all the same and were scope of supply.)

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[semenza]

Most places I have been for tires just blast them on with an impact until it doesn't turn anymore.

Yes, but don't the impacts they use have torque setting?

Yeah, that certainly could be, I really don't know. Actually seems like they must just for liability etc.  [scratch chin]

Seth

 

[Svar]

Most places I have been for tires just blast them on with an impact until it doesn't turn anymore.

Yes, but don't the impacts they use have torque setting?

Yeah, that certainly could be, I really don't know. Actually seems like they must just for liability etc.  [scratch chin]
Seth

When I do it myself I simply gently step on the wrench. I get very consistent and accurate torque  [big grin], but it increases with age.  [sad]

 

[RKA]

The air guns do have a setting, but think of it as high, medium, low.  Techs leave them on high.  Further, the shop air pressure will often be higher than 90 to give the air tools a little extra kick.  But none of this ensures that the bolts or nuts are torqued to spec and consistently (which is what warps the brake rotors).  They need to torque them by hand.  Every time I’ve seen a torque stick in use, it wasn’t being used correctly, the techs just assume it magically works and if someone calls them out, they justify their actions by pointing to the torque stick.

 

[Peter_C]

Fixed it for you!

The air guns do have a setting, but think of it as high, medium high, medium, medium low, and low.  Techs Grease monkeys [tongue] leave them on high.  Further, the shop air pressure will often be higher than 90 to give the air tools a little extra kick.  But none of this ensures that the bolts or nuts are torqued to spec and consistently (which is what warps the brake rotors).  They need to torque them by hand. Every time I’ve seen a torque stick in use, it wasn’t being used correctly, the techs grease monkeys  just assume it magically works and if someone calls them out, they justify their actions by pointing to the torque stick.

Agreed, no one runs their shop at air 90 psi. Always has a minimum of 100 psi with a max shut off of 125 psi roughly, or at least what I have experienced and set up.

Torque sticks when used properly are the fastest best option, but yes you do need to seat the nuts/bolts gently and work up to the proper torque. At $160+ an hour, time is money and hand torquing would cost the shop $7.00 minimum per vehicle.

 

[Cheese]

I use an old Snap-on torque extension that’s rated at the 80 ft/lbs rate and it’s used judiciously to maintain a uniform torque application. The rating is around 10-20% under the ultimate torque level I want to achieve. So I then bring out the old torque wrench to bring the final torque level into proper compliance. That’s worked well.  [big grin]  Finally an end to warped rotors.

 

[six-point socket II]

Hope you continue to heal quickly!

Any shop worth their price is using "Torque Sticks" at the least, if not hand torquing wheel lugs. Especially with aluminum and magnesium wheels. Torque sticks still need to have the impact gun used dialed in by testing with a hand torque wrench until the desired spec is achieved. My Snap-on pneumatic impact is super powerful, but also offers a way to feel the torque, and works excellent with torque sticks. My cordless Milwaukee impact is reasonably powerful, but I can't feel what it is at, and I haven't tried it with torque sticks. It was purchased for doing construction. Mostly because it failed to break loose the axle nut on my Audi that my pneumatic cut free immediately, for changing an outer CV boot.

Over tightening lug nuts is a major cause of warped brake rotors.

You have more tools to buy Oliver You don't need the entire set though, just a few. Or continue to use the awesome torque wrench you already own.

Thanks Peter, and my Snappy owes you at least a beer now.  [big grin]

I knew these existed, but I have never seen them in use over here. And to the best of my knowledge, German "go to" tool brands for automotive mechanics like Gedore, Hazet, Facom, Stahlwille, KS Tools don't even offer something like it/ similar to it.

I only ever saw them in Snap-On's catalog. And I just re-checked with my most recent Gedore and Hazet catalogs - no torque sticks.

Very interesting. Thank you for bringing them up!

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[six-point socket II]

Advertisement.

Hi!

Sadly our local market for agricultural products (tools, chemicals, animal stuff, lifestyle products ... not a farmers market) is closing it's doors in a week or two and they're having a sale right now. So I went there yesterday to pick up some stuff. When I came across a shelve of Peugeot Saveurs Moulins (mills) I couldn't resist the discount and bought two more. I love these, and now we have an additional set to use by the BBQ.

That is a good looking knife.  Knives are one of my other addictions.

(...)

Kind regards,
Oliver

Thank you Don, it is/was my first custom knife I got over a decade ago. It's a forged damascus, blade has 3 layers (san mai technique), bolsters are mammoth ivory and the handle is brown mallee. That eyelet is again made from mammoth ivory. It's a great little fixed blade, I carried and used it for quite some time, and "re-discovered" it, now carrying it again.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[Michael Kellough]

How does a torque stick work?

I have a back wheel (rotor?) that squeaks a little (more when turning), maybe I could just check and correct the nut torque?

 

[RKA]

The torque stick is designed to twist at a specific torque setting.  That twist negates the beats from the impact gun effectively stopping you from tightening the bolt further.

Your squeak is not likely related to the wheels and rotors or nuts.  Your suspension would be my first guess, particularly if you have had previous work done back there or part of it needed to be removed for a brake job.  Many of those bolts should be torqued to spec at ride height not while the suspension is at full droop on a lift.  That takes extra time and some techs don’t want to be bothered.  Also, if you have a truck there may be grease fittings back there, make sure they are regularly topped off with grease (I don’t own a truck so that’s outside my wheelhouse).  There is less than a 50% chance I’m right, diagnosing things on the Internet is sketchy, but that would be the most likely suspect based on your description. 

Sorry Oliver, I took your thread down the path of auto repair.  Can you break out a Festool drill and put a hole in some concrete to get us back on track?  [smile]

 

[six-point socket II]

(...)

Sorry Oliver, I took your thread down the path of auto repair.  Can you break out a Festool drill and put a hole in some concrete to get us back on track?  [smile]

No need to, Raj. I'm loving the discussion and valuable input & thoughts everyone is sharing!

Kind regards,
Oliver