which Festool would you pay double for?

[tjbier]

I don't think I would pay double for anything. Festool is already priced 2x and 3x more than other tools out there. I know they are built better ect....
But like Charimon said, there is more competition in today's market than there was 5-8 years ago.  Now there are 4+ track saws out there, Mafell is getting bigger, and when they become readily available in the US they will cut into Festool's margins.
Now you would have to do your research and buy 1 or 2 of different brands instead of buying straight Festool, but it could be done.
Bosch has the L Boxx to  keep up with the systainer.  They look nice too, now with T Loc's out I hate my classic systainers, but can't justify getting all T Loc's. [sad]

Besides, once a week I get some one say "never heard of that brand" while they look at my Festools. Think about that, these are guys who have been on job sites for 10+ years, and haven't heard of em!  Festool doesn't have the marketing/buying power that Makita, Bosch ect have to get into price points for box stores, and they are the only thing that mainstream shoppers see/buy.
If Festool raised there prices that much I would be done with them and be happy with what I already have.

Rant over. [smile]

 

[tjbier]

Now with all that said (above), if I had the $$ I would go and drop like $5k in stuff of festool that I want [big grin]
I love my festools, but paying more than what I /we already have = dealbreaker.

 

[Deansocial]

pay double or quadruple? We already do pay double for tools which should be leading edge in design and engineering but seem to be starting to fall short of both i think.

 

[bellchippy]

When I start buying festools a long time ago, I too thought they were over priced but soon realised they gave me the EDGE to be one step ahead of the competition and got a lot of work as a result, but now the competition is catching up with festool and the innovation that festool tools had is being lost, festool need to up there game, even if that means higher priced new tools in the future. At the moment everyone and his wife can afford these once innovative tools, and that is driving down the prices I can charge.

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

Nah, I am good.

 

[ajones]

Nah, I am good.

Yeh you're ok with your exotic french one off kit [big grin] [poke] [thumbs up]

 

[bellchippy]

Nah, I am good.

Yes you probably are, but if for example you had to make a run of cabinets on site in verneered ply and you couldn't use your TS 55 or LR 32 and guide rails, it's going to take longer than an average carpenter with these tools, so you see what I'm getting at.

 

[neth27]

Nah, I am good.

Yes you probably are, but if for example you had to make a run of cabinets on site in verneered ply and you couldn't use your TS 55 or LR 32 and guide rails, it's going to take longer than an average carpenter with these tools, so you see what I'm getting at.

Yes but you could do the work using a different companies tools, which are half the price of Festools and do exactly the same job..

John..

 

[Deansocial]

or with a hand saw and hand planes and do the same job. I know its about speeding the job up and upping the quality but i can do that with most power tools.

It like when you see a joiner set a router up with jigs to hang 1 door, its take so much longer. alot of these tools as quicker but only if you are doing repeat processes.

we need to see someting new from festool not another reinvented tool. Think outside the box

 

[Scott B.]

I guess I would look at that question from the flip side perspective. Which of your own professional services do you think you could charge double for? The obvious answer would be the ones that bring the customer the most value, that you can complete the most efficiently, and this is often accomplished through the use of a really good tool. That should hold true pretty much no matter what business you are in.

Lets face it, some tools are crazy money makers, others are not. This is measured in ROI. Its important to look at tools, whether for personal or professional use, as capital investments. When you really look at when in its lifespan a tool pays for itself, the picture becomes clear. I have done analysis on tools that we use, breaking it out to how much it costs each time we use it, and how many times we have to use it before it pays for itself. When a tool has paid for itself, it is a straight up profit generator for the rest of its life.

 

[neth27]

I must admit i use a router and jig on fire doors, but the jig is set up for the hinges and the bit is always in the router  [smile] On standard internal doors i would never bother using any power tools apart from a cordless drill. Plane by hand and cut out hinges with a hammer and chisel etc.
 To me if you use power tools for everything you become bone-idle.. I use a hand saw far more than any circular saw, plunge saw or jigsaw.

John...

 

[bellchippy]

Nah, I am good.

Yes you probably are, but if for example you had to make a run of cabinets on site in verneered ply and you couldn't use your TS 55 or LR 32 and guide rails, it's going to take longer than an average carpenter with these tools, so you see what I'm getting at.

Yes but you could do the work using a different companies tools, which are half the price of Festools and do exactly the same job..

You can now because festool have lost there patent. Read my post no75
John..

 

[neth27]

Patents for what?

John.

 

[jmbfestool]

I must admit i use a router and jig on fire doors, but the jig is set up for the hinges and the bit is always in the router  [smile] On standard internal doors i would never bother using any power tools apart from a cordless drill. Plane by hand and cut out hinges with a hammer and chisel etc.
 To me if you use power tools for everything you become bone-idle.. I use a hand saw far more than any circular saw, plunge saw or jigsaw.

John...

umm kinda disagree because  just saying!! So these are not real figures just an example!!    

Lets say you do 4 doors with your hand tools .... hand plane,drill,hammer,chisels,hand saw.         Some one else is using power tools TS55,Planer,drill,router etc  and does 10 doors in the same time as you did 4....well he has carried 10doors to and from the door lining and you have only carried 4 doors now to me that aint lazy.   If the same person is using power tools but only does four doors like you did with your hand tools in the same time then YES I could agree with you and they are being lazy as they should of been working just as hard as you but done more doors because powertools should be making your job quicker otherwise der is no point using the powertools if your not getting more done than some one with handtools

JMB

 

[bellchippy]

The real game changers in the festool range are/ were the track saw, this gain has now been lost.

The domino's especially the xl model, the sanders and OF 2200 router .

And although most of my tools are festool and I think they are great we need some more game changers. I for one would pay a premium for a tool that no one else made and broke new ground in some way.

 

[neth27]

I must admit i use a router and jig on fire doors, but the jig is set up for the hinges and the bit is always in the router  [smile] On standard internal doors i would never bother using any power tools apart from a cordless drill. Plane by hand and cut out hinges with a hammer and chisel etc.
 To me if you use power tools for everything you become bone-idle.. I use a hand saw far more than any circular saw, plunge saw or jigsaw.

John...

umm kinda disagree because  just saying!! So these are not real figures just an example!!    

Lets say you do 4 doors with your hand tools .... hand plane,drill,hammer,chisels,hand saw.         Some one else is using power tools TS55,Planer,drill,router etc  and does 10 doors in the same time as you did 4....well he has carried 10doors to and from the door lining and you have only carried 4 doors now to me that aint lazy.   If the same person is using power tools but only does four doors like you did with your hand tools in the same time then YES I could agree with you and they are being lazy as they should of been working just as hard as you but done more doors because powertools should be making your job quicker otherwise der is no point using the powertools if your not getting more done than some one with handtools

JMB

Carrying doors to a casing isn't hard work... [big grin]
If your working in someones house you can't drag all that gear from room to room... as i said fire doors i use a router for the hinges as these are normally in schools etc where there is room to move. If you constantly use a circular saw, after a few weeks try using a hand saw again, your arm aches quickly..
  I have worked with people who only use power tools, what happens if they got pinched? there job would be over as they can't use a hand saw or plane etc to save there lives..

John..

 

[woodguy7]

Totally agree John.  To many people are reliant on power tools.  I'm with you, I use hand tools much more than power tools.  When my apprentice first started working for me he thought I was joking when I said he couldn't use the Kapex for finishings !  He was under no illusions that he had to be competent with hand tools first.

Woodguy.

 

[jmbfestool]

I must admit i use a router and jig on fire doors, but the jig is set up for the hinges and the bit is always in the router  [smile] On standard internal doors i would never bother using any power tools apart from a cordless drill. Plane by hand and cut out hinges with a hammer and chisel etc.
 To me if you use power tools for everything you become bone-idle.. I use a hand saw far more than any circular saw, plunge saw or jigsaw.

John...

umm kinda disagree because  just saying!! So these are not real figures just an example!!    

Lets say you do 4 doors with your hand tools .... hand plane,drill,hammer,chisels,hand saw.         Some one else is using power tools TS55,Planer,drill,router etc  and does 10 doors in the same time as you did 4....well he has carried 10doors to and from the door lining and you have only carried 4 doors now to me that aint lazy.   If the same person is using power tools but only does four doors like you did with your hand tools in the same time then YES I could agree with you and they are being lazy as they should of been working just as hard as you but done more doors because powertools should be making your job quicker otherwise der is no point using the powertools if your not getting more done than some one with handtools

JMB

Carrying doors to a casing isn't hard work... [big grin]
If your working in someones house you can't drag all that gear from room to room... as i said fire doors i use a router for the hinges as these are normally in schools etc where there is room to move. If you constantly use a circular saw, after a few weeks try using a hand saw again, your arm aches quickly..
  I have worked with people who only use power tools, what happens if they got pinched? there job would be over as they can't use a hand saw or plane etc to save there lives..

John..

No you cant drag all the gear room to room but also you cant always work in the rooms where the doors need hanging either and so you end up carrying doors down stairs out side to work on the door and then back up stairs and so 10 doors can be hard work over 4 doors.      Your now saying if tools get pinched then certain people are buggered well thats criticising peoples skill level now and not how lazy they are when using powertools.    I am more power tools than hand tools but I can and will use hand tools if I have to but nor am I lazy when I just use powertools. 

JMB

 

[neth27]

I must admit i use a router and jig on fire doors, but the jig is set up for the hinges and the bit is always in the router  [smile] On standard internal doors i would never bother using any power tools apart from a cordless drill. Plane by hand and cut out hinges with a hammer and chisel etc.
 To me if you use power tools for everything you become bone-idle.. I use a hand saw far more than any circular saw, plunge saw or jigsaw.

John...

umm kinda disagree because  just saying!! So these are not real figures just an example!!    

Lets say you do 4 doors with your hand tools .... hand plane,drill,hammer,chisels,hand saw.         Some one else is using power tools TS55,Planer,drill,router etc  and does 10 doors in the same time as you did 4....well he has carried 10doors to and from the door lining and you have only carried 4 doors now to me that aint lazy.   If the same person is using power tools but only does four doors like you did with your hand tools in the same time then YES I could agree with you and they are being lazy as they should of been working just as hard as you but done more doors because powertools should be making your job quicker otherwise der is no point using the powertools if your not getting more done than some one with handtools

JMB

Carrying doors to a casing isn't hard work... [big grin]
If your working in someones house you can't drag all that gear from room to room... as i said fire doors i use a router for the hinges as these are normally in schools etc where there is room to move. If you constantly use a circular saw, after a few weeks try using a hand saw again, your arm aches quickly..
  I have worked with people who only use power tools, what happens if they got pinched? there job would be over as they can't use a hand saw or plane etc to save there lives..

John..

No you cant drag all the gear room to room but also you cant always work in the rooms where the doors need hanging either and so you end up carrying doors down stairs out side to work on the door and then back up stairs and so 10 doors can be hard work over 4 doors.       Your now saying if tools get pinched then certain people are buggered well thats criticising peoples skill level now and not how lazy they are when using powertools.     I am more power tools than hand tools but I can and will use hand tools if I have to but nor am I lazy when I just use powertools. 

JMB

With hand tools you can always work in the room where the door is... As long as i can stand the door on the floor on edge i can hang it..
So you have to carry every door downstairs go outside with your tools, do the work, then bring them all back in the house (you can't leave your Festool power tools outside someones front door) Need to take a bit more off the door? back down stairs again, tools out, do the work, tools back in again, door back upstairs..... etc etc... [big grin]

John..

 

[neth27]

JMB, of course I'm not saying you are lazy... Its just people end up relying on power tools. There are jobs i could do with power tools but i choose to use hand tools instead. As i said if you constantly use power tools you just become unfit..

John...