Bulk XL Dominos

[JonathanJung]

14mm Dominos are one of my most used so I'd love to find a way to order packs larger than the 70 and 80 ct. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm not interested in cutting my own, as I added up the cost savings to only a couple pennies a piece.

What I'd really be after is packs more in the 200-300 pcs.

 

[squall_line]

14mm Dominos are one of my most used so I'd love to find a way to order packs larger than the 70 and 80 ct. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm not interested in cutting my own, as I added up the cost savings to only a couple pennies a piece.

What I'd really be after is packs more in the 200-300 pcs.

This isn't intended to be snarky, but I think you may have answered your own question about why you haven't found larger packs either through FUSA or from a retailer.

 

[JonathanJung]

14mm Dominos are one of my most used so I'd love to find a way to order packs larger than the 70 and 80 ct. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm not interested in cutting my own, as I added up the cost savings to only a couple pennies a piece.

What I'd really be after is packs more in the 200-300 pcs.

This isn't intended to be snarky, but I think you may have answered your own question about why you haven't found larger packs either through FUSA or from a retailer.

How so? I'm only curious why there aren't bigger packs available. What do the larger production shops order in?

 

[squall_line]

I suppose my point was that there's such little to be saved from cutting the longer pieces to length (or, one could argue, a loss because of the cost of time), that producing them in bulk likely doesn't have a cost benefit to it.

I'd be curious to know how larger shops deal with it, but they might just order more bags, cut the long strips, or shape their own.  They get pretty bulky in a hurry.

My understanding was that the XL tenons are used more frequently for doors or large pieces. I would be curious to see how the usage breaks down between 500 and 700 owners; I get the sense that the number of cabinet makers using 500s is larger than the number of door or large piece makers using 700s, but I might be wrong on that.

 

[afish]

I think you assuming "large production" shops use dominos.  This could be different in other parts but I came from a large shop and I never seen 1 domino in 15 years there.  Not saying a Domino isnt a great tool but the consumables cost is a concern when "large/high production" is concerned.  Same reason why you would never see a large production shop using festool knockdown hardware.  That's just not Festool niche market. 

 

[JonathanJung]

I think you assuming "large production" shops use dominos.  This could be different in other parts but I came from a large shop and I never seen 1 domino in 15 years there.  Not saying a Domino isnt a great tool but the consumables cost is a concern when "large/high production" is concerned.  Same reason why you would never see a large production shop using festool knockdown hardware.  That's just not Festool niche market.

I'm thinking of other small, full-time, custom commercial shops, such as the likes of Jory Brigham, custom door makers (Rustica), etc.

 

[ChuckM]

Let's face it: it's a romantic thought that too many shops can afford to buy and use a DF700 for their daily business when other tried and true methods work so well for them such as dowels and M&T. 

As afish pointed out, larger or small commercial shops (making doors, furniture, cabinets, and reno) with at least 2 employees (not counting the owner)  that I've visited or known of locally here don't use any dominoes at all. None of them have a Kapex...but some do have the Festool tracksaws and cordless drills. Vac systems? Zero.

Every DF500 and every 700 owner (7 of them) I know are hobbyists or semi-hobbyists (i.e. they may produce work to sell, but not on a full-time basis), people who have money and time.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

14mm Dominos are one of my most used so I'd love to find a way to order packs larger than the 70 and 80 ct. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm not interested in cutting my own, as I added up the cost savings to only a couple pennies a piece.

What I'd really be after is packs more in the 200-300 pcs.

I would assume that it's because of the XL itself. It can cut so much deeper than the DF500, so there can potentially be several different sizes. It would just get crazy trying to keep each of those sizes/ lengths in bigger bulk containers.
I work in a cabinet shop, using my DF500 quite a bit. My most used size is 6mm. They really only come in that one size 6 x 40. I get them in bulk boxes of 1080, but once you jump up to 14mm, what length would they sell in bulk? I think that is why they sell the "cut you own" sticks, bulk type volume, but not locked into one length.

 

[ChuckM]

The comment about commercial shops reminds me of this video:


I suppose the DF500 can be used to make one of those chairs, but no commercial shop owners would.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

14mm Dominos are one of my most used so I'd love to find a way to order packs larger than the 70 and 80 ct. Anyone have any ideas?

I'm not interested in cutting my own, as I added up the cost savings to only a couple pennies a piece.

What I'd really be after is packs more in the 200-300 pcs.

This isn't intended to be snarky, but I think you may have answered your own question about why you haven't found larger packs either through FUSA or from a retailer.

How so? I'm only curious why there aren't bigger packs available. What do the larger production shops order in?

I doubt that they do. Someone making doors is probably not using hundreds at a time. They might even be making their own.
I have done that in the past. I cut custom width tennons to fit the size that the DF500 makes when set to its widest position. It was an odd case where I wanted them wider, but not wide enough to put two of the standard units side by side. I don't know that it was worth the trouble though?

 

[ChuckM]

Lee Valley Tools does sell this:https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/supplies/joinery/44779-lee-valley-floating-tenons

I've used the 5/16" tenons in place of 8mm dominoes.

I wonder if other merchants may sell or make tenons of other sizes.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I think you assuming "large production" shops use dominos.  This could be different in other parts but I came from a large shop and I never seen 1 domino in 15 years there.  Not saying a Domino isnt a great tool but the consumables cost is a concern when "large/high production" is concerned.  Same reason why you would never see a large production shop using festool knockdown hardware.  That's just not Festool niche market.

Right, in our shop, the production run stuff is done with dowels. They are done by an automatic machine that drills, injects water and inserts the dowel so fast that it is dizzying.
I do however have and use a DF500 in the custom department. I use it regularly. A box of 1080 6mm x 40mm Dominos may only last a few months. This just depends upon the jobs that come up though. Some days I don't touch it at all. I also use a Lamello Zeta P2, but not as often as the Domino.
I don't use KD hardware though. If something needs to come apart, Zeta Clamex will do it

 

[Lincoln]

Let's face it: it's a romantic thought that too many shops can afford to buy and use a DF700 for their daily business when other tried and true methods work so well for them such as dowels and M&T. 

As afish pointed out, larger or small commercial shops (making doors, furniture, cabinets, and reno) with at least 2 employees (not counting the owner)  that I've visited or known of locally here don't use any dominoes at all. None of them have a Kapex...but some do have the Festool tracksaws and cordless drills. Vac systems? Zero.

Every DF500 and every 700 owner (7 of them) I know are hobbyists or semi-hobbyists (i.e. they may produce work to sell, but not on a full-time basis), people who have money and time.

My experience, in Australia, is the exact opposite - every high end shop I'm familiar with has a Domino and most also a Zeta. They use these along side their CNC routers, covering all their bases. Vaccums are completely standard, in the shop and on site (commercial and domestic) - Festool and other trade quality brands.

 

[ChuckM]

In my city, when one searches "custom furniture" or "custom woodwork" etc., 90% of the results are contractors doing cabinets, kitchens, renovation, and the like (see what's shown on one shop's website). The custom tables and chairs shops can be counted in one hand or two (and I know three of them!). There're some custom door builders, but others listed are more into stairs, moudling, etc.

We have high-end stores like Ethan Allen, but I know it's tough to do custom furniture for a living here. Many love custom designs and custom furniture pieces; few are willing to fork out the money required.

 

[Michael Kellough]

Lee Valley Tools does sell this:https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/supplies/joinery/44779-lee-valley-floating-tenons

I've used the 5/16" tenons in place of 8mm dominoes.

I wonder if other merchants may sell or make tenons of other sizes.

I've never done the cost calculation for Domino's but since this is a foot long it makes it easy.

Works out to $132 per board foot.

 

[ChuckM]

Customer: How come lumber cost was so high for my table?
Furniture maker: Floating tenons were used. [tongue] [big grin]

 

[TinyShop]

[member=67785]JonathanJung[/member] - I bet these folks would sell you whatever quantity you want (even more than 400ct):
https://taytools.com/products/taytools-100-pack-10mm-50mm-24mm-beechwood-loose-tenons

 

[squall_line]

[member=67785]JonathanJung[/member] - I bet these folks would sell you whatever quantity you want (even more than 400ct):
https://taytools.com/products/taytools-100-pack-10mm-50mm-24mm-beechwood-loose-tenons

No 14mm...  [sad]

 

[Michael Kellough]

[member=67785]JonathanJung[/member] - I bet these folks would sell you whatever quantity you want (even more than 400ct):
https://taytools.com/products/taytools-100-pack-10mm-50mm-24mm-beechwood-loose-tenons

That's better, only $40 per board foot.

To be fair, in the Lee Valley calculation I did not consider kerf. If you had a board foot and had to rip it on the tablesaw to make those tenon strips you'd only get 14 instead of 24. So it's only $77 per BF.

 

[TinyShop]

[member=67785]JonathanJung[/member] - I bet these folks would sell you whatever quantity you want (even more than 400ct):
https://taytools.com/products/taytools-100-pack-10mm-50mm-24mm-beechwood-loose-tenons

No 14mm...  [sad]

I realized that before I pointed folks in their direction. The silent implication was "who knows what wonders a telephone call might produce?" IOW maybe there are enough XL users out there now to warrant Taytools, if that's pointed out to them, exploring the option of expanding their offerings.