Kapex miter table hard to turn or Scraping?

[ccmviking]

Spike,

    I know they won't leave us hanging (for too long).  I've already done as Festool advised and it just didn't work for me.  It might for others.  I get my replacement today.  I really don't think they know yet what the issue is, or don't have a real fix in the pipe yet.  I feel the cam plate replacement is a stop gap.  They work great and then that happens.  Rick C's note says they changed it because " Festool was concerned that the miter lock would be too loose on some saws ".  huh?  You don't go and make manufacturing changes because you think something "would" be an issue.  You change because something "is" an issue and you have data to back it up.  Has someone had any luck finding issues people had across the pond?  There certainly must have been something that caused a change to this part.  Things aren't usually out of tolerance.  They are designed and manufactured within certain spec's.  Festool can manufacture within a .001-.002 tolerance all day long.  Something is changing on the saws during use.  What is it? 

Chris...

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Good Morning,
This is clearly an issue of concern, and it would be to everyone's advantage to get an official word on this, i.e., something from Festool.

The Kapex is a major new tool release, so I assume Festool is interested in communicating with customers about it.  Well, this is the time and place to do so!  How about it: is someone from Festool listening?

In the meantime, anyone experiencing this issue should report it here.  Also, please report the conditions in which you see the problem (particular usage, temperature, how long the saw was used before this problem arose, etc).

Stay in touch,
Matthew

PS: I do not own a Kapex, so I cannot report either way about the issue.  My only concern is making sure there is an explanation, and a resolution.

 

[Michael Kellough]

Just a reminder that the official word is that you should report a problem with a new tool to your dealer and/or Festool right away before making any modifications.

After that, this is a great place to post your experiences and the conditions when issues occurred.

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Just a reminder that the official word is that you should report a problem with a new tool to your dealer and/or Festool right away before making any modifications.

After that, this is a great place to post your experiences and the conditions when issues occurred.

Just to be clear: when I said, "official word," I meant an explanation from Festool and their position on this issue.  No one should suggest making modifications to a power tool without technical knowledge from Festool.  Hence, the need for the official word from the company!

If Festool has been helping people through service calls, it would benefit all of us if they shared with the forum what they are telling people to do.  Tht way, they reach more people.

Stay in touch,
Matthew

 

[tallgrass]

this problem has been brought up in web forums in Australia and else ware. it seems to be a fault not unique to the USA.

 

[honeydoman]

I had posted a post about my post being deleted and removed bucause of my comment.  that WAS MY ERROR.  for those of you few who saw it before I realized it was my mistake, I apoligize.  I had posted a comment in another thread about the kapex, and thought  it was in this thread and had been deleted.  my fault!

sorry for the error.  I will not make another mistake again, just will make the cabinet smaller if I cut it short!

 

[hamsey]

I just received a call from the Festool rep. He said that it's a 10 min. fix. He will be replacing a plate that is out of tolerance and will sand down any burrs on the miter scale on Monday. Hopefully this fixes the problem.

Anybody have this done yet? Did it work?

Norm

 

[Brice Burrell]

I just received a call from the Festool rep. He said that it's a 10 min. fix. He will be replacing a plate that is out of tolerance and will sand down any burrs on the miter scale on Monday. Hopefully this fixes the problem.

Anybody have this done yet? Did it work?

Norm

Norm, the OP tried that fix and it didn't work for him, let us know how it works for you.

 

[Brice Burrell]

This morning my saw is getting worse, it appears to be an issue with the clamping tab, the part that Chris removed the powder coating from. Here's a picture of the of the spring plate, you can see some wear but not much on the end of plate.
[attachthumb=#]

Here's a pic of the miter scale, the top is wearing.
[attachthumb=#]

 

[monte]

Just out of curiostiy, as a temporary fix in the meantime.......has anyone with these issues tried some dry lube on the rubbing surfaces?

such as this.....http://www.aerotechdesigns.com/whitelightninglube.htm

 

[hamsey]

Brice,

Thanks for pointing that out for me. I know I read it at some point just didn't remember the outcome. Same thing is happening to my saw in picture 2. I am going to call the Festool rep. and tell him to swap out saws instead of the plates.

Norm

 

[Brice Burrell]

Just out of curiostiy, as a temporary fix in the meantime.......has anyone with these issues tried some dry lube on the rubbing surfaces?

such as this.....http://www.aerotechdesigns.com/whitelightninglube.htm

Roger, lube isn't recommended because the parts that are scraping are the same parts that lock the miter, lube could cause the miter setting to slip during use.

 

[Tinker]

I do not have a Kapex, nor have i had a chance to look one ver other than a very short fooling around with John Lucas's saw on Sunday.  As I have been reading thru all of the above posts, the only clue i can come up with (as I said, I have no experience with the saw) is the possibility that humidity is causing the Nylatron to swell. 

I have been to Germany several times. My wife and i usually go there during my slow time in mid summer.  Last week in July to second or third week in august.  It has been real hot there at times, but no matter how hot it has been, i have never been bothered by humidity.  In my experience, it sure does not get as humid there as it does here in Connecticut. 

My question is: Is Festool checking out this problem only from their factory in Stuttgart.  Stuttgart is very close the the area where I have visited.  Maybe they should try it out up around Hamburg or Frankfort, some place closer to the ocean where maybe it does get humid.  Or bring their testing over here.

Just a question.  Not considering it to be a solution.

Tinker

 

[rnt80]

I just replaced the spring plate on mine and I still have scraping although the movement isn't as coarse.  There was a lot of wear on the end of the spring plate, the picture doesn't really do it justice.  Brice, I have some wear on the scale as well although I don't think it's as bad as yours.  When I look underneath the saw at the new spring plate I don't see any clearance.  I don't know how this new plate will be any different from the old one.

 

[hamsey]

Just got off the phone with John the Festool rep. He insists the new plate will solve the problem. He said it has to do with the bend in the plate. We shall see Monday. Hopefully, it does not get stuck over the weekend.

Norm

 

[rnt80]

Just got off the phone with John the Festool rep. He insists the new plate will solve the problem. He said it has to do with the bend in the plate. We shall see Monday. Hopefully, it does not get stuck over the weekend.

Norm

He can insist away all he wants.  The new plate didn't completely solve the problem on my saw.  I forgot to extend kudos to Festool for overnighting the plate to me.  It was my first opportunity to experience customer service throught Festool and they shined.

 

[Brice Burrell]

Just got off the phone with John the Festool rep. He insists the new plate will solve the problem. He said it has to do with the bend in the plate. We shall see Monday. Hopefully, it does not get stuck over the weekend.

Norm

He can insist away all he wants.  The new plate didn't completely solve the problem on my saw.  I forgot to extend kudos to Festool for overnighting the plate to me.  It was my first opportunity to experience customer service throught Festool and they shined.

This brings up another question, why doesn't this fix work on every saw? Do you reach a point of no return after X amount of use with the "bad" spring plate?

 

[greg mann]

I have refrained from posting on this because I felt I had nothing to add that wasn't pure speculation. Having said that, I am now going to engage in speculation. I do not think this is a design flaw. I think it is the result of unanticipated variability in a component. If it is the spring plate, and most evidence points in that direction, it could be caused from something as simple as a batch of plates placed upside down in a heat treat funace. Perhaps there is an instruction in the manufacturing process that was not followed. Perhaps there was no instruction to orient parts a certain way and this batch happens to the first ones done differently since day one, and now it is manifesting itself as a problem. Perhaps the problem doesn't occur until these same plates have been flexed a number of times and they begin to change shape. Perhaps none of these things have a darn thing to do with the real problem and it is yet undiscovered. Please notice that I used the word perhaps a lot because this is speculation.

I think the most important issues are how Festool solves the problem and how we decide, as a group, we want to be part of that solution. The evidence exists that they want to solve it quickly and with as little inconvenience for us as possible. I think we should concentrate on communicating as clearly as possible what we have done, what has worked, what has failed, ant the circumstances under which it has failed. Festool can then distill all of the information we can provide and get to the bottom of it.

 

[Michael Kellough]

I do not have a Kapex, nor have i had a chance to look one ver other than a very short fooling around with John Lucas's saw on Sunday.  As I have been reading thru all of the above posts, the only clue i can come up with (as I said, I have no experience with the saw) is the possibility that humidity is causing the Nylatron to swell. 

I have been to Germany several times. My wife and i usually go there during my slow time in mid summer.  Last week in July to second or third week in august.  It has been real hot there at times, but no matter how hot it has been, i have never been bothered by humidity.  In my experience, it sure does not get as humid there as it does here in Connecticut. 

My question is: Is Festool checking out this problem only from their factory in Stuttgart.  Stuttgart is very close the the area where I have visited.  Maybe they should try it out up around Hamburg or Frankfort, some place closer to the ocean where maybe it does get humid.  Or bring their testing over here.

Just a question.  Not considering it to be a solution.

Tinker

Tinker it was me that suggested something like nylatron could cause such an intermittent loss of clearance in the miter table, if it is indeed related to climate.

However, that is pure speculation on my part. I have no idea if there is any nylatron anywhere in the Kapex.

 

[Michael Kellough]

Just got off the phone with John the Festool rep. He insists the new plate will solve the problem. He said it has to do with the bend in the plate. We shall see Monday. Hopefully, it does not get stuck over the weekend.

Norm

He can insist away all he wants.  The new plate didn't completely solve the problem on my saw.  I forgot to extend kudos to Festool for overnighting the plate to me.  It was my first opportunity to experience customer service throught Festool and they shined.

This brings up another question, why doesn't this fix work on every saw? Do you reach a point of no return after X amount of use with the "bad" spring plate?

So, the spring plate is stamped and presumably heat treated.
To maintain the proper clearance the plate needs to be the right thickness to start with.
The roller groove needs to be the right depth and or the right depth in relation to the surface of the plate.
The stamping process should not bend the plate or should bend it consistently.
The heat treating should not distort the plate or should do so in a consistent way as Greg pointed out.

Finally, there needs to be a foolproof test to determine if the part meets specs since there is no machining involved to ensure that it is a certain size.

If you can't make it perfect make it adjustable, is what I was taught.