Training for New Festool Users

[BC6738F5BCE98B4]

As a new user of Festool products I wish that Festool, a dealer or some other Festool user would stage a three to four hour (each) presentation on such basic things as:

            1.  Assembly and use of MFT and accessories/attachments
              2.  Introduction to Specific Tools starting with Plunge Saw and Router
              3.  How to fit accessories into Systainers

Some examples may help. 

When I purchased my MFT, I purchased a saw and various accessories (clamps etc.) to go with the MFT.  All efforts to get the accessories to fit into the designated systainer failed.  A call to Festool indicated that this was a common problem/complaint.  I suggested that they could simply print a picture to be enclosed with the Systainer of the proper arrangement and fitting of accessories into the systainer.  At the end of the day Festool was kind enough to send me another systainer, but the various accessories are simply dumped into it when I know that they should be neatly placed in the black plastic insert(s).

Similarly, while I was able to assemble and use the MFT and Saw (based on the manual, woodshopdemos.com and other Festool dedicated sites, it would have been much better to watch someone who knew what they were doing in person. While I have used a circular saw for some time, the Festool plunge saw(s) are sufficiently different from the more common circular saws that I have used that a hands on walk through of their features would have been a great value.

I would gladly pay a reasonable fee (something under 50) to participate in such a class. I would hope that it would cover relatively minor things (such as the adapter cord for American 15 amp electric receptacles) from the ground up so that other people would not have the steep learning curve that I encountered.  Similarly, a discussion of the most common mistakes that people make using or assembling the tool(s) would be helpful.

I suspect that there are others in much the same situation.  I have spoken to both retail dealers in the Phoenix area about having such a class, but neither has actually decided to arrange for one. 

I would be interested in finding out whether other people, particularly in the Phoenix, Arizona area, would be interested in such a class or classes and whether there is someone in this group who thinks they could present it (or get someone who could). 

Alan

 

[Eli]

My dealer has been kind enough to let me demo almost everything in the manner you've suggested.

 

[Frans]

In Germany (Kurswerkstatt) and the Netherlands (Toolworkshop) you can take workshops in using several different Festool machines. These workshops are given by a number of enthousiastic Festool users, and are sponsored by Festool. The projects you make in these workshops are very basic, but is is a great way to exchange experiences with other users, or to try out a tool before you buy it (trying out at the dealer doesn't really count in my opinion).

These workshops cost 80 euros here, which isn't much for a full day including lunch. My first one was free as I got a voucher when I bought my PS300.

Perhaps some of you could get together and see if you could set up a similar program in the US.

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Alan,
Excellent post, and thanks for putting your thoughts together here.

Better knowledge of the tools and tool usage has always been a huge issue for me, and one of the main reasons for this forum's existence.

I'd be interested to hear from Dealers on how to put something like a set of presentations together.  Would it be possible to create a set of agreed-upon standards that could be applied to various presentations?  Every presentation would be different, of course, but you could sort of develop a set of "main points" for tools that everyone who does a presentation would cover.

I've been to some presentations where the presenters barely scratch the surface of the tools.  I was at a local Woodcraft when they were doing a demo of the MFT and I kept wanting to jump in and add something they were not discussing.

The standards could be created here in the forum, then Dealers could use them.  Dealers could mention the forum when doing demos.  But of course, all you Dealers already mention the forum when customers ask about Festool...right?!

Matthew

 

[HowardH]

You are making a big assumption  in thinking the dealers - no offense to the ISA's and others who this doesn't apply to - know enough about the products to demo them to you.  My local dealer really only has a cursory knowledge of the products.  I know more about how they work than they do.  That's not a good thing.  It would be interesting to know if FestoolUSA provides formal training to it's dealers or let's them figure it out just like we do. 

 

[MarkF]

I have also been bewildered at the lack of post sales support other than an 1-800 number to call and their website.  I suggested some type of Festool Owner's get together/seminar/demo/pot of coffee and doughnuts with a rep in the store for a few hours type of program for the Charlotte, NC market to one of the execs attending the IWF in Atlanta last year.  The local stores were not (and are still not) able to do more than a superficial detail of the product line and refer to the website or 800 number for product support needs.  These same stores have large classroom space.  My company (healthcare equipment manufacturer) uses these types of programs as sales and marketing tools successfully worldwide to support our products.  We always produce sales associated directly with them and spread large quantities of good will and product loyalty with a small amount of resource expended.  As Martha says "It's a good thing."

 

[TahoeTwoBears]

I've faced the same situation with a couple of dealers. They simply don't know the product line, and therefore don't always carry the full line of accessories, etc. I understand that they can enroll for free for training at a site in Las Vegas. They cover their room and board, travel, etc., but Festool provides the two days of training for free. I've been tempted to see if it's possible to figure a way to "sign up" somehow. I'd gladly travel there for a couple of days training. Perhaps they could modify a class for end users and charge a fee. Once again, I'd be happy to show up.

I'd be truly wonderful if they could have some of the more knowledge folks on this forum, teach a few classes. I've read some of the more knowledgeable posts, and it would be great to see some of these ideas presented in person.

Just my three cents worth......

 

[jonny round boy]

Here in the UK, Festool runs courses for sales staff from it's distributors. My local dealer has been on a few courses there. He doesn't know everything about Festool, but he is very keen to learn about all aspects of the tools. In fact when I popped in there last week I discovered that he's increased the Festool demo area by 100%, and is trying to set up getting regular courses run there. Anyone buying any tool from there has the opportunity to try it out for real before walking out the door with it.

 

[woodrat]

I would gladly pay to attend the official Festool factory classes.  Hey Festool, maybe there is a new profit center here.

Hope THEY are listening,

Jeff
Palmdale California

 

[woodshopdemos]

Jeff,
  Just assume they are always listening. When they announced the move of headquarters to Indianaplois, wasnt a training center to be a large factor in thta location....I am pretty sure it was.

 

[Dan Clermont]

At the local woodshow our Lie Nielsen rep would do courses in the evenings. He'd charge a small fee to cover the room costs.

The tradeshow circuit can be demanding and some may not want to teach after working the floor all day but it is an option

FYI, his demo's were not within the tradeshow compound and were moved offsite to a room or shop
Dan Clermont

 

[bruegf]

I'd sure like to see a course taught on the Domino.  Sometimes I end up with perfect alignment, but other times alignments are off and I still am not sure why it happens.  I did find out one problem today.  I sometimes use the MFT to set a piece on and register from the surface of the MFT.  It turns out that there is enough sag to the MFT in the center to throw off the aligment by 10 or 15 thousandths.

Fred

 

[Dave Ronyak]

As a new user of Festool products I wish that Festool, a dealer or some other Festool user would stage a three to four hour (each) presentation on such basic things as:

             1.  Assembly and use of MFT and accessories/attachments
              2.  Introduction to Specific Tools starting with Plunge Saw and Router
              3.  How to fit accessories into Systainers ...

I would be interested in finding out whether other people, particularly in the Phoenix, Arizona area, would be interested in such a class or classes and whether there is someone in this group who thinks they could present it (or get someone who could). 

Alan

Christian O, are you still reading these posts?  Like I said before, I wish that Festool USA would establish "Festool U" at their new Indiana HQ and any other corporate level factory or distribution centers.  I know I would benefit from such hands on training.  They could consider inviting some of the highly skilled users of Festools to teach fee-based classes, and have demo units of the complete tool line so customers and prospective customers could see what they are really to be used for - my hunch is that would increase sales, too.  I would certainly buy more tools once I understood their advantages and uses.  They could video tape many of those project building demos emphasizing the setup details using various Festools.

Dave R.

 

[clintholeman]

I am teaching a Domino class at our local [Santa Rosa, CA] WoodCraft in October.  If there is enough interest, I'll be teaching more FesTool stuff in the coming months.  $65 for a Sunday class - about 6 hours.

Perhaps other vendors would do something like that in other areas.

Also, if you all have anything you think I should include, let me know.

 

[BC6738F5BCE98B4]

The responses to my post have been full of good ideas.  I think there is a consensus that the best result would be to have people (Festool corporate or otherwise) who are knowledgeable about the specific item conduct a training class locally.  I suspect that the classes in Europe described by one of the posts could provide useful lesson plans and the like. To better distribute (lessen) the costs, holding the session within a 5 to 6 hour driving radius would be a second best alternative.  For example, if the session were in Las Vegas or San Diego (both of which have facilities) you could draw on all of Southern California and Arizona for participants.

If Festool is unwilling, or not sufficiently interested, in conducting or arranging local presentations, I would suggest that they consider putting out a DVD (which I would gladly pay for) going through at least a beginner's level course on particular tool(s), set up, safety issues and proper use.  I am currently learning to use a jig which had a DVD in the box.  I find that the instruction manual makes a great deal more sense after watching the DVD and being able to see what the instructions are talking about.

As another alternative, if there is someone in the Phoenix Metropolitan area who thinks they know enough about one or more of the Festool tools to put on such a course, let me know and we will try to figure out the details.

 

[Jerry Work]

Hi all,

Would video training work as well as an in-class training experience?  I can make videos available either for live download and/or on DVD if there is sufficient demand.  Cost would be similar to an in-store class.  I have also had a lot of interest in a several day class in my studio next summer.  Email me off line at g l w o r k @ m a c dot c o m (take the spaces out) if you would be interested in either the videos or a master's class next summer.

Jerry

 

[Dave Ronyak]

Jerry,

My direct answer to your question is "No."  Different people learn best in different ways.  Some can read a book and "get it" while others learn best from watching others do a task. Therefore individualized instruction from an observant, live teacher who can dwell a bit with a student when he/she stumbles is likely most effective IMO.  For the same reason smaller class sizes have proven more effective in public school instruction, and quality apprenticeship programs work so well.  Using the TS 55 as a hypothetical illustration,  it may be that I quickly grasp how to choose blade speed but not how to choose blade depth or how to precisely lineup for a cut,  whereas another student may immediately understand how to line up a cut and choose blade depth, but doesn't understand the how differences in materials need to be recognized and addressed and melts the plastic sheet he is cutting.

To BC and others,

Is there any Festool dealer in your [Phoenix] area who periodically hosts [sales promotion] events in which tool dealer representatives come to their store?  In my NE Ohio area, Hartville Tool has such events each Fall and another mid-to-late Winter.  Although I had already purchased my RO 125 [my first Festool], it was the Festool factory representative's demos that persuaded me to buy an MFT/TS 55 combination and several clamps of different types at that show.  At another demo show later, about the time when people on this forum were discussing the value Festools' MFS, I asked the factory rep. about it, and he offered to demo it to me after he finished his basic demo of the RO 150, TS 55 and MFT, if I could wait around, which I did.  I know he was surprised when after he started demonstrating it to me, a larger than normal crowd gathered to see what the MFS was and what could be done with it and a 1400 FEQ router.  He made a simple inlay, and carved a decorative door front from a piece of MDF.  This secondarily demonstrated the effective dust collection using a CT 22.  I have not purchased an MFS setup yet, but it is on my "wish" list.  Of course, Jerry Work's manual goes much further to describe and teach some of the many uses of the MFS.  A video of that manual including how to make and use the MFS extrusions as precise measuring and setup gauges, e.g. with the guide rails with a saw or router, would be a great learning tool.

Dave R.

I am interested in purchasing your video(s), if you decide to proceed. 

 

[Eli]

Jerry,
Having read all your manuals several times before laying my hands on relevant tools, my direct answer would be "yes". I've learned more from you than any other single source, I think it would be a good investment to have DVD's presenting your materials. Having said that, the manuals don't really leave too much that can't be understood after careful reading, so they'd likely be an alternative for the non-readers. I'd buy the first copy of a DVD with new material at this point. Maybe a walkthrough of a unique project using your whole Fes-arsenal.

 

[Madtown Rob]

My wife just got back from Festool training in Vegas Wednesday night.  Yes, life is very unfair, I think its my punishment for spending all my time in my shop.  She said training was excellent and that end user training was something everyone suggested.  Sounds like Festool is just trying to get their arms around all the distributor training, but eventually would like to do end user training (for a price of course). 

Rob

 

[TahoeTwoBears]

Jerry,

Sign me up for the DVD's.
I'll email you separately re: the class
Mike