Crown on a vault

[festool_SWFL]

Well folks with my deposit down on a new Kapex, I have aspirations of putting up crown on my vaulted ceilings.  Anyone out there have any thoughts or experience on setting crown and the transition between level and vault?  As a E.E. by degree (like I use it), I would love a formula that says take the slope of the ceiling and the angle of the corner and therefore set your bevel and mitre as such.  I realize that you must take into account the angle of the crown and a probable transition as the fact you are moving from one level to another would require such.  This is only my second post, so would appreciate your help. 

Thank y'all

William

 

[nickao]

I have a fantastic article on how to crown a vault. I will dig it out by Tuesday and post the link if someone does not beat me to it. I always thought crown  to look weird on a vaulted ceiling on the rake angle, but in this article it looks fantastic.

I have a link below that is really for regular ceilings, but its a good start. I may have to photo copy the article on the sloped cathedrals and post it that way. I use fig 19 in the following link to do my regular crown. The sample pieces always keep me in the game. Check it out.

Crown - How to - regular ceilings

Nickao

 

[festool_SWFL]

Thank you, I look forward to your article.  I know what you mean, that is why I think the transition corner is so important.

Thanks Nickao,

William

 

[nickao]

Yes, exactly. This guy has that transition piece down. I have seen it many ways, but I really liked how he did it. I am looking through my magazines now. It may take awhile I have years of them.

Nickao

 

[Tom the Remodeler]

My coworkers and I run across this about once a year, where you may have a shed roof extending out over, say, a doorway, and the customer wants crown to come down the roof line, across the face, and then back up the other side. I really wish I could give you a good formula, unfortunately all we've been able to come up with is patience and some moderate cursing. Now, that's for an outside corner, I wonder if an inside corner would be any easier? It's tough, particularly when you're transitioning in a corner, because you are changing direction in multiple dimensions, ie you are changing from, say, a 6-12 pitch to a level line, PLUS you're turning a 90 degree corner in the process...... I too would LOVE to see a straightforward solution to this nagging problem!

 

[nickao]

Tom I have it, I am going nuts trying to find it!

 

[nickao]

Here is one place to find the calculations, it is NOT the article I am referring to. Still looking. This is one solution, but it uses different width crowns to achieve. A little different look then I am trying to find. Also, it does not have the step by step pics that the other article has. This is more for the pure calculations.

nickao

Joe Fuscos Solution to crown on a sope

Here is the most comprehensive formulas if you really want to understand the trig and geometry behind the angle for all crown applications.

Comprehensive theory formulas for crown

 

[Tom the Remodeler]

Tom I have it, I am going nuts trying to find it!

Heh-heh, thanks Nick, I appreciate your looking this info up, I'm excited to see an efficient, repeatable way of doing this!  8)

 

[Mirko]

William,

Is this what your looking for?

Mirko

 

[nickao]

No from what I understand  he wants to crown up the slope, which requires a tricky little transition piece or two different widths crown. I have a neat  article on how its simply done and am still looking for it.

"The pie-shaped transition piece in the first picture changes the direction of the crown molding from horizontal to slope, and it also changes the plane of the molding. The cut on the right side of this transition is a normal 45 degree inside corner cut. But finding the angle for the left side, which is an outside corner, requires a little math." Gary katz

I do not love this method, its one way to do it. This is Gary Katz technique and the previous paragraph are his words.

Still looking for the original article I think is best for this, I'm giving up until tomorrow.

Nickao

Gary Katz method to crown cathedral ceilings.

 

[Warrior]

Gary Katz's method works like a charm. I've used it alot. The transitions look really nice too.

 

[Mirko]

Nickao,

Personally I hate it when crown runs off horizontal, and I will never do it.
What I did in this house was the only option, and I told my client that, she did not argue with me because she is a designer and knows better.

Mirko

 

[nickao]

Oh I love the way you did it!

I saw this guy do this crown up the rake and it was awesome. Before that I would never consider it.

I once did a room like in  your picture and the sparky's put halogen pink lighting on top of the crown. You could only see the lighting not the bulbs and that looked nice reflecting up off the ceiling.

Maybe if I find this article you will have a change of heart like I did.

Nickao

 

[Mirko]

Nickao,

I look forward to seeing it 8)

Mirko

 

[nickao]

For the life of me I can not remember the author or which magazine it was in. I did not see it on the internet, it may be on the net somewhere though. I'll find it sooner or later. Probably long after someone needs it of course.

 

[peter halle]

Good Morning All:

Possible sources of information - Fine Homebuilding issue 162 pages 140-142 Gary Katz way, and Fine Homebuilding issue 164 pages 8-10 - response to Gary's article but pointing out that it can be done without a transition piece if you maintain the same angle at the ceiling and cut away the excess material at the bottom rear of the crown.  I can't comment on if it works - never tried it.

I do have both issues.  I don't know about the legality of posting copies of the articles.

Peter

 

[nickao]

You know Peter I believe that may be to article I am referring too. I already linked to one site where Gary shows his technique. Please check that link Peter and see if it is the same as the info in the article. I believe the article was more in depth then the link I posted.

Nickao

 

[Michael Kellough]

... response to Gary's article but pointing out that it can be done without a transition piece if you maintain the same angle at the ceiling and cut away the excess material at the bottom rear of the crown.  I can't comment on if it works - never tried it.

I've never done this (never faced the need) either but I don't know why you would want or need a transition piece. Granted the angles involved are unusual and probably experimental but the transition looks like an interruption to me.

 

[nickao]

It's mathematical  Michael. The crown going up the rake has to be a differnt width for it to work without a transition piece. If you do not want to modify one piece of crown by ripping it or have access to the same crown in different widths then you need a transition piece.

If you ever get into it you will see as soon as you try cutting the pieces what is going on.

Like Mirko I always avoided the rake of a cathedral ceiling and ran the crown horizontal and painted the ceiling a lighter color. To me it looked better. But an article I read changed my mind.

Nickao

 

[Michael Kellough]

It's mathematical  Micheal. The crown going up the rake has to be a differnt width for it to work without a transition piece. If you do not want to modify one piece of crown by ripping it or have access to the same crown in different widths then you need a transition piece.

If you ever get into it you will see as soon as you try cutting the pieces what is going on.

Like Mirko I always avoided the rake of a cathedral ceiling and ran the crown horizontal and painted the ceiling a lighter color. To me it looked better. But an article I read changed my mind.

Nickao

Thanks Nick.