six-point socket's tidbits of Home Improvement, small projects and other stuff.

[Jiggy Joiner]

Oliver, you must have real good taste, Farrow & Ball is the choice for the majority of my upmarket clients.
There is a Farrow & Ball showroom a few minutes drive from me. I never realised that with some extra thought, how much more beautiful, paint and wallpaper could be made to look.

They certainly know their stuff  [thumbs up]

 

[bertv]

I got around to do some "quick and dirty" testing today. I will do a second round with a coat/layer of primer in between and see if that makes a difference. But ultimately we're pretty much set on the "Breakfast Room Green" - We will let this dry over night and see what it looks like tomorrow.

It is my experience that the colour of the primer should be as close to the top coat’s. It will help get even coverage, which considering the price of F&B paints is going to save you serious dineros.

 

[six-point socket II]

Jiggy, Bert, Thank you very much!

Bert, can I send you a PM regarding a question or two I have about the whole primer thing?

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[six-point socket II]

Advertisement (Because of visible Klein Tools, you guys now the drill by now ... )

As promised some Festool/wood content.

I started this project by removing all hardware - I used my CXS with the brand new 50 mm Centrotec bits DB CE 50/12-Set 1 to remove the 10 PZ2 screws. The 3 mm t-handle hex wrench is needed to remove the handles first.

Why is the restoration necessary you might ask? Because I messed up. Back when those doors where installed, I asked the carpenter who put them in for some advice on how to treat this door as it is the door of the master bathroom with quite a bit of humidity after showering/bathing - his answer was to use iron/steel wool  first and than use a coating. (I don’t remember what it was exactly) I did that, but I didn’t think of, or even knew, about all those little pieces of iron that would remain stuck in the rather soft wood of this massive door. After wiping the door with a tack cloth, it seemed to be OK. So I applied the coating. Only a year later all those little pieces of iron wool would stain/ turn black from the humidity (i.e. rust …) and I wasn’t exactly happy about it. But like with so many thing, there was always something more important to do … Today I finally took care of it.

No project without a little fun.  [eek] [scared] [blink] [big grin] [big grin] [big grin] [wink]

Sanding with my trusty DTS 400 and GranatNet abrasives, as almost always, my CTL SYS does the vacuuming.

The panels required quite a bit of hand sanding. I really like to use the Festool Granat sponge abrasives to do this. A lot can be done with the simple rectangular ones, but to get almost everywhere the shaped sponges are even better. As I have said in the past, these are highly, highly recommended!

Next came sanding the molding on the frames. I found a product for this I wanted to try, it’s from Bosch Professional (probably SIA) and works really well for odd shapes/ molding as you can see in the pictures. It’s called: S473 Best for Contours sanding pad and comes, color coded, in 3 grits. It made sanding the molding a breeze! Highly recommended!

After sanding I vacuumed the door with the CTL SYS and one of the included nozzles. After that, I wiped the doors down with a slightly damp tack cloth. There’s still a bit of the iron wool left, but its much, much better than before.

Next I applied Clou water based Holzlack (wood lacquer).

After finishing both sides and letting them dry, I re-installed all the hardware. Again I used my CXS with the brand new 50 mm #Centrotec bits DB CE 50/12-Set 1 for the 10 PZ2 screws, and the t-handle hex wrench to install the handles.

Finished door back installed.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[RKA]

Looks great Oliver!  Too bad about that poor guidance.  All that hand sanding made my hands hurts! 

 

[ScotF]

Awesome door restoration, Oliver! Great pics and explanation!!

 

[Cheese]

It is my experience that the colour of the primer should be as close to the top coat’s. It will help get even coverage, which considering the price of F&B paints is going to save you serious dineros.

I agree with Bert...I've pretty much standardized on Sherwin-Williams paints and always have the primer tinted to 75% of the top coat color. There's just enough difference noticeable between the primer and the top coat which makes it easier to see when you're painting and it also reduces the number of top coats needed for complete coverage.

 

[nclemmons]

Great restoration on that door.  Your photos always pop so well, Oliver.  I can imagine you spend as much time on the photos as you do on the projects!

Thanks for keeping us engaged with your projects!

 

[grobkuschelig]

Great project with nice images, as always, Oliver!

FYI: Festool also does these „flexible“ sponges in Granat.

 

[Bob D.]

Nice job refinishing the door, and great photography too.

Oliver, I noticed a rabbit which appear to be all around the edge of the door, is this
normal for interior doors where you live or is it just because it's a bathroom door?

Those sponge sanding pads saved the day. I was thinking at the beginning of the post
before you explained how you used the sanding sponges how I would tackle the
molded parts and was thinking is it possible to make a matching profile to the molding
then cover it with whatever grit paper you needed. I've known the sponges exist, but
was thinking about how it might be possible to make a pad for a sander with a linear
action to be able to work this area of the door. One door maybe not worth the effort
but if you had a house full of doors it would pay off.

Might be something like a kit that lets you cast in place to match the profile then fix
that to your sander (using Velcro, fast-fix, etc.) and use some self-stick paper in the
required grit.

 

[Jiggy Joiner]

Great job on the door, it looks brand new!  [thumbs up]

 

[six-point socket II]

Looks great Oliver!  Too bad about that poor guidance.  All that hand sanding made my hands hurts!

Thank you very much Raj! I guess I should have asked if there was more to it ... Maybe he thought I knew how to properly clean the door after ... I'm just happy it is only one door that I did it to.

Awesome door restoration, Oliver! Great pics and explanation!!

Thank you very much, Scot!

It is my experience that the colour of the primer should be as close to the top coat’s. It will help get even coverage, which considering the price of F&B paints is going to save you serious dineros.

I agree with Bert...I've pretty much standardized on Sherwin-Williams paints and always have the primer tinted to 75% of the top coat color. There's just enough difference noticeable between the primer and the top coat which makes it easier to see when you're painting and it also reduces the number of top coats needed for complete coverage.

Thank you very much, Cheese! Might be stupid to ask, but: They use the same Sherwin-Williams pigments to tint the primer, I guess?

Great restoration on that door.  Your photos always pop so well, Oliver.  I can imagine you spend as much time on the photos as you do on the projects!

Thanks for keeping us engaged with your projects!

Thank you very much, Neil! To be honest, I have my routine of settings and filters by now. And I do it all - except the selection process - on my phone.

So I look at them on the big screen, delete everything I don't need/want. Then I crop if needed/wanted, then settings and filters.

The most time consuming aspect is really taking the "in between" pictures. Stop working, clean hands, unlock phone, wipe over lens, take pictures. And a little more time consuming when I have to use a tripod/ phone holder. But I enjoy it, and I enjoy the pictures - being able to archive my work and steps taken to completion. On a easy/lazy day like yesterday anyways, just one thing to do and more than enough time for it.

Great project with nice images, as always, Oliver!

FYI: Festool also does these „flexible“ sponges in Granat.

Thank you very much, Uli! Festool should have called them Contour sanding pads  [scared] [eek] [big grin] I actually have them ...  [eek] [scared] [eek] [blink]

Nice job refinishing the door, and great photography too.

Oliver, I noticed a rabbit which appear to be all around the edge of the door, is this
normal for interior doors where you live or is it just because it's a bathroom door?

Those sponge sanding pads saved the day. I was thinking at the beginning of the post
before you explained how you used the sanding sponges how I would tackle the
molded parts and was thinking is it possible to make a matching profile to the molding
then cover it with whatever grit paper you needed. I've known the sponges exist, but
was thinking about how it might be possible to make a pad for a sander with a linear
action to be able to work this area of the door. One door maybe not worth the effort
but if you had a house full of doors it would pay off.

Might be something like a kit that lets you cast in place to match the profile then fix
that to your sander (using Velcro, fast-fix, etc.) and use some self-stick paper in the
required grit.

Thank you very much Bob!

All of our doors are rebated, I'd dare to say it's the most commonly used pattern here. Not saying you won't find flush mounted ones in larger quantities if you look for them.

I think I'd be reluctant to use a machine on those molded parts - even if there was one available. I think the molding would lose it's "sharpness" too quickly. But since I don't have the Duplex, I don't know for sure how it would work on such delicate areas.

All the doors here are the same, except for the basement. But those will (now) be switched too, with the other upcoming project.

I think one could experiment with such custom molded sanding pads, however to match the profile when abrasive and maybe a 2nd layer go on top might be quite the challenge. But I love the idea of a kit to mold your own sanding pads on site. Sounds like a game changer if one could make it work. Really, it's a great idea! I would buy something like this!

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[six-point socket II]

Great job on the door, it looks brand new!  [thumbs up]

Thank you very much, Jiggy!

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[Cheese]

Thank you very much, Cheese! Might be stupid to ask, but: They use the same Sherwin-Williams pigments to tint the primer, I guess?

Yes Oliver they use the same color match system and pigments, they just tint it a tad lighter than the top coat. Also, FWIW...every SW primer tints a little differently because the base is a little different.

Nice job on the door it came out well.  [big grin]

Funny thing about the steel wool recommendation, it's been a popular final step for years & years. I can remember my grandfather using #0000 steel wool for the final finishing step 60 years ago. I think the difference is, it was most popular when solid color, oil-based topcoats were the norm. I think the oil-base paint provided better protection from humidity while the solid color hid any issues that developed over time. However it became a different ballgame with the arrival of water-based clear coats.

On a related but different note, that's the reason you keep tools for working stainless separate from other tools. Any sanding sponges, sanding sheets, grinding wheels, files that have been used on steel should NEVER be used on stainless because they will transfer iron oxide to the stainless and it will rust, as you found out the hardway.  [sad]

Those Bosch S473 sponges look pretty slick. Did they "smear" the profile at all or is it still sharp? I have a LS 130 but have found that the sandpaper is too thick and doesn't conform to small profiles well so it tends to smear the form. It's probably also a function that it's being motor driven. Sometimes less = more.

I checked and those S473 sponges are NAINA. They are available however from Amazon UK. 

 

[six-point socket II]

Hi Cheese,

Thank you! I will ask my F&B dealer to tint the primer then, I guess they should be able to.

Do you remember what your Grandfather used to clean the surfaces after using steel wool. And yeah, 0000 it was - that I remember. And I think you're right on the type of paints/coats making a difference, too!

Yes, that is a must. I keep my stainless bit set sealed in a zip lock, as well as a couple of screwdrivers.

The sanding pads did not exactly smear the profile, but it's less sharp than on the other doors. You won't notice it while looking at it, but you can feel it, slightly.

Don't hunt for the S473 if you can get your hands on the Festool Granat sponges, I went looking for my after Uli mentioned them, and they are probably exactly the same ... except for the abrasive itself? I would love to know if Festools sponges are made in the UK, if they are - the Bosch are as well. I wouldn't be surprised if there is only one real manufacturer for these sponges and the only difference is the quality of abrasive and bonding.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[HarveyWildes]

Oliver, that door was a real labor of love.  Nice work!

I also like the idea of a kit for molding to a profile.  I've tried machining wood pieces, but that takes a lot of time and, like Cheese, I've also had problems with sandpaper that is just too stiff to wrap - and sometimes the thickness changes the profile

For a while in the 2000's my company used a packing system where we put instruments in a plastic bag in a box and then sprayed foam in the box to provide the needed protection against drops.  It was kind of cool to watch.  Seems like something like that could work for creating sanding profiles if you could figure out how to get the grit on the surface.  I wonder if any of the home insulation foams are stiff and durable enough to work?  I'm brainstorming here, but what about putting a velcro-compatible piece of cloth against a molding, spraying the foam against that, and then fitting some sanding mesh to the cloth?

 

[Bob D.]

Oliver, that door was a real labor of love.  Nice work!

I also like the idea of a kit for molding to a profile.  I've tried machining wood pieces, but that takes a lot of time and, like Cheese, I've also had problems with sandpaper that is just too stiff to wrap - and sometimes the thickness changes the profile

For a while in the 2000's my company used a packing system where we put instruments in a plastic bag in a box and then sprayed foam in the box to provide the needed protection against drops.  It was kind of cool to watch.  Seems like something like that could work for creating sanding profiles if you could figure out how to get the grit on the surface.  I wonder if any of the home insulation foams are stiff and durable enough to work?  I'm brainstorming here, but what about putting a velcro-compatible piece of cloth against a molding, spraying the foam against that, and then fitting some sanding mesh to the cloth?

That's sort of what I was thinking of Harvey. I can remember unboxing Rosemount transmitters  with packaging like that you describe. I believe lots of companies use it. I wonder if the expanding foam in a can like Great Stuff would work. You'd have to build a small box to contain it and cover the surface to be duplicated with plastic. Maybe use a weak spray adhesive to hold the plastic sheet tight to the profile to be duplicated, and work the plastic film tight into the crevices with a stiff brush, then pour and let it set up. Anyway, this is taking Oliver's thread WOT, and should be discussed elsewhere if it has any real potential. Sorry Oliver, back to our regularly scheduled program.

 

[Michael Kellough]

[member=61712]six-point socket II[/member] It’s always good to check out your thread. Please keep it up.

Steel wool is perfectly fine as long as the finish is oil based. When it’s water based you have to use synthetic wool (Scotch Bright) or try to find bronze wool.

[member=61231]HarveyWildes[/member] This is what you’re inventing.

 

[Tinker]

That's sort of what I was thinking of Harvey. I can remember unboxing Rosemount transmitters  with packaging like that you describe. I believe lots of companies use it. I wonder if the expanding foam in a can like Great Stuff would work. You'd have to build a small box to contain it and cover the surface to be duplicated with plastic. Maybe use a weak spray adhesive to hold the plastic sheet tight to the profile to be duplicated, and work the plastic film tight into the crevices with a stiff brush, then pour and let it set up. Anyway, this is taking Oliver's thread WOT, and should be discussed elsewhere if it has any real potential. Sorry Oliver, back to our regularly scheduled program.
[/quote]

I think this molding discussion is OT. Oliver points out in his original naming of the topic, "...and other stuff." This entire thread has been an ongoing education. Oliver has been a light for a lot of subjects. Those who have replied have also come up with great questions, and the replies/answers have been very enlightening. Every time this thread pops up in my Replies list, my curiosity gets the better of me. I just have to investigate.
Tinker

 

[six-point socket II]

Oliver, that door was a real labor of love.  Nice work!

Thank you very much, Harvey!

Oliver, that door was a real labor of love.  Nice work!

I also like the idea of a kit for molding to a profile.  I've tried machining wood pieces, but that takes a lot of time and, like Cheese, I've also had problems with sandpaper that is just too stiff to wrap - and sometimes the thickness changes the profile

For a while in the 2000's my company used a packing system where we put instruments in a plastic bag in a box and then sprayed foam in the box to provide the needed protection against drops.  It was kind of cool to watch.  Seems like something like that could work for creating sanding profiles if you could figure out how to get the grit on the surface.  I wonder if any of the home insulation foams are stiff and durable enough to work?  I'm brainstorming here, but what about putting a velcro-compatible piece of cloth against a molding, spraying the foam against that, and then fitting some sanding mesh to the cloth?

That's sort of what I was thinking of Harvey. I can remember unboxing Rosemount transmitters  with packaging like that you describe. I believe lots of companies use it. I wonder if the expanding foam in a can like Great Stuff would work. You'd have to build a small box to contain it and cover the surface to be duplicated with plastic. Maybe use a weak spray adhesive to hold the plastic sheet tight to the profile to be duplicated, and work the plastic film tight into the crevices with a stiff brush, then pour and let it set up. Anyway, this is taking Oliver's thread WOT, and should be discussed elsewhere if it has any real potential. Sorry Oliver, back to our regularly scheduled program.

No problem, Bob! I love the discussions and idea sharing evolving from this, and other, threads!

[member=61712]six-point socket II[/member] It’s always good to check out your thread. Please keep it up.

Steel wool is perfectly fine as long as the finish is oil based. When it’s water based you have to use synthetic wool (Scotch Bright) or try to find bronze wool.

[member=61231]HarveyWildes[/member] This is what you’re inventing.

Thank you very much, Michael! That's a great find, I didn't even know it existed. Don't think I ever saw that in real life on the shelf or in the catalog.

That's sort of what I was thinking of Harvey. I can remember unboxing Rosemount transmitters  with packaging like that you describe. I believe lots of companies use it. I wonder if the expanding foam in a can like Great Stuff would work. You'd have to build a small box to contain it and cover the surface to be duplicated with plastic. Maybe use a weak spray adhesive to hold the plastic sheet tight to the profile to be duplicated, and work the plastic film tight into the crevices with a stiff brush, then pour and let it set up. Anyway, this is taking Oliver's thread WOT, and should be discussed elsewhere if it has any real potential. Sorry Oliver, back to our regularly scheduled program.

I think this molding discussion is OT. Oliver points out in his original naming of the topic, "...and other stuff." This entire thread has been an ongoing education. Oliver has been a light for a lot of subjects. Those who have replied have also come up with great questions, and the replies/answers have been very enlightening. Every time this thread pops up in my Replies list, my curiosity gets the better of me. I just have to investigate.
Tinker

Thank you very much, Tinker! Thats a big compliment coming from you! I love the discussion and idea sharing evolving from this, and other, threads!

Kind regards,
Oliver