Windows 10

[CrazyLarry]

It's always struck me that if an OS is stable enough that a support line is no longer profitable far from being the time to stop using it that's the time to start using it!

I'm with Steve on this.  My rule of thumb centers on the fact that Microsoft has blown every other release of the Windows O/S badly.  I will not upgrade to the next "good" release for at least a year after release, and preferably not until Service Pack 1 has been released AND a year has passed.  While I don't mind being on the leading edge, I prefer not being on the bleeding edge.

I'm being equally circumspect, registered for it but I'll stick with my franken8.1 for at least a year.

8.1 with classic shell in full XP mode, file explorer in XP mode, start and metro/modern fully disabled, charms disabled, gestures disabled, all apps disabled, uninstalled, unstaged and deleted! UAC fully disabled. Then all the options Shane mentions switched off and IE disabled.

Finally override trusted installer throughout the filesystem and registry, so when you're admin there's no mysterious higher power controlling your machine. And at last 8.1 is usuable. (that doesn't mean running as admin - but I don't see why my own machine should tell me even when I explicitly promote to admin that I can't delete an old file!!!)

From what I've seen 10 is just as bad and superficially very similar, if not in some ways underneath worse; I can't see MS not wringing every last drop of personal data out to compensate them for the loss of revenue. They are moving to a google model which says all your data is our data and 10 is the vehicle. Android and OSX / iOS have been using that model for years now one openly the other behind the curtain.

 

[Sparktrician]

From what I've seen 10 is just as bad and superficially very similar, if not in some ways underneath worse; I can't see MS not wringing every last drop of personal data out to compensate them for the loss of revenue. They are moving to a google model which says all your data is our data and 10 is the vehicle. Android and OSX / iOS have been using that model for years now one openly the other behind the curtain.

I see Ubuntu Linux in my immediate future... 

 

[Tinker]

I heard about this upgrade on the radio (Hartford) one time.  I turned out to be one of those reports that you hear once, and only once before the SHTF. The report said that the upgrade from 8 to 10 would be available, but it was going to be an automatic upgrade in 45 days.

I asked my computer guru about it and he said it did not pertain to Mac users.  I have been following this thread and i am wondering if, in the end, there will be a choice.  Or did the radio station get it wrong?
Tinker

 

[Sparktrician]

I heard about this upgrade on the radio (Hartford) one time.  I turned out to be one of those reports that you hear once, and only once before the SHTF. The report said that the upgrade from 8 to 10 would be available, but it was going to be an automatic upgrade in 45 days.

I asked my computer guru about it and he said it did not pertain to Mac users.  I have been following this thread and i am wondering if, in the end, there will be a choice.  Or did the radio station get it wrong?
Tinker

If you're on a Mac, don't worry about it.  Then again, if you're upgrading to Win 10, you'd do well to read this article on Forbes about the unstoppable updates that you'll be forced to accept as part of the End User License. 

 

[CrazyLarry]

I heard about this upgrade on the radio (Hartford) one time.  I turned out to be one of those reports that you hear once, and only once before the SHTF. The report said that the upgrade from 8 to 10 would be available, but it was going to be an automatic upgrade in 45 days.

The automation / compulsion threat is very real.

However if you're alert you can block it, after registering for the future upgrade, to regain control, go into windows update and look for KB3035583.

Disable/hide it, there will then be no nagging or constant attempts to force you to upgrade immediately (with all 3.5Gb).

I'm intending to clone my 8.1 to a fresh disk, perform the upgrade and then if I really can't stand it / live with it I'll swap the disk back

 

[Shane Holland]

If you're on a Mac, don't worry about it.

Not entirely true. OSX has it's own set of privacy "concerns".

http://lifehacker.com/lets-talk-about-apples-privacy-issues-1655944758

In reality, the OS's are just using your data to personalize your experience. Nearly every smartphone app does this, whether it be location-based or otherwise.

Personally, I think these things get a little blown out of proportion, but everyone has their own opinions on what constitutes an invasion of privacy. I could care less if Microsoft knows I'm on the FOG.  [smile]

This will continue to become more and more common as personalization is a big movement right now software and marketing. As long as you have the option to opt-out, I don't see the issue. If it were being done covertly, that's a different matter.

But this is an important part of the conversation for anyone considering to move to a new OS, and that's why I mentioned it in my original reply.

 

[CrazyLarry]

This will continue to become more and more common as personalization is a big movement right now software and marketing. As long as you have the option to opt-out, I don't see the issue. If it were being done covertly, that's a different matter.

I accept that it is the trend (I don't like it...) but the corollary to your very valid point about covert implementation is the coercion and deceit used to get everyone signed up willing or not, aware or not, and the clear effort that's gone into making genuine opt out a trial by fire of the virtual kind.

Combine that with a collection of 'benefits' that are almost all in the long-term about MS and not the user and it's hard to see how it's not just another expression of the '12 yr old' new boy wide-eyed developer syndrome... change is great, but not for it's own sake.

Take personalisation: the hardest thing for a software company when collecting and sifting data is establishing reference points you can trust enough to make decisions about. Getting someone to login with the same account globally on any machine so they have their roaming settings with them allows you to track their data use... yes it's anonymised at one level but at others it isn't and you can always bypass the anonymity if you're at the center of the system. It's one of the mechanisms Google use if you search after logging in, it's there in iTunes and MS want it in your login too.

Not saying it is something to lose sleep over but it is something to be informed about and make a decision about.

 

[bkharman]

From what I've seen 10 is just as bad and superficially very similar, if not in some ways underneath worse; I can't see MS not wringing every last drop of personal data out to compensate them for the loss of revenue. They are moving to a google model which says all your data is our data and 10 is the vehicle. Android and OSX / iOS have been using that model for years now one openly the other behind the curtain.

I see Ubuntu Linux in my immediate future...

Yes, yes, yes!!

Even on my Macs I run Ubuntu and love it!  centOS is a close 2nd.  Throw it into a Docker or Vagrant and you have a bada__ setup!

(I know a decision like this is not in the cards for everyone, but for some it is a great thing!

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[sae]

I'd run linux on my play machine, but I need my work applications to function 100%.

That said, with Office 365, I guess I can do more stuff "in the cloud" now? Does it need ActiveX? Or is it all HTML5? I have no idea how it works, I haven't upgraded from 2013.

 

[CrazyLarry]

I'd run linux on my play machine, but I need my work applications to function 100%.

That said, with Office 365, I guess I can do more stuff "in the cloud" now? Does it need ActiveX? Or is it all HTML5? I have no idea how it works, I haven't upgraded from 2013.

LibreOffice 5 instead, good enough for the German state top to bottom.

 

[sae]

LibreOffice 5 instead, good enough for the German state top to bottom.

That's fine and all, but when the rest of the enterprise is on something else, I need to bend to their will.

 

[chrisrosenb]

I decided to try Windows 10 on my laptop computer. I started the download process. When reading the Terms & Conditions, I came across  the following sentence.

"Windows 10 is automatically updated. Additional requirements may apply over time for updates. See the Windows 10 Upgrade page for details."

I could not find anything about the additional requirements on the upgrade page. I had read a while back that Microsoft at some point would start requiring a yearly subscription to continue receiving updates for the free upgrades of Windows 10.

Anyone else read subscriptions or know what the additional requirements for updates might be?

 

[AlexThePalex]

Not sure if it's true, but I've read that the reason they make the Windows 10 upgrade for free is because M$ wants to shift their business model to a Microsoft Store, just like the App Store and Google Play.

 

[Shane Holland]

[member=1903]JD2720[/member]

Chris, it's referring to Windows Updates and there's no intention for them to charge for them. It's the same Windows Updates that have been around for forever. I suspect they did this because people are notoriously bad at updating their computers, which makes it unsafe for them and others. So, the lack of proactive patching has made updates automatic. If it's really an issue for someone, there are ways to disable it, but there are steps involved that you'll need to Google.

Shane

 

[chrisrosenb]

[member=1903]JD2720[/member]

Chris, it's referring to Windows Updates and there's no intention for them to charge for them. It's the same Windows Updates that have been around for forever. I suspect they did this because people are notoriously bad at updating their computers, which makes it unsafe for them and others. So, the lack of proactive patching has made updates automatic. If it's really an issue for someone, there are ways to disable it, but there are steps involved that you'll need to Google.

Shane

Shane,

Thank you for the reply. But what do you believe they mean by "Additional requirements may apply over time for updates."

Chris

 

[Shane Holland]

Give this thread a read, Chris.

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-win_upgrade/additional-requirements-may-apply-over-time-for/983d7226-3e16-49ff-9834-ed8f6e5ff3e0

The same language was in Windows 7 & 8, and possibly previous versions. According to the thread, it's referring to hardware requirements. They explicitly state that this is not about charging for updates. [member=1903]JD2720[/member]

Shane

 

[crazydave789]

Not sure if it's true, but I've read that the reason they make the Windows 10 upgrade for free is because M$ wants to shift their business model to a Microsoft Store, just like the App Store and Google Play.

hence the charge to play a dvd or have solitaire without adverts. MS is going google/facebook etc..

 

[sae]

But what do you believe they mean by "Additional requirements may apply over time for updates."

It's a CYA clause to say, "if we update Windows and your printer/mouse/keyboard/game/word processor/etc. becomes incompatible, it's not our fault and you can't sue us for it."

Obviously M$ and the manufacturer/developer are going to try to make sure everything remains compatible for their own sake, but sometimes that's not possible with ever-evolving software.

 

[Tinker]

Altho I don't know what is happening with my Mac programs, with my most recent upgrade (almost a year ago), I am still somewhat closer to prehistoric than most.  My upgrade is working smoother than the previous upgrade, but until recently, every time I opened a doc from the old format, i would have to struggle a long to figure out why/what/where the doc was not working properly.  I finally figured out how to upgrade each doc as i discovered a problem.  I had to prompt the upgrade and usually did not prompt unless I found a problem (Spread sheet only).  Suddenly, if i go back in time, A message comes up on the screen that TELLS me to upgrade.

I really have no idea why the sudden change, but I go with the flow.
Tinker

 

[fdengel]

I mostly just use my (cheap) Windoze laptop for games and a few oddball applications that don't have Mac versions (in some cases not "yet", in others I would just run the Linux versions or find something else to use if I were doing something important with them), but it came with 8.1 on it and I do find 10 to be a big improvement over 8.1 for the most part.  It is still a Microsoft product, so I personally don't trust it for doing any "real" work, so I can't really comment there (well, I probably shouldn't anyway  ;D).