Woodpeckers 26 X 14 square on a Festool guide rail

[RONWEN]

Hey,  I wasn't ragging on Karen or anyone else there.  In fact I wasn't even really ragging on them at all.  I was really ragging on a business situation where people get stuck in a position and which way to use employees can make a long term impact.  I certainly am not perfect and am not afraid of telling anyone that.  [eek]  I also know about controlling expenses and maximizing either profit or cash flow.  But, if you are a for profit manufacturer, and you want to reduce the time to receive income, and you have product in house to ship, and you have a shipping person who is swamped - there are alternatives - short term and long term.

By example in another industry:  Let's assume that I am an extremely successful contractor who spends his time in the field producing income.  But because my time is so valuable there I don't pay attention to the fact that I haven't been billing, so the bank account is bare - but I do have a ton of work to invoice customers for.  If I am worried about cash flow - I should either outsource the invoicing part or hire a temp.  If I think that it is invoicing problem is permanent - then hire permanent or outsource permanent.  If I really think that what I need is to invoice so as to maximize profit now - then minimize costs to invoice and take longer to invoice by doing it myself.  Isolated hiccups in a process are just that.  But when the hiccups don't stop and there is a pattern then care should be paid.

I have bought from Bridge City and done that.  I have bought from Woodpeckers and done that.  I will happily do so again.  I don't mind waiting.  But others do.  I wish all of them the best success and hope everyone gets their tools soon!

Peter

Absolutely Peter.  I am happy with the products of both companies.  Since they are both very small it almost seems customer responsibility to bring attention to obvious shortcomings whether they choose to address them or not.  Either way, I'll continue to be a loyal customer.   

 

[joraft]

...  Since they are both very small it almost seems customer responsibility to bring attention to obvious shortcomings whether they choose to address them or not. 
   

Absolutely, and if I were them I would want to know what people are thinking.  [smile]

 

[nickao]

I never had any issue with anything other than the one offs they make. BridgeCity does the same, they gave the most optimistic ship date to start and never make it. I don't hold it against them, they are one offs. I have been late on one offs as well. Its tough to do the regular business and then the extra stuff. But 2 weeks for 90 squares is to long. One person can do that in 1 day, 2 days max.

I have ordered an awful lot from them over the years, exactly 40 orders starting in 2005 on my old email address, not including any one off items. All to me within 3 - 5 days. I never got anything I did not like either.

I'll gladly take someones large square if they decide they want the money and don't want to wait.  

 

[RONWEN]

I never had any issue with anything other than the one offs they make. BridgeCity does the same, they gave the most optimistic ship date to start and never make it. I don't hold it against them, they are one offs. I have been late on one offs as well. Its tough to do the regular business and then the extra stuff. But 2 weeks for 90 squares is to long. One person can do that in 1 day, 2 days max.

I have ordered an awful lot from them over the years, exactly 40 orders starting in 2005 on my old email address, not including any one off items. All to me within 3 - 5 days. I never got anything I did not like either.

I'll gladly take someones large square if they decide they want the money and don't want to wait.  

A couple of items I'll probably e-bay -- the "one time" small Tee squares aren't nearly as handy as the later "one time" saddle squares.  Also, the "one time" dovetail marking gauges have too short of 90 degree straight leg requiring re-positioning when doing through dovetails on ~3/4" stock.

I'll be surprised if you get a taker (or giver [smile]) on the large square -- that square should be outstanding for MFT alignment, etc.

 

[nickao]

I got the saddle square not the others you have though. I am sure you can eBay pretty quick. Heck, I don't even want the large square for that.  That large square should be a standard item. Heck, Ill take it even larger!

 

[peter halle]

I would love to have one of the larger squares too.  Timing wasn't right for me.

Hopefully extras are being made to be released later as an interest teaser  if overall interest is slow.

But I am not a marketing guy.  But I am a teaser  [scared].

Peter

 

[semenza]

Got the metric square today. Awesome !

CutsTwice , how about some details and pics of the connectors?

Seth

 

[Ken Nagrod]

I finally got mine too.

 

[RONWEN]

While at WIA I saw a couple of SHARP one-timers they want to offer before Christmas.  [wink]

 

[Ken Nagrod]

While at WIA I saw a couple of SHARP one-timers they want to offer before Christmas.  [wink]

You mean this one-time run?

 

[RONWEN]

While at WIA I saw a couple of SHARP one-timers they want to offer before Christmas.  [wink]

You mean this one-time run?

[big grin]  [big grin] No.

 

[CutsTwice]

Seth,

I'll get some close-up pictures and some measurements posted in the next day or two, my work bench is smothered with junk today.

 

[GPowers]

Lol...sure, I've looked at their site.... . I was wondering if anybody has any (not on the site) scuttlebutt about tools they have yet to offer. I've been told that the owner of Woodpeckers posts on this forum, so maybe somebody here is "in the know".

Thanks for the link.

The Metric set up blocks we a demand pull endeavor from this website.  So if there is a tool you want and think others will also want it drum up some interest.

 

[CutsTwice]

Ok, here are some close-up pictures of the way I "played Dr." with the limit stops to attach the square (as well as other 1/4 inch thick Woodpeckers' tools) to my guide rails. As you can see from the pictures, I turned them around backward to hang over the outside edge of the rail, and changed out the original knob with what ever metric screw that fit the square nut underneath (M6?). The original knob was too tall for the saw to pass over a deeper cut depths. Then I drilled two new holes in what I deemed to be the strongest points of the plastic and picked a couple of 1/4-20 thread by 1/2 long screws to drop through. The only part that made me nervous was making a jig to screw the limit stops to before running them through the table saw. This was done to cut down the thickness on the outside half of the stop to about .450 total. The half on the guiderail was left at it's original thickness. The .450 thickness was done by eyeball to allow for the thickness of the square underneath the limit stop in regards to the bottom plane of the guide rail with the cushiony-rubber pads. You might be able to figure this to a more exact measurement, but I was too lazy.

The way I lined the taps in the square up with the holes in the limit stops is kinda screwy, and I'm not sure if I can explain it clearly...but I will give it a try.
1. I drilled the original holes in the limit stop with the pilot bit for my 1/4-20 tap.
2. After everything in the first paragraph was done, I installed the limit stops on the guide rail, set them together on the drill press table, and clamped both down.
3. I passed the pilot bit through the holes in the limit stops and on through the square underneath with cooling oil and a blow-out board on the bottom.
4. I disassembled everything, and enlarged the pilot holes in the limit stop to 1/4 inch.
5. I tapped the square to 1/4-20 thread.

That's it. In hindsight I would have done the new holes and taps in the same thread as the metric knob-screw that came with the limit stops, but I don't have metric taps.

Hope that helps, and if anyone comes up with a way to make all this work easier I'd love to hear about it.

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[Ken Nagrod]

I never had any issue with anything other than the one offs they make. BridgeCity does the same, they gave the most optimistic ship date to start and never make it. I don't hold it against them, they are one offs. I have been late on one offs as well. Its tough to do the regular business and then the extra stuff. But 2 weeks for 90 squares is to long. One person can do that in 1 day, 2 days max.

I have ordered an awful lot from them over the years, exactly 40 orders starting in 2005 on my old email address, not including any one off items. All to me within 3 - 5 days. I never got anything I did not like either.

I'll gladly take someones large square if they decide they want the money and don't want to wait.  

A couple of items I'll probably e-bay -- the "one time" small Tee squares aren't nearly as handy as the later "one time" saddle squares.  Also, the "one time" dovetail marking gauges have too short of 90 degree straight leg requiring re-positioning when doing through dovetails on ~3/4" stock.

I'll be surprised if you get a taker (or giver [smile]) on the large square -- that square should be outstanding for MFT alignment, etc.

Ron,

About those Woodpeckers dovetail marking gauges, somebody screwed up the math on them.  Their 1:6 gauge is marked as 19.18 degrees, the 1:7 gauge is marked as 16.42 degrees and the 1:8 gauge is marked 14.25 degrees.  I don't know how they came up with those odd figures, but in checking them against a digital angle gauge, the true dovetail angles are exactly half of what's laser engraved on the tools.  Soooo the 1:6 is approximately equal to a 9.5 degree router bit, the 1:7 is approximately equal to an 8 degree bit and the 1:8 works out to a 7 degree bit.  If you can't picture this check out these drawings on Freud's website.
Dovetail bit angles

This isn't the first time there was a math "screw up".  I found an error on the 1281 squares that Richard knows about and is in the process of correcting supposedly.  The scales are off, he told me due to a math error in the programming of the engraving machine.  Maybe a rounding error or something?

Ron, if you look closely at their video or pictures for the dovetail marking gauges, you'll see that the vertical 'T' bar doesn't go all the way across the edge of 3/4" stock.  It's not meant or couldn't be designed to be like the Veritas dovetail marking gauges.

 

[RONWEN]

I never had any issue with anything other than the one offs they make. BridgeCity does the same, they gave the most optimistic ship date to start and never make it. I don't hold it against them, they are one offs. I have been late on one offs as well. Its tough to do the regular business and then the extra stuff. But 2 weeks for 90 squares is to long. One person can do that in 1 day, 2 days max.

I have ordered an awful lot from them over the years, exactly 40 orders starting in 2005 on my old email address, not including any one off items. All to me within 3 - 5 days. I never got anything I did not like either.

I'll gladly take someones large square if they decide they want the money and don't want to wait.  

A couple of items I'll probably e-bay -- the "one time" small Tee squares aren't nearly as handy as the later "one time" saddle squares.  Also, the "one time" dovetail marking gauges have too stuff of 90 degree straight leg requiring re-positioning when doing through dovetails on ~3/4" stock.

I'll be surprised if you get a taker (or giver [smile]) on the large square -- that square should be outstanding for MFT alignment, etc.

Ron,

About those Woodpeckers dovetail marking gauges, somebody screwed up the math on them.  Their 1:6 gauge is marked as 19.18 degrees, the 1:7 gauge is marked as 16.42 degrees and the 1:8 gauge is marked 14.25 degrees.  I don't know how they came up with those odd figures, but in checking them against a digital angle gauge, the true dovetail angles are exactly half of what's laser engraved on the tools.  Soooo the 1:6 is approximately equal to a 9.5 degree router bit, the 1:7 is approximately equal to an 8 degree bit and the 1:8 works out to a 7 degree bit.  If you can't picture this check out these drawings on Freud's website.
Dovetail bit angles

This isn't the first time there was a math "screw up".  I found an error on the 1281 squares that Richard knows about and is in the process of correcting supposedly.  The scales are off, he told me due to a math error in the programming of the engraving machine.  Maybe a rounding error or something?

Ron, if you look closely at their video or pictures for the dovetail marking gauges, you'll see that the vertical 'T' bar doesn't go all the way across the edge of 3/4" stock.  It's not meant or couldn't be designed to be like the Veritas dovetail marking gauges.

I'll have to take a look at mine, you are no doubt correct on the angles.  I talked with Richard about the "stuff" legs -- he says they were intended for doing half-pin dovetails (I prefer using a marking gauge).

EDIT: I tried a few times to replace stuff with the correct word but for some reason it won't save the change??? I talked with Richard about the "stuff" legs    

 

[nsc]

Does anyone know if these are still for sale any where?  I have the smaller one but would love to get the large square, and help would be great

Thanks gene

 

[semenza]

Does anyone know if these are still for sale any where?  I have the smaller one but would love to get the large square, and help would be great

Thanks gene

Nope, the 26 x 14 was a one time run. Keep an eye on classifieds, and e bay, etc. Maybe you will get lucky, albiet very lucky.

When you say the smaller one, do you mean the standard offering 12" or the other one time run 6"?

Seth

 

[nsc]

The 12 inch one, which I love... o well missed out on that one dam