Ted Miller
Member
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2007
- Messages
- 235
I am a new guy to Festool and did not know this even existed, interesting:
http://www.idealtools.com.au/category3893_1.htm
http://www.idealtools.com.au/category3893_1.htm
CMT, I did not know...
- Thread starter Ted Miller
- Start date
) mounted as modules in CMS table. Are we going to have them some day in the US?. ???I get a case of the drools every time I see that thing. Unfortunately It will probably never get through UL. UL doesn't seem to have a problem with table saws that don't have a riving knife, auto-stop mechanism (like SawStop), or a whole bunch of other safety features. But give 'em something new like a CMS and they can't deal with it! 
Rant = /off
Regards,
Dan.
Rant = /off
Regards,
Dan.
Dan Clark said:I get a case of the drools every time I see that thing. Unfortunately It will probably never get through UL. UL doesn't seem to have a problem with table saws that don't have a riving knife, auto-stop mechanism (like SawStop), or a whole bunch of other safety features. But give 'em something new like a CMS and they can't deal with it!
Rant = /off
Regards,
Dan.
I wonder how much is politics rather than whether the tools should or should not be accepted. When i was a mason contractor, i had to deal with BI's in different towns. One time, i had a difficult problem type job in a neighboring town. the BI insisted on a cetain specifacation. It would have been an extra and the builder did not want it to happen unless the owner would pay for it. I argued with the BI that what we planned on doing far exceeded every point in the code. His personally dreamed up spec exceeded all imagination. He just looked me in the eye and said, "Young man, in (this town), I AM THE CODE." End of arguement. when two years later, i moved into that same town to live, i never had another problem. i was then a resident contractor, so i was OK. Politics>>> or what???
Oh! I forgot! Why did anybody have to bring up that CMS thing? I'm drooling, I've got the shakes! This is horrible. When will it be coming here????????????
Tinker
The only possible safety problem I could see with the CMS is the possibility that someone doesn't install the saw properly and it falls out of the module onto your foot with the trigger locked on.
This is unlikely, though, because Festool have a little wire cable that connects the saw depth mechanism to the module plate, which would catch the saw in the very unlikely event that it ever fell. (Unless the user is tempted to cut the cable, as I am, because it's such a pain in the arse moving the module plate with the depth control dangling off it. These days the TS75 lives in my CMS pretty much permanently, so it's not an issue.)
If I was a US Festoolie, I'd be demanding to know why the CMS hasn't made it through the red tape. It's a gem. Even when I finally get the router table and sander, the compactness of the CMS means I can fit a fairly well-rounded workshop under an office desk in our rented house.
This is unlikely, though, because Festool have a little wire cable that connects the saw depth mechanism to the module plate, which would catch the saw in the very unlikely event that it ever fell. (Unless the user is tempted to cut the cable, as I am, because it's such a pain in the arse moving the module plate with the depth control dangling off it. These days the TS75 lives in my CMS pretty much permanently, so it's not an issue.)
If I was a US Festoolie, I'd be demanding to know why the CMS hasn't made it through the red tape. It's a gem. Even when I finally get the router table and sander, the compactness of the CMS means I can fit a fairly well-rounded workshop under an office desk in our rented house.
Cabinet saw and CMS are different species. CMS is excellent solution for small workshops. It is portable system for ripping narrow strips. That’s great product when you have to go to the customer’s site and do some work there. Do you want to load your cabinet saw on your truck? What about your dust collection system for cabinet saw? When you do some work on site you can have just one TS-55 saw for cutting plywood sheets with rails and narrow strips with CMS. Also you’ll have a router table and table belt sander. And this is almost dusting free! With other brand saws you have to work outside customer’s house or clean up a lot of dust. Working outside is not a problem during summer, but during winter…
They’re a lot of buzz and rumors about UL approval for different Festool products. Did TS module for CMS get “No” from the UL or is it still pending? Which products were submitted for UL approval?
They’re a lot of buzz and rumors about UL approval for different Festool products. Did TS module for CMS get “No” from the UL or is it still pending? Which products were submitted for UL approval?
Jon,
I think many people (including me) would prefer a large, stable saw if they met our needs and constraints. That's the problem - many of us don't have the space and/or need portability. For many of us, a CMS plus CT22 would fill both needs; a big cabinet saw would fill neither.
In my case, I'm in the middle of a master bathroom remodel. After that, there are a series of pretty good sized projects. My Festools are perfect. A CMS would be very useful. A cabinet saw would be of limited use to me and I don't have the space for one. But those are my needs and constraints.
I think your post is very valuable. Like most Festool owners, you didn't blindly follow conventional wisdom. You intelligently evaluated your needs and tool alternatives, and picked a combination of tools that best suited your needs and constraints. IMO, nothing else is important. Congrats!
Regards,
Dan.
I think many people (including me) would prefer a large, stable saw if they met our needs and constraints. That's the problem - many of us don't have the space and/or need portability. For many of us, a CMS plus CT22 would fill both needs; a big cabinet saw would fill neither.
In my case, I'm in the middle of a master bathroom remodel. After that, there are a series of pretty good sized projects. My Festools are perfect. A CMS would be very useful. A cabinet saw would be of limited use to me and I don't have the space for one. But those are my needs and constraints.
I think your post is very valuable. Like most Festool owners, you didn't blindly follow conventional wisdom. You intelligently evaluated your needs and tool alternatives, and picked a combination of tools that best suited your needs and constraints. IMO, nothing else is important. Congrats!
Regards,
Dan.
An idea and possibly more stable than the CMS would be to buy the inserts for it/your tool, route the receiver for them in a MFT and a mdf/alu blank for mounting in the recess when not using inserts.
Source the powerbutton and some cords as YOU would like them to be, and have it snapped to the side or one of the legs of the MFT.
Would provide a larger worksurface, and even more versatility to the MFT.
Sure - a MFT800 is heavier than the CMS base unit (~35%), but i suspect approx the same when you start adding outriggers, bars, feeds and whatnot to the CMS.
Next modification could be adding 3" to the MFT height to get a better position when you miss working standing straight
Source the powerbutton and some cords as YOU would like them to be, and have it snapped to the side or one of the legs of the MFT.
Would provide a larger worksurface, and even more versatility to the MFT.
Sure - a MFT800 is heavier than the CMS base unit (~35%), but i suspect approx the same when you start adding outriggers, bars, feeds and whatnot to the CMS.
Next modification could be adding 3" to the MFT height to get a better position when you miss working standing straight
I keep trying to figure how to get along without my Craftsman TS. I could do without it if I never had to rip narrow stips less than, say 1-1/4', or multiple rips of any size. I can do it with the AFT guidebar setup, but it sometimes takes a lot of extra setting up. It is so much quicker with the TS. I have thought about getting one of the bench saws like DW or bosche t save space. At my age and the location in my cellar, even those saws are no longer much of an option for portability. This CMT setup, altho expensive, would create a ton of extra space with excellent portability. One peron above said he can store an entire shop under his desk. Now that makes for a heap of interrest from this corner. I have mounted my old Milwaukee jig saw under a 1/4" plate, so I am familiar with the usefulness of mounting toos upside down. to be able to do this with circular saw (ATF), router, jigsaw etc, as an integrated system is close to perfection.
For me, the most enticing feature of the festool system other than the quality f their tools, is the over all space saving that is possible with total integration. The portability is also a great feature.All of these features together tend to make the initial shock at some of the pricing a whole lot more bearable. I often have observed that "Cheap ain't cheap." The reverse is true. "Expensive ain't always costly."
Tinker
For me, the most enticing feature of the festool system other than the quality f their tools, is the over all space saving that is possible with total integration. The portability is also a great feature.All of these features together tend to make the initial shock at some of the pricing a whole lot more bearable. I often have observed that "Cheap ain't cheap." The reverse is true. "Expensive ain't always costly."
Tinker
Lou Miller
Member
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2007
- Messages
- 480
Tinker,
This CMS system sounds like a good fit for you "IF" it ever gets through UL and they start selling it here in NA. You mentioned you'd like one of the portable saws though. I have the Rigid and it comes with a cart that has large wheels on it. Basically when the saw folds up, you can move it up and down steps like you would a hand truck. Just tossing that out for something else to consider if the CMS never works out for us over here. I'd image the Bosch with the gravity rise would be roughly the same. I hate Home Depot and really don't like to recommend their products to anyone, but they do have an excellent table saw. I've had mine for years and have abused the crap out of it. It just keeps going and going though. My TS55 gets 90% of the work now though, so the TS just gets stored away most of the time. Its nice to have for the odd time that I need it though.
This CMS system sounds like a good fit for you "IF" it ever gets through UL and they start selling it here in NA. You mentioned you'd like one of the portable saws though. I have the Rigid and it comes with a cart that has large wheels on it. Basically when the saw folds up, you can move it up and down steps like you would a hand truck. Just tossing that out for something else to consider if the CMS never works out for us over here. I'd image the Bosch with the gravity rise would be roughly the same. I hate Home Depot and really don't like to recommend their products to anyone, but they do have an excellent table saw. I've had mine for years and have abused the crap out of it. It just keeps going and going though. My TS55 gets 90% of the work now though, so the TS just gets stored away most of the time. Its nice to have for the odd time that I need it though.
Lou Miller
Member
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2007
- Messages
- 480
Eric Parham said:
Eric, I really think a lot of it has to do with with where you are. I've dealt with a few good inspectors, but the majority of them were just as Jim described. We actually had this one guy years ago that didn't care about anything. You'd pass any inspection with him if you gave him a $100 cup of coffee (a cup of coffee from the break truck with a $100 dollar bill wrapped around it, and then a napkin wrapped around that so nobody could see it). No coffee and you'd fail for whatever lame reason he could come up with.
Eric Parham said:
I did not have problems w/BI's for the most part. That was just a single instance with a BI who had developed a rep for making it tough for outsiders. I have had BI's tell some of my clients that they did not realy need to check my work. The inspections were simply the formality they had to go thru. i wish i had the time to build that sort of rep with my woodworking.
Tinker