I need expert advice for small a project.

[MichaelW2014]

This seems to be going round in a circle and although the solution posed achieved what Michael originally said he wanted, and then didn't, and then did again, it isn't a French cleat, and I don't think it's what he actually wants. Maybe it's me that is misunderstanding all of the different posts from Michael and his enthusiasm for the jig Festoolviking presented, but how would it work?

[My emphasis in bold, red text]

In a french cleat system there are two parts. one that is point down and the second that is point up.
The one that is point up is screwed into the wall. let's say this is 4" long made out of a bar that was originally 4"x1"x1.25". this one is easily made on a table saw.
The second half of this french cleat I want to make is a groove cut out of the middle of a bar that is 30"x1"x1.25". So 5" of the middle of this bar will have a 45 degree groove cut out of it to engage with the 4" cleat that is on the wall. Making this part of the cleat system is difficult because the groove is in the middle of the bar, not along the entire bar and it is not starting at either end of the bar.

So how would the machined wood presented in Festoolviking's photos connect with the "point up" cleat screwed to the wall?  [scratch chin]

I think this is what you are referring to achieve as a "french cleat", see pic. There is two ways to do this, either you cut the piece at the table-saw at my pencil-line or you plunge the router deeper to get to the edge of the piece. The face of the piece facing to the left side is the "wall-side". Hope this make sense?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z217073hv6xdfdw/Photo%202014-01-06%2023%2041%2013.jpg

Festoolviking

Hey, how much space is between your copyring and the bit when installed in the copy ring? should i get a copyring that is as tight around the blade as possible or do i need a gap for dust removal? thanks again

The copy ring and bit i use got about 1mm (1/24") clearance. As for dust removal it doesn't matter how big gap you got since the Festool copy rings got holes that helps dust removal. If you want better dust removal I would reccomend getting a spiral bit (eg. 490946). I suggest getting a copy ring that suits your bits that you got. The rest is just maths to work out the distance from your jig to where you want the edge of the cleat. In my case it's pretty easy to eyeball the distance since it's only 1mm from my mark. Worth noting is that a smaller bit is easier to plunge and move around in your jig but takes more moving around to get all material off.

Festoolviking

Thanks again!

 

[GarryMartin]

I think this is what you are referring to achieve as a "french cleat", see pic. There is two ways to do this, either you cut the piece at the table-saw at my pencil-line or you plunge the router deeper to get to the edge of the piece. The face of the piece facing to the left side is the "wall-side". Hope this make sense?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z217073hv6xdfdw/Photo%202014-01-06%2023%2041%2013.jpg

Festoolviking

But if you look at the piece you have machined, this is the piece that Michael has said needs to be attached to the picture, with the "point up" cleat on the wall for it to attach to...

In a french cleat system there are two parts. one that is point down and the second that is point up.
The one that is point up is screwed into the wall. let's say this is 4" long made out of a bar that was originally 4"x1"x1.25". this one is easily made on a table saw.
The second half of this french cleat I want to make is a groove cut out of the middle of a bar that is 30"x1"x1.25". So 5" of the middle of this bar will have a 45 degree groove cut out of it to engage with the 4" cleat that is on the wall. Making this part of the cleat system is difficult because the groove is in the middle of the bar, not along the entire bar and it is not starting at either end of the bar.

I just can't visualise how it would work, but if it has solved Michael's problem then I'm happy for him and commend you Festoolviking for the time and effort you've put into your response. Awesome.  [not worthy]

 

[bkharman]

Flip That board end over end. The the pointy bit it at the top against the wall and the small (presumably triangular) blocks would be on the wall.

I think I finally got it. Seems like a lot of work to me for the effort. I think 2 pieces of square stock (1 on the back of the painting and one on the wall) using a few dominos is the quickest and easiest method. It will look nice as well.

Let us know what you end up doing.

Bryan.

 

[MichaelW2014]

Flip That board end over end. The the pointy bit it at the top against the wall and the small (presumably triangular) blocks would be on the wall.

I think I finally got it. Seems like a lot of work to me for the effort. I think 2 pieces of square stock (1 on the back of the painting and one on the wall) using a few dominos is the quickest and easiest method. It will look nice as well.

Let us know what you end up doing.

Bryan.

I will post a pic sometime in the future of my first painting panel that has integrated cleat spaces in the top bar. it seems like a lot of work in comparison to what you say, but, once i have the jig made it will be very quick and easy. thanks again for your effort

 

[Acrobat]

The pic where the cabinet has a piece below it mates to has the pecs facing the wrong way as the cabinet would simply slide down and off and not hold at all.
My suggestion is to put your length of timber (thats is eventually going on the back of your paintings - which then rests on the wall cleat), is to angle the timber at 45 degrees, make a pass to final depth with a straight bit in the router, use simple stop blocks to set width of cutout,  chisel out the two ends - (removing the rounded bit form the router cut) with a chisel.
That, or again clamp timber at 45 degrees, use you hand saw to make a series of cuts all along and remove them with hammer and chisel, rasp/file down any high spots.

I hope I am following what you wish to do?

A third way is to plane at 45 the entire length and glue/domino blocks of new ends to cover the left and right sides so the chamfer doesn't show.

 

[rljatl]

I have not read through the whole thread, but if you only have a few to make...

Use a dovetail saw to cut each end of the "cleat" area.  Use Fret saw to make the long part of the cut.  Then clean it up with a chisel.

Watch the video. Fast forward to 4:30

Knew Concepts Woodworker's Aluminum Fretsaw

 

[MichaelW2014]

Hello. I still haven't made the jig. Amazingly, I cannot find a table saw to use in greece to cut the pieces. I am buying a table saw, CS70, in the next couple of weeks so once I get it then i will make this jig. It is a really great solution, as far as i can tell. I will try to remember to update this thread once i get going.

 

[Roseland]

Could you not just rout it with a dovetail cutter and an edge fence?

Andrew