What is the size of the holes and also the spacing of them in the rails for the LR32 system? My brother-in-law has a bridgport mill and I'm thinking of taking my 1400mm rail down at Christmas time and have him drill the holes to make my own rail. I don't have any reason to purchase another rail solely for the LR32 system, so I figure I might as well save a couple bucks. Is there any other difference in the rails than just the holes?
Question about rails for LR32 system
- Thread starter Sparky977
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Notorious T.O.D.
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I don't have it in front of me at the moment, but one thing is that the holes are not round but oval shaped. I guess if it is designed to make holes which work with the 32mm systems then the center to center distance of the holes must be 32mm. I would have to look at mine and measure the distance from the end to the center of the first oval hole as that is part of using the hole system with the end stops, if you intend to use it as Festool designed it to be used... I think they, Festool, have anticipated people doing this and therefore made the holes other than round to make it more trouble than it is worth....
So, I went down to the shop and measured the distance from the end of the track to the center of the end most holes and I come up with 12mm. I am very interested in this hole drilling system but it seems kind of expensive in some respects. Anyone use one enough to compare it to other jigs and methods of getting the same row of holes...inquiring minds want to know???
Best,
Notorious T.O.D. 8)
So, I went down to the shop and measured the distance from the end of the track to the center of the end most holes and I come up with 12mm. I am very interested in this hole drilling system but it seems kind of expensive in some respects. Anyone use one enough to compare it to other jigs and methods of getting the same row of holes...inquiring minds want to know???
Best,
Notorious T.O.D. 8)
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i have the 2 short ones and the 95" one also. I have used alot of systems including rockler temp with the drill bit deal. works okay. then the american eagle one with a plunge routher and ring temp.
worked fine.
then when I bought the festool. it blows them all away. I use it to make about 35-45 bookcase units a year and it is well worth it. again it is well worth it.
saves time very accurate.
well worth the investment as a professional carpenter.
worked fine.
then when I bought the festool. it blows them all away. I use it to make about 35-45 bookcase units a year and it is well worth it. again it is well worth it.
saves time very accurate.
well worth the investment as a professional carpenter.
Dave Ronyak
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Notorious,
I cannot supply the comparison you may be interested in, but I can state that the LR 32 used with Festool's hole drilling set can be used to make long rows of dead on holes. I used my short LR 32 rail, 1400 router, Festool 5 mm brad point bit to drill 5 rows on each side of a large (about 26" deep X 36" wide X 7 ft tall) shop storage cabinet so that I could install heavy duty full extension drawere slides at nearly any level within the cabinet. Each side of the cabinet had 5 rows of holes. All had to be dead on with one another, and with those on the other side of the cabinet, so that I could insert shelf support screws through all of the holes in the shelf supports. This was my first use of the LR 32 and Hole Drilling jig. I did not use the end alignment pieces of the jig. I used one of the slides to set the spacing of the rows of holes relative to the back edges of the cabinet sides, and an 18" Woodpeckers precision aluminum square referenced off the back edges of the sides of the cabinet to ensure the drawer slides would be horizontal when mounted. To my surprise, everything went together quite well, and all of the holes were aligned as intended. I made 5 heavy duty "drawers" and installed them inserting a screw in every hole provided in the slides (5 holes per slide). The drawers/slides work quite well. I don't think I could ever have done this as easily or accurately without the LR 32 and Hole Drilling jig. Because my LR 32 Guide Rail was much shorter than my work pieces, I had to "walk" the LR 32 Rail along the workpieces being drilled. This was fairly easy to do by attaching a non-holed Guide Rail to one or both ends of the LR 32, and using pencil marks and my router with 5 mm bit installed as a locating pin.
Recently I completed a pair of double bookcases with adjustable shelves. Each bookcase had 8 rows of shelve pin holes which again had to be aligned with one another. I used the large precision square to draw a line perpendicular to one of either the front or back edge of the bookshelf standards. I use that pencil line as my reference when lining up (in what will eventually be the elevation or vertical direction of the shelf standards) the LR 32. The centerline of the indexing holes of the LR 32 align in elevation with the centerline of the holes drilled by the router in the hole drilling slide jig. It is actually very easy to do using only your eyeballs.
Dave R.
I cannot supply the comparison you may be interested in, but I can state that the LR 32 used with Festool's hole drilling set can be used to make long rows of dead on holes. I used my short LR 32 rail, 1400 router, Festool 5 mm brad point bit to drill 5 rows on each side of a large (about 26" deep X 36" wide X 7 ft tall) shop storage cabinet so that I could install heavy duty full extension drawere slides at nearly any level within the cabinet. Each side of the cabinet had 5 rows of holes. All had to be dead on with one another, and with those on the other side of the cabinet, so that I could insert shelf support screws through all of the holes in the shelf supports. This was my first use of the LR 32 and Hole Drilling jig. I did not use the end alignment pieces of the jig. I used one of the slides to set the spacing of the rows of holes relative to the back edges of the cabinet sides, and an 18" Woodpeckers precision aluminum square referenced off the back edges of the sides of the cabinet to ensure the drawer slides would be horizontal when mounted. To my surprise, everything went together quite well, and all of the holes were aligned as intended. I made 5 heavy duty "drawers" and installed them inserting a screw in every hole provided in the slides (5 holes per slide). The drawers/slides work quite well. I don't think I could ever have done this as easily or accurately without the LR 32 and Hole Drilling jig. Because my LR 32 Guide Rail was much shorter than my work pieces, I had to "walk" the LR 32 Rail along the workpieces being drilled. This was fairly easy to do by attaching a non-holed Guide Rail to one or both ends of the LR 32, and using pencil marks and my router with 5 mm bit installed as a locating pin.
Recently I completed a pair of double bookcases with adjustable shelves. Each bookcase had 8 rows of shelve pin holes which again had to be aligned with one another. I used the large precision square to draw a line perpendicular to one of either the front or back edge of the bookshelf standards. I use that pencil line as my reference when lining up (in what will eventually be the elevation or vertical direction of the shelf standards) the LR 32. The centerline of the indexing holes of the LR 32 align in elevation with the centerline of the holes drilled by the router in the hole drilling slide jig. It is actually very easy to do using only your eyeballs.
Dave R.
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i know you are looking to save some money. are you a professional that will be using this alot? or just now and then?
the time it will take for your person to line up each hole the exact distance apart and from end to end, because you have to flip it and line up the other side.... would take a long time to do etc plus your time helping.
you can buy the long rail for 250 I think or get 1 short one with the kit. but if you will be doing this a lot for years to come invest the bucks and get it over with.
when I here stuff like this.... it reminds me of contractors bitching that someone thought their price was to high and went with someone lower and afterwards which they had not because they did not get value. and also could not understand why.... yet they turn around and do the same thing when buying something. I agree everybody wants value for their dollar.... not knocking your machinist friend accuracy but the set up and time I think would cost more than just buying one.... buy one and enjoy thanksgiving.
the time it will take for your person to line up each hole the exact distance apart and from end to end, because you have to flip it and line up the other side.... would take a long time to do etc plus your time helping.
you can buy the long rail for 250 I think or get 1 short one with the kit. but if you will be doing this a lot for years to come invest the bucks and get it over with.
when I here stuff like this.... it reminds me of contractors bitching that someone thought their price was to high and went with someone lower and afterwards which they had not because they did not get value. and also could not understand why.... yet they turn around and do the same thing when buying something. I agree everybody wants value for their dollar.... not knocking your machinist friend accuracy but the set up and time I think would cost more than just buying one.... buy one and enjoy thanksgiving.
honeydokreg said:
I have no problem spending money. That's part of the issue. I've exceeded my budget way too far already. ;D
The machinist is my brother-in-law, and he is very accurate with stuff like this. I was thinking it was just regular sized holes so it would be pretty straight forward. I'm guessing the "oval" shape to them is to help with the registration pin dropping into it easier?
Notorious T.O.D.
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Well, it sounds like it works really well from the feedback. I guess I will have to add it to my list of things to get... Another question, do you use the setup rods and stops included in the kit or is it enough to just have the track with holes, the router baseplate for indexing and the proper cutter? I could buy the base for about $100 but the kit with everything is about $400. That is a big difference. I'll have to check and see if the short track comes with the set as I thought it had to be purchased separately. Sometimes Festool includes things with the accessories that they don't list in the catalog it seems. Thanks for the feedback.
Best,
Notorious T.O.D. 8)
Best,
Notorious T.O.D. 8)
Notorious T.O.D.
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Sparky977 said:
If you look at the pictures in this presentation you will see the oval hole shape. It also looks like the track rails are not included in the sets and must be purchased separately. I guess I made the right choice in buying my first rail with the holes...
http://www.festoolusa.com/media/pdf/lr32_tutorial.pdf
Best,
Notorious T.O.D.
Dave Ronyak
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Notorious T.O.D. said:
Notorious,
I use the "setup rods" aka Side Stops frequently even when not using the Hole Drilling set, for setting up a Guide Rail for repeat rip cuts using my TS 55. I purchased a pair of 36" long 5/8" diameter oak dowel rods, sanded a flat on one end of each of them so they will fit into the Festool stops that fit onto any Festool Guide Rail, and made a couple of adjustable wooden stops to fit these dowels. I purchased an extra pair of the Festool stops that fit the Guide Rails and inserted these shopmade rods and stops for the calibrated hexagonal aluminum rods that come with the Side Stops when I need to make repeat ripcuts of equal width. You could substitute these shopmade rods and stops for the calibrated hexagonal aluminum rods that come with the Side Stops whenever you need to make repeat ripcuts of equal width. I find this approach much more reliable for me than using pencil marks and razor blades to set the Guide Rails for repeat ripcuts. I am very happy with the LR 32 and Hole Dirlling system from Festool, even though I rarely use it exactly as intended by Festool.
Dave R.
Notorious T.O.D.
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Dave,
Thanks for the info on how you use the pieces to add to the functionality of the system and components. Do you have a MFT/3 with the flipstop? It seems to me from looking over the MFT/3 at the local Woodcraft that the angle guide with the stop or stops could be used to cut pieces of a given width to a given length with the stop used to keep the repeatability. The limitation seems to be that the pieces need to be wider than the saw track which is fairly wide. I was looking at the tables with rails and stops that some have built and shared on this forum. My interest in the Festool system was initially driven by the fact that I have had to move my shop back into a basement and I was impressed by the chip and dust collection of the system. Some of the tasks that these tables would be used for I can do on my table saw...it is just harder to collect the sawdust from the tablesaw even with a good dust collection system it seems. I would like to get a MFT/3 and a saw perhaps by the end of the year and see where it goes from there. At this point though I don't think I will give up my tablesaw anytime soon. Perhaps I need to find someone here in the Charlotte area to show me some of the capabilities beyond what I can see and try at the Woodcraft store.
Best,
Notorious T.O.D.
Thanks for the info on how you use the pieces to add to the functionality of the system and components. Do you have a MFT/3 with the flipstop? It seems to me from looking over the MFT/3 at the local Woodcraft that the angle guide with the stop or stops could be used to cut pieces of a given width to a given length with the stop used to keep the repeatability. The limitation seems to be that the pieces need to be wider than the saw track which is fairly wide. I was looking at the tables with rails and stops that some have built and shared on this forum. My interest in the Festool system was initially driven by the fact that I have had to move my shop back into a basement and I was impressed by the chip and dust collection of the system. Some of the tasks that these tables would be used for I can do on my table saw...it is just harder to collect the sawdust from the tablesaw even with a good dust collection system it seems. I would like to get a MFT/3 and a saw perhaps by the end of the year and see where it goes from there. At this point though I don't think I will give up my tablesaw anytime soon. Perhaps I need to find someone here in the Charlotte area to show me some of the capabilities beyond what I can see and try at the Woodcraft store.
Best,
Notorious T.O.D.
Dave Ronyak
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Notorious,
I only have the old style MFTs, one 1080 and two 800s. When I need to cut a workpiece that is wider than the guide rail on the MFT I lay the workpiece on some pieces of 3/4" foam insulation sheet either on the floor or a work table. For a portable / temporary work table I use a scrap flush, hollow core 1 3/8 inch thick interior door spanning a pair of foldable saw horses. The height of this temporary work table is very nearly equal to that of my MFTs. I have a pair of 1400 Guide Rails and a 3000 Guide Rail. I use the 1400 for most cross cuts off the MFT and the 3000 for ripping plywood, e.g. to make cabinets or bookshelves.
A problem I have encountered with my last project - an entertainment center - was making repeat cutoffs of about 7 ft length which is far beyond the range of the fence that came with my MFT 1080, not wide cross cuts. My "solution" was to join the MFTs to form a continuous table top in line with my temporary table, and to affix a stop block to one of the MFT 800s at the needed ~7 ft length. For my next project I need to come up with a similar arrangement that incorporates a flip stop. I have not determined if I can do that with sections of MFS extrusions. If not, I may buy some Kreg or Woodpeckers aluminum extrusions. Kreg offers flip stops for their track.
Dave R
I only have the old style MFTs, one 1080 and two 800s. When I need to cut a workpiece that is wider than the guide rail on the MFT I lay the workpiece on some pieces of 3/4" foam insulation sheet either on the floor or a work table. For a portable / temporary work table I use a scrap flush, hollow core 1 3/8 inch thick interior door spanning a pair of foldable saw horses. The height of this temporary work table is very nearly equal to that of my MFTs. I have a pair of 1400 Guide Rails and a 3000 Guide Rail. I use the 1400 for most cross cuts off the MFT and the 3000 for ripping plywood, e.g. to make cabinets or bookshelves.
A problem I have encountered with my last project - an entertainment center - was making repeat cutoffs of about 7 ft length which is far beyond the range of the fence that came with my MFT 1080, not wide cross cuts. My "solution" was to join the MFTs to form a continuous table top in line with my temporary table, and to affix a stop block to one of the MFT 800s at the needed ~7 ft length. For my next project I need to come up with a similar arrangement that incorporates a flip stop. I have not determined if I can do that with sections of MFS extrusions. If not, I may buy some Kreg or Woodpeckers aluminum extrusions. Kreg offers flip stops for their track.
Dave R
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Notorious T.O.D. said:
I live in huntersville, nc near lake norman. you are welcome to come by my shop and I can show you whats up, happy to do that just get ahold of me 704 987-0374
Notorious T.O.D.
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Dave Ronyak said:
Dave,
I have been looking at the larger 3-4 ft x 7-8 ft tables that a couple of the members have built for cutting up 4/8 sheets and like some of these ideas. Seems to be different ideas for the rails these guys used to measure and set their stops on. The Kreg type probably would work great but I have and like the Biesemeyer stops that go over 1 1/2 x 1 5/8 inch fence rails. I have found these can be picked up on ebay for less than half of retail and like all Biesemeyer stuff they are built very robust. One could make the 1.5 x 2 inch or so rails out of hardwood or one can buy 1.5 x 2 inch rectangular steel or aluminum tube for between $25 and $45 which makes a nice solid and straight fence...just add a stick on tape to the top and it is good to go.
I am currently planning on investigating the capabilities of the MFT/3 first but have the larger table in the back of my mind. My current plan is for 2 MFT/3 tables and the ability to connect them together into a larger table. But I need to get the first one first I guess. I am still very large tool oriented so the
Festool system is somewhat of a change in my mindset in some ways.
Best,
Todd
Notorious T.O.D.
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honeydokreg said:
I live in Harrisburg, a few miles from the Lowe's track. I would enjoy coming and seeing someone who is a more experienced Festool user. I'll try to give you a call this evening and we can see about setting up a get together sometime. My number is 704.455.4869
Best,
Todd
That is what makes Festoolians different - a willingness to help others and learn about the differences. What a great offer.
Peter
Peter
Dave Ronyak
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Yes, and if you check out some of honeydokreg's posts and his site, you'll soon learn he is quite an accomplished pro!
Dave R.
Dave R.
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