Kapex Kickback

[glass1]

When I said I had issues with Kapex and kickback I did not mean binding. Yes binding can lead to kickback. I agree binding is often operator  error too fast too much cut etc. It can be caused buy out of alignment tables and fences etc... Or by cupped and warped boards or boards just under tension. I found the kapex no different in this regard. The kickback I saw was the Kapex (for me) tended to, more often than other saws send small pieces flying. Like when one is cutting off the the miter to make trim return onto itself or cutting off a small piece.

 

[Jaybolishes]

If using a saw stand, I'd check to make sure the supports on the stand aren't higher then the bed of the saw.  This has been mentioned but really a good thing to look into.  Using a dewalt slider and now my axial, I never have to wait for the saw to speed up, nor do I ever wait for the blade to stop before lifting the saw head.  Call it dangerous, but I've never had an issue and I'd be very annoyed if I had to wait.  I really want to know if its the saw or what, it would be awful if festool was getting a bad rap from user error, which I'm not saying is the case here, but would be unfortunate.  I have heard many complaints of kickback on the axial I have, and I can attest its all hogwash, at least with mine.

 

[blackemmons]

I have eliminated the "small pieces flying" thing with the zero clearance fence and base plate.  Without the zero clearance fence, it was terror when cutting off small pieces.

Does anyone know if the tooth grind on Festool blades is  different than everyone else causing more flying pieces and kickback?

JimE

 

[Brice Burrell]

I have eliminated the "small pieces flying" thing with the zero clearance fence and base plate.  Without the zero clearance fence, it was terror when cutting off small pieces.

Does anyone know if the tooth grind on Festool blades is  different than everyone else causing more flying pieces and kickback?

JimE

No, I don't think that's it.  I suspect it's the suction from the dust collection pulling the cutoff into the blade.  I think waiting for the blade to come to a complete stop before lifting the saw head is  a greatly overblown safety technique and doesn't really prevent flowing offcuts....  I have no idea why you should be experiencing some much trouble with kickback if you're sure you've ruled out all the usual culprits.

 

[skids]

I have eliminated the "small pieces flying" thing with the zero clearance fence and base plate.  Without the zero clearance fence, it was terror when cutting off small pieces.

Does anyone know if the tooth grind on Festool blades is  different than everyone else causing more flying pieces and kickback?

JimE

Although I don't get a ton of pieces flying off to the point it makes me question the saw, I should be able to offer some insight into this question soon. I ordered a new blade which has an ATAF tooth configuration, not ATB like the Festool. I will let you know if I notice a difference, although it won't be apples to apples since the new blade is 80T.

Personally I think people get a little overly excited over the Festool 60t blade that comes on the saw. While it's certainly not a bad blade, it's done nothing to make me think it's the end all. It's a general purpose blade and IMO leans more towards rougher work than fine work, and if you want it to be for finer work, a ZCI and Aux Fence is mandatory.

I have owned some really nice aftermarket blade and see the difference a nice blade can make when designed for a task. I like the Festool blade, but if this new blade performs well for finish work, its likely to see nothing more than rough work. Like the deck I have coming up. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

I will try and check back and let you know what I think of my new blade in comparison.

 

[Ta2ude]

When I said I had issues with Kapex and kickback I did not mean binding. Yes binding can lead to kickback. I agree binding is often operator  error too fast too much cut etc. It can be caused buy out of alignment tables and fences etc... Or by cupped and warped boards or boards just under tension. I found the kapex no different in this regard. The kickback I saw was the Kapex (for me) tended to, more often than other saws send small pieces flying. Like when one is cutting off the the miter to make trim return onto itself or cutting off a small piece.

I haven't had my Kapex very long but I was installing a floor on a 45 last week and found that if I had to cut a small piece off the end in the 1/4 to 1 inch size the blade gaurd had a tendancy to catch on the cut off piece and lift it or bind a bit. I only noticed it when cutting on an angle no problem doing straight cuts.

 

[Captainwrinkles]

Sorry for posting on an old thread but here goes,

My Kapex has been giving me kickback since the day i bought it almost exactly 4 years ago. I didnt think too
much of it back then, as i was only using it to cut 2x4's for framing a basement. I also thought that it was just my use of the saw that made it kickback.
I was using it last summer to cut more 2x4's and got kickback everytime again. Same thing. i thought it was just me. I use chop saws on a daily basis (mostly dewalt, makita and hitachi)
and never have kickback everytime.

After reading this thread a while ago, it got me thinking, maybe its not me. Maybe its the saw?!

So i went and measured the fence and bed of my Kapex this evening. I know I know. i should have done this 4 years ago, but because i dont use
it very often if at all (it looks brand new) I just assumed it was me. Anyway....the fence AND base of my Kapex are both concave, Which would explain all the kickback im getting.

I laid a straight edge along the fence and used feeler gauges to measure the gap in the middle. The gap works out to 0.3 millimeters.
It might not seem like a lot. But when i placed the straight edge along the Base of the Kapex, There is a 0.7mm gap in the middle. So im thinking that
between those 2 discrepancies it works out to a blade binding amount and its not me after all.

So i ask, What should i do about this before i get injured? Do i send it in for repair at my expence or is there a
way to adjust the fence and base to get them both perfectly straight?

Benn

 

[cplif]

Find a GOOD sharpening company, with somebody you can talk to in the shop, and talk to him. Tell him precisely about your problem(s) and the type of stock you are cutting, he should react immediately, asking for more detail (humidity etc.) If he's worth his pants he'll sharpen your blade to slightly different specs for you to try. Write down ALL observations, even things like dust and blade gumming, and go back to him until you get satisfied.
We have been doing this for over 30 years now, from carbon steel blades to drill bits, and for cutting a wide range of materials. The most difficult part is finding a sharpening company that you can communicate with, we had to "social engineer" the last one out from our tool supplier after our precedent guy retired.

With the current tools at their disposal, they actually see stress and usure points on a tooth or blade, as well as adapting your edge to the type of work you do, though several different blades may be necessary for different jobs. Our man here has German blades of very high quality for the KAPEX at about 85 euros.

 

[toolpouchguy]

wow wish i would have read this before i bought my kapax ,i have already returned one very disappointed with its quality,turned the base and it would grind from new
and the kick back was very dangerous ,as i cut lots of small returns the thing can break a window
i have a new one afraid to use it so i am using my dewalt , just want it gone but its been 40 days but a week with the new one

i would love to return it for a refund and get a better quality saw ,has me on pins and needles when i use it ,that has never happened with any other saw
they have a ways to go to make it a great saw,

i was told to put a sub fence on ,i should not have to do this ,

 

[skids]

wow wish i would have read this before i bought my kapax ,i have already returned one very disappointed with its quality,turned the base and it would grind from new
and the kick back was very dangerous ,as i cut lots of small returns the thing can break a window
i have a new one afraid to use it so i am using my dewalt , just want it gone but its been 40 days but a week with the new one

i would love to return it for a refund and get a better quality saw ,has me on pins and needles when i use it ,that has never happened with any other saw
they have a ways to go to make it a great saw,

i was told to put a sub fence on ,i should not have to do this ,

I don't have this problem anymore . Not sure it's the new blade added or the zci I put in the throat. Those two things combined seemed to have resolved any potential. I don't get a ton of kickback however, not anymore than any other saw I've owned.

Something doesn't sound right here. Occasionally I over analyze the way the kapex functions and wonder if the way the blades stops has something to do with how it flings moldings. It's seems like a gear driven stop and seems less fluid than some other saws. Like a more abrupt stop.

 

[Paul G]

wow wish i would have read this before i bought my kapax ,i have already returned one very disappointed with its quality,turned the base and it would grind from new
and the kick back was very dangerous ,as i cut lots of small returns the thing can break a window
i have a new one afraid to use it so i am using my dewalt , just want it gone but its been 40 days but a week with the new one

i would love to return it for a refund and get a better quality saw ,has me on pins and needles when i use it ,that has never happened with any other saw
they have a ways to go to make it a great saw,

i was told to put a sub fence on ,i should not have to do this ,

I don't have this problem anymore . Not sure it's the new blade added or the zci I put in the throat. Those two things combined seemed to have resolved any potential. I don't get a ton of kickback however, not anymore than any other saw I've owned.

Something doesn't sound right here. Occasionally I over analyze the way the kapex functions and wonder if the way the blades stops has something to do with how it flings moldings. It's seems like a gear driven stop and seems less fluid than some other saws. Like a more abrupt stop.

zci in the throat??? Drawing a blank here??

 

[Brice Burrell]

wow wish i would have read this before i bought my kapax ,i have already returned one very disappointed with its quality,turned the base and it would grind from new
and the kick back was very dangerous ,as i cut lots of small returns the thing can break a window
i have a new one afraid to use it so i am using my dewalt , just want it gone but its been 40 days but a week with the new one

i would love to return it for a refund and get a better quality saw ,has me on pins and needles when i use it ,that has never happened with any other saw
they have a ways to go to make it a great saw,

i was told to put a sub fence on ,i should not have to do this ,

I think you should call Festool and see if they will extend the return period, if the saw is still new they about work with you on this.

 

[skids]

wow wish i would have read this before i bought my kapax ,i have already returned one very disappointed with its quality,turned the base and it would grind from new
and the kick back was very dangerous ,as i cut lots of small returns the thing can break a window
i have a new one afraid to use it so i am using my dewalt , just want it gone but its been 40 days but a week with the new one

i would love to return it for a refund and get a better quality saw ,has me on pins and needles when i use it ,that has never happened with any other saw
they have a ways to go to make it a great saw,

i was told to put a sub fence on ,i should not have to do this ,

I don't have this problem anymore . Not sure it's the new blade added or the zci I put in the throat. Those two things combined seemed to have resolved any potential. I don't get a ton of kickback however, not anymore than any other saw I've owned.

Something doesn't sound right here. Occasionally I over analyze the way the kapex functions and wonder if the way the blades stops has something to do with how it flings moldings. It's seems like a gear driven stop and seems less fluid than some other saws. Like a more abrupt stop.

zci in the throat??? Drawing a blank here??

Zero clearance insert replaces the throat plate. Or whatever that thingy is

 

[semenza]

zci in the throat??? Drawing a blank here??

Sounds like something that makes it impossible to swallow  [laughing]    New type of diet device , maybe  [blink]

Seth

 

[sean_hogan]

I had the same problem, festool sent me out a new rear fence, problem solved, I also think the kapex lacks power and bogs down and that causes kickback also, kapex is a good saw but I wouldn't say it's all it's cracked up too be, just my honest opinion , had mine a year and a half and use it daily

 

[barnowl]

Just last in line, and a comment...

While I think the kapex is a great saw, I've never been pleased with the stock blade.

I finally bit the bullet and had my Forrest Chopmaster blade sharpened and re bored for the Kapex,

and WOW!!!.... like night and day.

I had forgotten how great it really is.

The cuts in maple look like they were sanded with 220 grit sandpaper.

The Chopmaster will be used for fine cuts, the stock blade will be used for rough work.

 

[skids]

Just last in line, and a comment...

While I think the kapex is a great saw, I've never been pleased with the stock blade.

I finally bit the bullet and had my Forrest Chopmaster blade sharpened and re bored for the Kapex,

and WOW!!!.... like night and day.

I had forgotten how great it really is.

The cuts in maple look like they were sanded with 220 grit sandpaper.

The Chopmaster will be used for fine cuts, the stock blade will be used for rough work.

Agreed I never liked the stock blade either. I put a Tenyru on it and never looked back. Very pleased with the performance

 

[sean_hogan]

What tenryu blade did you go for ? Does anyone in the uk know any suppliers over this side of the pond ?

 

[CumminsDiesel]

And how it works with the Festool Fine 80-Tooth Saw Blade?

 

[josephgewing]

I had some trouble with kick back and also, even worse, some burning on one side of the cut.  I used a straight edge to check the fence and the bed of the saw and found them to be "flat" - at least as far as I could tell.  I was at my wits end.

Then I loosened the mounting bolts and, viola, problems solved.

I assume that the mounting bolts were too tight and the force twisted, tweaked, warped, bent - whatever -  the saw just enough to make bad geometry and bad cuts.

Just a thought,

Joe