Festool Table Saw Survey

[SittingElf]

forget about that blade stopping crap that's for schools.

Well...that's a matter of opinion, isn't it.  I have a strong six-figure income that depends on me having full use of my fingers. The idea that only "students" need an effective safety feature like the  saw brake on SawStop's, is like saying that only student drivers need seat belts.

Safety is a critical issue and the reason that, at the minimum, riving knives are now mandatory for table saws. If you don't want the safety features, then fine, but don't disparage those who find maximum safety features to be a welcome addition to our hobby.  If I lost a finger due to a momentary lapse of concentration, I'd be out of an income, and wishing that there had been some kind of safety system that could have helped me avoid it. And... even WITH the brake system, one has to have his head in the game 100% of the time.

Even experienced woodworkers have accidents from momentary lapses. Here's a demonstration of what 'can' happen, though it is a re-creation but illuminating:

Tablesaw Kickback

 

[Kev]

forget about that blade stopping crap that's for schools.

Well...that's a matter of opinion, isn't it.  I have a strong six-figure income that depends on me having full use of my fingers. The idea that only "students" need an effective safety feature like the  saw brake on SawStop's, is like saying that only student drivers need seat belts.

Safety is a critical issue and the reason that, at the minimum, riving knives are now mandatory for table saws. If you don't want the safety features, then fine, but don't disparage those who find maximum safety features to be a welcome addition to our hobby.  If I lost a finger due to a momentary lapse of concentration, I'd be out of an income, and wishing that there had been some kind of safety system that could have helped me avoid it. And... even WITH the brake system, one has to have his head in the game 100% of the time.

Even experienced woodworkers have accidents from momentary lapses. Here's a demonstration of what 'can' happen, though it is a re-creation but illuminating:

Tablesaw Kickback

I have no respect for the guy in that video, almost throwing away his fingers to prove stupid equals stupid.

I have nothing against people buying extra safety - but lets face it, a saw-stop won't stop a piece of wood taking out your eye. Personally I think people should feel that table saws are extremely dangerous and should never be used in a mindset where you could have a lapse in concentration ...

 

[Birdhunter]

Thanks to those who filled me in on why a carpenter would need an on-site table saw, especially a solid table saw. I would guess a wobbly base and a less than accurate fence would be not only hard to use, but possibly dangerous.

A less than solid base and a rather rudimentary fence have, so far, kept me from buying a CMS router system. It's one of the few things they sell that I don't own.

 

[mastercabman]

forget about that blade stopping crap that's for schools.

Well...that's a matter of opinion, isn't it.  I have a strong six-figure income that depends on me having full use of my fingers. The idea that only "students" need an effective safety feature like the  saw brake on SawStop's, is like saying that only student drivers need seat belts.

Safety is a critical issue and the reason that, at the minimum, riving knives are now mandatory for table saws. If you don't want the safety features, then fine, but don't disparage those who find maximum safety features to be a welcome addition to our hobby.  If I lost a finger due to a momentary lapse of concentration, I'd be out of an income, and wishing that there had been some kind of safety system that could have helped me avoid it. And... even WITH the brake system, one has to have his head in the game 100% of the time.

Even experienced woodworkers have accidents from momentary lapses. Here's a demonstration of what 'can' happen, though it is a re-creation but illuminating:

Tablesaw Kickback

I have no respect for the guy in that video, almost throwing away his fingers to prove stupid equals stupid.

I have nothing against people buying extra safety - but lets face it, a saw-stop won't stop a piece of wood taking out your eye. Personally I think people should feel that table saws are extremely dangerous and should never be used in a mindset where you could have a lapse in concentration ...

I feel the same way
Also don't use push blocks    use push sticks      totally different!!!!  I still don't understand why people put their fingers/hands so close to a spinning blade.

 

[glass1]

I wear a seat belt to protect myself from crazy 6 figure drivers in their race cars ( just trying to make a funny). I hear you but creating a false sense of safety is also dangerous because no matter how safe it's still dangerous. Ever see a carpenter cut their fingers off with a skil saw or jig saw by holding underneath the board- I have. What's stopping me from nailing my fingers or feet to the ground with a nail gun. Have you ever had one of those momentary lapses swinging a hammer Ouch !  I guess if you make 6 figures would you please buy me a saw stop just asking.

 

[John Stevens]

I have nothing against people buying extra safety - but lets face it, a saw-stop won't stop a piece of wood taking out your eye.

Agreed.  Also, I'd like to see the results of "hot dog" tests in which a series hot dogs were pushed into the blades at various realistic speeds, right up to the speed that a hand would travel if the saw operator's hand slipped forward while pushing hard.  The tendons in the fingers and thumb are very close to the surface, and even a fairly shallow cut can sever them.  (Don't ask me how I know.)

It should be up to each individual to decide whether to pay a premium price for a safer saw, but this individual isn't persuaded that the cost:benefit is as favorable as it would have to be for me to pay the premium, given the existing alternatives.

Regards,

John

 

[Gene Howerton]

I also took the survey for table saw.  I went out and ought the Dewalt 745 for ripping after the review in "This is Carpentry" last year.  I then bought a CT 26 and the Shark Guard with the riving and guard with Dust extraction.  I really like this setup.  It's safe and collects about 99% of the dust, can't believe Festool could improve on that combo for the price.  I bought the saw on sale for $300 and I think $150 for the Shark Guard, this works great in my mostly Festool Shop and really saves time for just ripping boards.  I made a rolling stand for the saw that matches the height of the MFT for an out-feed table.  [big grin]

 

[tiralie]

So the question I'll pose here, what's wrong with the current offerings from the other manufacturers?  The way I see it is there are two major things wrong, poor overall quality and dust collection.

So what would I want from a Festool table saw??   

- A standalone unit, meaning you don't have to drop your track saw in.
- sturdy
- table min. width of 24", with a 30" fence
- At least 2000 watt motor
- At least 70 mm  at 90 degrees
- solid fence
- Dust collection - under table with optional overarm or table top attachment
- optional extension tables
- optional out-feed tables
- optional sliding table

Tim
 
         

 

[Anders K]

So the question I'll pose here, what's wrong with the current offerings from the other manufacturers?  The way I see it is there are two major things wrong, poor overall quality and dust collection.

So what would I want from a Festool table saw??   

- A standalone unit, meaning you don't have to drop your track saw in.
- sturdy
- table min. width of 24", with a 30" fence
- At least 2000 watt motor
- At least 70 mm  at 90 degrees
- solid fence
- Dust collection - under table with optional overarm or table top attachment
- optional extension tables
- optional out-feed tables
- optional sliding table

Tim
 
         

In other words, the Festool CS70  ;D

 

[tiralie]

So the question I'll pose here, what's wrong with the current offerings from the other manufacturers?  The way I see it is there are two major things wrong, poor overall quality and dust collection.

So what would I want from a Festool table saw??   

- A standalone unit, meaning you don't have to drop your track saw in.
- sturdy
- table min. width of 24", with a 30" fence
- At least 2000 watt motor
- At least 70 mm  at 90 degrees
- solid fence
- Dust collection - under table with optional overarm or table top attachment
- optional extension tables
- optional out-feed tables
- optional sliding table

Tim
 
         

In other words, the Festool CS70  ;D

[wink] Yes...or a Mafelle....after all is said and done, I have seen some of the best work done by guys on site with 20 year old Ridgid contractor saws.
They aren't "portable" but once set up they are solid.

 

[CarolinaNomad]

So the question I'll pose here, what's wrong with the current offerings from the other manufacturers?  The way I see it is there are two major things wrong, poor overall quality and dust collection.

So what would I want from a Festool table saw??   

- A standalone unit, meaning you don't have to drop your track saw in.
- sturdy
- table min. width of 24", with a 30" fence
- At least 2000 watt motor
- At least 70 mm  at 90 degrees
- solid fence
- Dust collection - under table with optional overarm or table top attachment
- optional extension tables
- optional out-feed tables
- optional sliding table

Tim
 
         

In other words, the Festool CS70  ;D

Exactly, I don't own a Festool CS 70, but what Brice and Tim described sounded like the CS70.

 

[sgryd]

Don't forget to add two miter channels for jigs. I have a really small shop and recently decided to get a small bench top saw. I have had the CS70 before but I thought it lacked in precision (and miter channels) due to it's portability.

I bought a Bosch GTS 10 XC. This a new version of the 4100 (at least here in Europe). They made the left side of the table sliding. I was stupid to buy it, but I think it was more stupid to design it that way because:
1. The two miter channels have different depth, i.e. harder to make jigs.
2. The sliding mechanism has some slop. The only way to get rid of the slop is to screw the sled down, duh.

On top of this Bosch has "invented" a proprietary format for the channels, so my Incra stuff wouldn't fit in the channels.

I sold the Bosch and ordered a Dewalt DW744XP. This saw has two rigid standardised miter channels.

//Michael

 

[alkaline]

[wink] Yes...or a Mafelle....after all is said and done, I have seen some of the best work done by guys on site with 20 year old Ridgid contractor saws.
They aren't "portable" but once set up they are solid.
[/quote]

...yes...it is...

 

[GPowers]

After watching the kickback video I order some Micro-jig splitters for my Ridgid table saw.  He might be crazy for making the video but it got me to do something, as I do not have the money to replace the Ridgid table saw with one that has a riving knife. The Micro Jig splitters are better then nothing.

 

[kev carpenter]

I used the cs50 for the first time today and is pretty perfect for my job and probably their target market in Germany. Weighs less than any other table saw on the market, smallest size when transporting, integral legs, quickest blade brake, one hand operated trigger, sliding blade, fine adjust fence. I have a vw. Transporter swb and didn't think I would get away with carrying a table saw in the van all the time but it takes up next to no space. Best saw on the market for finish joinery in domestic homes nothing comes close, mafell have a great range of saws but to big for me and the 60 didn't have integral legs and none has one handed operation, best suit big van and work out side, I think if they up date to 60 it could be a better saw but mafell seem to cater to a different market and their blade brake is to slow as they tend to use bigger motors.

 

[Vindingo]

No table saw here, but would probably only buy a SawStop when the time comes. 

I would also pick up a couple Grr-ripers, I haven't used them but they look far superior to push stick and regular old push blocks.

 

[Kev]

No table saw here, but would probably only buy a SawStop when the time comes. 

I would also pick up a couple Grr-ripers, I haven't used them but they look far superior to push stick and regular old push blocks.

The Grr-ripper looks interesting - curious what its like using it with a blade gauge & DC in place though.

 

[semenza]

haven't used Grippers for a table saw, but I have a pair that I use for my router table. They are excellent.

Seth