Split Top Roubo Bench Build

[iamnothim]

Chamfers look good.  Did you use a router to do the chamfers?  What size bit?  Or which tool?

Thanks,
I used an MFK 700 in the trim configuration.  The router doesn't have a lot of range, bits & travel, but what it does, it does well and very easily.  I think it came with the chamfer bit.  It's a Festool bit but I don't have the part number.

I have to take care of some burn marks on long pieces where I repositioned my body before resuming.  Probably should have take the router away  from the workpiece.

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[iamnothim]

I finished one end of one stretcher.  It fits snug and the seam between the stretcher and the leg is pretty tight.  I give myself a "B".

The Lie Neilsen Router plane is AMAZING.  The depth stops and adjustments are slick.  It's the only way..... for someone with my skills, to make a tenon with uniform thickness.

I need to get a larger shoulder plane.  I keep jamming my hands into the work with the Clifton 410.  That should make the shoulder seams a bit better.

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[iamnothim]

Just ordered....
Since the router plane made a huge difference, I'm pretty sure this will help too.  I went with Veritas because LN's shoulder plane was the same size as the Clifton.

I have the Veritas scribe with the circular cutter.  It's great.  Very very clean and the marks meet up all the way around the workpiece.  So I cut south of the scribe line and go back to clean up the shoulder by hand. You are supposed to use a chisel and place the edge in the scribe and evenly pare back the material.

This is where it all goes wrong for me.

On the tenon pictured, I snuck up on the scribe a bit more and went straight to the shoulder plane.  It was much cleaner.
I will work on chiseling end grain as I know it's a skill I must obtain.

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[iamnothim]

An illustration of the finer points.
It the craftsmanship stuff and it should be done right the first time.

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[peter halle]

I have loved viewing this thread.  What an outstanding job documenting your bench build!

Peter

 

[Tyler Ernsberger]

Just ordered....
Since the router plane made a huge difference, I'm pretty sure this will help too.  I went with Veritas because LN's shoulder plane was the same size as the Clifton.

I have the Veritas scribe with the circular cutter.  It's great.  Very very clean and the marks meet up all the way around the workpiece.  So I cut south of the scribe line and go back to clean up the shoulder by hand. You are supposed to use a chisel and place the edge in the scribe and evenly pare back the material.

This is where it all goes wrong for me.

On the tenon pictured, I snuck up on the scribe a bit more and went straight to the shoulder plane.  It was much cleaner.
I will work on chiseling end grain as I know it's a skill I must obtain.

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Please let us know what you think about the Veritas Large shoulder plane.  I keep looking at it and the lie-neilsen and I cant decide.  The one thing about the Veritas thats throwing me off is the wood knobs.

 

[butzla]

Veritas is the way to go.  I tried a lie Nielsen and just doesn't feel right in my hands.  The veritas knobs pivot 90 degrees for sideways cuts.  I love every other lie Nielsen but the shoulder planes

 

[iamnothim]

More illustration on why I went for the Veritas version.
I actually thought it was larger than the "large" LN, but they are the same size.
No matter.  I think the swivel knobs are the way to go.

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[Gene Davis]

Mine is the medium sized (7" long) Veritas and it has been well-used.  I keep it sharpened up to the 8000 grit stone level, but will start using the felt wheel and compound on it next time sharpening.

The technique of getting the shoulders trimmed to where they belong begins with marking-out, and using the Paul Sellars method of knife and chisel to get the "knife wall."  When that is done, a good saw will leave a surface that only needs a nick or two with your razor-sharp shoulder plane.

I got the Veritas and thought about the Clifton at the time, but the Veritas was less money, and better-featured.

Hey, my two recent eBay purchases arrived recently.  The Stanley 71 router and a really nice Radi-Plane with chamfer blades, and both look barely used.  I have a SlickPlane with the roundover blades and so now with the Radi I can do either chamfers or roundovers.

 

[iamnothim]

Mine is the medium sized (7" long) Veritas and it has been well-used.  I keep it sharpened up to the 8000 grit stone level, but will start using the felt wheel and compound on it next time sharpening.

The technique of getting the shoulders trimmed to where they belong begins with marking-out, and using the Paul Sellars method of knife and chisel to get the "knife wall."  When that is done, a good saw will leave a surface that only needs a nick or two with your razor-sharp shoulder plane.

I got the Veritas and thought about the Clifton at the time, but the Veritas was less money, and better-featured.

Hey, my two recent eBay purchases arrived recently.  The Stanley 71 router and a really nice Radi-Plane with chamfer blades, and both look barely used.  I have a SlickPlane with the roundover blades and so now with the Radi I can do either chamfers or roundovers.

Hello Gene,
Good to hear from you.

I purchased the Clifton about 15 years ago.  I built a small cabinet then went into woodworking hibernation.  I had no idea what the plane was used for, I just thought it looked neat and that it would come in handy.  Well 15 years later it's handy.

I'm taking a break to post.  As soon as I hit "Post" I'm going to the Sellers video.  Marc The W.Whisperer showed the same method.  I was thinking that the Veritas gauge would produce a sufficient "knife wall".  I'm going to go over the lines with a marking knife I picked up.

I've been waiting to hear about you "71".  I'll put a chamfer plane on my list because I'm getting burn marks with the MFK 700.  I think that machine is best suited for laminates.  I do still like it.
[member=2952]Gene Davis[/member]

 

[iamnothim]

So glade I just spent some large "spinach" on a shoulder and router plane.  Also known as the plane with training wheels....

 

[iamnothim]

I was getting freaked out again about making tenon #2.  I marked the lines then put pencil on them and cut everything except the cheeks on the band saw.  Then I watched some vid's and decided to sharpen a couple chisels and plane irons.  They came out pretty nice.

Scratching my head I decided to get out the Texas Dozuki,  it's really a Ryoba saw but "Dozuki" is more fun to say.  First I took a marking knife (thanks Gene) and went over the marks.  I started the saw nice and slow and..... you are not going to believe that I just now figured this out.....  I focused on The BACK of the blade during the stroke.  Guess what....  holy smokes it's the best hand cut I've ever made.  Then I did the other cheek.  Just as good.  It even stayed one line and took out the thin stock on the side.... 

Basically I sprinted up here to post these. [smile]

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[iamnothim]

Might be canceling the expensive large shoulder plane.
No.2 fit perfectly.
EDIT:  These should be even better when the draw-bored dowels are set.
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[iamnothim]

This is a photo of tenon 3,  a large lower rail,  after sawing.
I used the BS for the horizontal rip cuts and the Ryoba for the cross cuts.  No planing.  Notice there are no pencil lines on the shoulders.  I put the blade right in the marking groove.

I did have to use a chisel a tiny bit to clean up the shoulder in the bottom of the photo, but the other three are square straight right off the saw.  This may seem trivial to most woodworkers, but it's a major accomplishment for me.  I am honestly amazed.  So much so that I  canceled the order for a $250 Veritas shoulder plane.  Might get it again down the road, but with these results the small Clifton will me fine when needed.

Ya'll might want to consider trying a Japanese hand saw.  The Ryoba is double sided.  One for cross cut, one for ripping.  The large one in the picture is from Lee Valley Tools
  60T0120 Professional Ryoba, 240mm 92.50
The saw tracks very nicely.  esp in a knife groove.  (The Dozuki's have a spline like a carcass or tenon saw.)

I also have a small one, pictured a few pages back, from Japan Woodworker.  It was twice as much $.  It's too small for this work but amazing when used on appropriately sized material.  Like cutting small pieces.  It's blade is even thinner.  I read that these saws get better with use.  It seems to be true.

Luke

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[tiralie]

Very nice.
Tim
BTW, the Veritas large shoulder plane is a beautiful tool and comes perfectly sharpened.

 

[Billedis]

It is amazing how our game steps up with the right tools!  Bill

 

[iamnothim]

Here's a method of matching the chamfers where one is made with a router and the other must be made by hand.
I took my small combo square and set the 45 deg base on the edge of the existing chamfer.  I pulled the blade way way up until the butt end of the blade matched the depth of the routed chamfer.

Now I could measure the progress of the hand chamfer using the block plane until it matched the combo square.

I also took a chisel and went all medieval on the shoulders undercutting them to the tenon.  This tightened the joint considerably.

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[Tinker]

Great work on those tennons, Luke.

Whenever I try making cuts with my Ryobi saw, I end up anything but straight.  I have an ancient set of carpenter saws that I end up going to every time I want to be anywhere near accurate with a cut.  Very frustrating.  Next time, i will try your advice.  I don't know which end i have concentrated on, but i end up with a pretty good start on making a big circle. 
Tinker

 

[iamnothim]

Great work on those tennons, Luke.

Whenever I try making cuts with my Ryobi saw, I end up anything but straight.  I have an ancient set of carpenter saws that I end up going to every time I want to be anywhere near accurate with a cut.  Very frustrating.  Next time, i will try your advice.  I don't know which end i have concentrated on, but i end up with a pretty good start on making a big circle. 
Tinker

Gene Davis gave me this tip.  I was using a marking gauge then pencil for my cut lines.  I added the step of going over the marks with a "Marking Knife"  ($7.50 at Rockler)  It made a big difference in how the Japanese saw tracked.  The blade is much thinner than a carpenter saw.  Thus the marking knife groove is actually deep enough for the thin blade to track.

Until yesterday, I was looking forward at the blade.  This is useless because I was looking at where I had been.  Like driving and only looking in the mirror.  Now when I looked at the back of the blade I see where it's tracking in both planes.  I will also use the two hand grip at times.  This seems to stabilize the tracking more.  It's a real advantage of the Ryoba / Dozuki because it reduces arm fatigue and cuts considerably faster.  I'm still taking slow deliberate strokes.

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[iamnothim]

About seams for the "shoulder impaired"

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