Euro Cabinets 101-2 A Beginner's Guide

[The Woodentop]

And girls. metafizix.net. My wife (and many other graphic designers, filmmakers, photographers) won't use any other brand. I think you're selling them short to call them toys. We've never had or worried about a virus either. Apple makes brilliant tools as well.

I've owned/used both. Not closed minded as you describe your wife. Nothing the Apple would do that the PC wouldn't.....for far less cost. Viruses, not many viruses written for Mac as it's such a marginal OS. But it happens:

Symantec Corp. this week warned Mac OS X users that the addition of an exploit to the Metasploit hacking framework had boosted the threat posed by an unpatched bug in Samba, the open-source file- and print-sharing software included with the Apple operating system.

Although the vulnerability was disclosed May 14 and patched that same day by the Samba community, Apple has not updated Mac OS X with a fix, said Symantec's Alfred Huger, vice president of engineering with the security company's response group.

"This is significant exposure for Mac OS X users," said Huger. "Samba is used in virtually every mixed environment where there are Macs and PCs, and the threat profile is much higher now that an exploit has been added to Metasploit."

Samba, which is also used by most Linux distributions to file- and print-sharing with Windows systems, is turned on in Mac OS X when users activate the Windows Sharing feature.

This month, a trio of Brazilian researchers who collaborate as Rise Security released Mac OS X attack code for the Samba vulnerability. According to Symantec, the Rise code is "almost identical" to what the company's security team discovered in late May.

More important, said Huger, is that Rise also contributed their code to Metasploit, an open-source platform for creating, testing and launching exploit code. "Once we see something in Metasploit, we know it's likely we'll see it used in attacks," he said as he explained why Symantec had amped its earlier warning. "Every Unix-based break-in that's not hand-crafted, in other words not with the attacker sitting at the keyboard during the attack, is made with a couple of different tools, and Metasploit is by far the most popular."

The Rise-developed, Metasploit-distributed exploit successfully attacks a fully-patched Mac OS X 10.4.10 system, added Symantec, and results in the attacker gaining root privileges on the Mac.

"There is a very high probability that attackers will attempt to leverage [the exploit] to compromise Apple users, especially those connected to wireless networks," said Symantec in a separate alert issued Wednesday to customers of its DeepSight Threat network. "Wireless networks are an especially high threat, because users' systems may be exposing the service that may otherwise be protected by a gateway firewall installed on a home network."

Symantec recommended that users disable the Windows Sharing service until Apple produces a patch. Technically-astute users, however, may be able to handle the more rigorous chore of compiling the latest version of Samba manually in lieu of waiting for Apple.

Apple, which has not updated Samba within Mac OS X since March 2005, did not respond to e-mail asking for comment.

Spend your money as you wish.......

 

[The Woodentop]

I don't object to the computer talk, but it certainly doesn't belong in this thread, a thread that's likely to be of permanent use.

Could we move this stuff to an OT area where it belongs?  I think the thread should be separated at Richard's moment-of-silence post.  No blaming of Richard, but that's the beginning of the serious veering OT.

One of the things I've enjoyed about the new FOG is that I don't see a lot of whining about OT posts.  Here, a useful thread has been hijacked and I wouldn't blame the whiners.

Probably because this post counts as a whine.  :

Ned

UNBELIEVABLE! You're just as bad Ned! Jeez.

 

[mmo]

Overtime,
    Would you mind sharing where you bought your Blum hardware?  Thanks, great thread

 

[Overtime]

  Thanks  mmo, I got my hardware from  http://www.ahturf.com/  and  http://www.specialtysupplies.com/  but there are dozens of suppliers.

Roland, glad to hear your positive results. The domino and the pocket holes work very well together and make assembly easy. Much less work than rabbits (rebates) and dados and plenty strong. As long as they are not visible tops and bottoms no problem.  I got the idea from this forum somewhere.

Thanks neoshed, agreed the metric and euro system is hard to beat. same goes for the ecodrill.

  Eli, no problem on the off topic, that's how I found Open Office.org - thanks Matt and also Acronis

Tomorrow we will work on drawers  ;D just kidding.  But I do see a base cabinet somewhere down the line incorporating the 32mm system with drawer construction and spacing with door placement.

 

[edesilva]

First, great tutorial.  I'm going to pick up an LR-32 this weekend, since I need to get some garage storage put together.  I've read a bunch of different LR-32 and Euro cabinet tutorials, and still have one question you (or someone here) might be able to answer. 

I noticed you use a Blum device for the cup holes in the door.  I've also noticed a lot of the tutorials referencing the problem with needing to offset the LR-32 by 16mm when drilling door cup holes.  But, doesn't the LR-32 come with a 16mm and 32mm offset?  Why not just swap offsets and drill the cups in the doors using the LR-32 and a 35mm bit?

Also, am I correct that using the LR-32 with the 32mm offset gives you the correct vertical alignment for the door hinge cup, but that the horizontal alignment of the hinge cup will vary based on the complicated tables in the Blum catalog?  In other words, you need the door thickness to determine the minimum reveal, then use the reveal to figure the "Bore," which can vary.  The hinge cup diameter, if I'm reading right, is 35mm, so you have to add 17.5mm to the "Bore" to get where the hole should be centered horizontally?  Given that most of us measure holes from the center, not the edge, am I having some sort of gross conceptual error?  Why the heck did Blum give "Bore" instead of "hole center offset from side" if the cup diameter is fixed?

Any insight appreciated.  I'm new to this--anxious to muck in and start, but really not wanting to blow a bunch of BB on dumb mistakes or complicate my life in a way I don't need too...

 

[Brice Burrell]

  But, doesn't the LR-32 come with a 16mm and 32mm offset?  Why not just swap offsets and drill the cups in the doors using the LR-32 and a 35mm bit?

Ed that is how I do it, works great. See the links in Dan's reply, post #5.

Also, am I correct that using the LR-32 with the 32mm offset gives you the correct vertical alignment for the door hinge cup, but that the horizontal alignment of the hinge cup will vary based on the complicated tables in the Blum catalog?  In other words, you need the door thickness to determine the minimum reveal, then use the reveal to figure the "Bore," which can vary.  The hinge cup diameter, if I'm reading right, is 35mm, so you have to add 17.5mm to the "Bore" to get where the hole should be centered horizontally?  Given that most of us measure holes from the center, not the edge, am I having some sort of gross conceptual error?  Why the heck did Blum give "Bore" instead of "hole center offset from side" if the cup diameter is fixed?

You've got the concept right, 17.5mm plus the number in the chart with your reveal to find your center.

Any insight appreciated.  I'm new to this--anxious to muck in and start, but really not wanting to blow a bunch of BB on dumb mistakes or complicate my life in a way I don't need too...

Just make sure you try it out on scrap first. If you get into some trouble on the scrap just post the problems/questions you have here and someone will help out. Good luck.

 

 

[Overtime]

Yep, what Brice said.   

edesilva says;
"Given that most of us measure holes from the center, not the edge, am I having some sort of gross conceptual error?  Why the heck did Blum give "Bore" instead of "hole center offset from side" if the cup diameter is fixed?"

Most of the concealed hinge manufactures use the same kind of mm spec reference to help locate the cup in relation to the edge of the door.
Blum calls it bore distance or B, Hettich calls it cup distance or C. Hafele calls it Tab.  Grass America calls it drilling distance or DD but they do also include a cup center CC . This Grass chart uses the center of the cup hole in the specs and also has both metric and imperial numbers.

Every thing you will need is in the LR 32-SYS.  The Blum drilling jig and the Mirko modifications with the rails are upgrades. Very nice to have but not a necessity.
When you get to using the LR 32 with some hinges you will see how it all works together.  8)
 

 

[rblaustein]

This is a very helpful tutorial for me as I'm just learning about this system and I plan to build a series of storage cabinets for my basement.  But I'm  curious about something--your choice of softclose mechanism.  I've looked at the Blum site and some catalogs (eg Rockler, etc) and notice that there is a Blumotion device that just clips on top of the hinge.  So there would be no need to drill additional holes.  Could you have used these?
This is what I'm referring to:http://www.blum.com/us/en/01/30/40/10/index.php
--Rob

 

[Overtime]

Hi Rob,

    Yes I did consider that type also. And yes I could have used those on the hinges that I used. I had the opportunity to see the plunger type that I used in person (on a finished cabinet) and I liked the low profile of the design - unobtrusive.  I thought the clip on type was a little bulky. But not that bad, and the price is actually less on the one that I could have used  This and only one per door is needed for light ones. This is for 107 and 120 deg full overlay hinge. I ended up using the plunger piston type in the end.

  When using with a 170 full overlay hinge This One is required, note the the size of that thing.
   
   This a very good option and it is one that I never mentioned. It's good that you have found it and mention it here, thanks.
One thing to remember is that all of these Blumotion choices must be used with a SC - Self Close hinge. The FS - Free Swing type will not pull itself closed due to the resistance of the plunger.

  Here is another discussion on same topic with a focus on the Blum and other drilling jigs for the 3 hole cup pattern.http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=1845.0

 

[rblaustein]

   
  This a very good option and it is one that I never mentioned. It's good that you have found it and mention it here, thanks.
One thing to remember is that all of these Blumotion choices must be used with a SC - Self Close hinge. The FS - Free Swing type will not pull itself closed due to the resistance of the plunger.

Thanks for the reply.  Are all of the Blum clip-top hinges self close?  I've been looking at their site and haven't come across that distinction, but I've only really looked at clip-top.
Rob

 

[Overtime]

See page 5 of the Blum Concealed Hinge Brochure, bottom of page. Shows choices, note Self Close prefix #s are 71 and free Swing is 70;

Page 6 - table chart (center right) shows how Blum categorizes each hinge type and mounting method.
Press in type requires a special machine press,
Inserta is the type I used.

There is a daunting amount of options almost infinite  ???. Just spend some time (lots) reading over the Hinge Brochure and soon you will be able to decode  ;D most of it.  You will also see-learn from the charts how to select the correct mounting plates to mate with the hinge and your project. 

 

[rblaustein]

Thanks, I downloaded the catalog and I'll check those pages out.  And yes, it is very daunting, particularly for one who has never built with these hinges before.  All I want to do is make a bank of 4 euro style frameless cabinets run together, each out of 3/4" ply, with each cab having two doors that open like French doors from the middle.  So I'm guessing I want clip top, full overlay, self close, and will have to figure out which angle to use, noting that the Blumotion 973--the one that attaches to the hinge--will work with only certain angles.
--Rob

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Everyone,
I'm planning out a cabinetry project, and definitely want to use the Euro cabinet hardware.  Well, I began researching Blum products and Euro hinges and really like what I'm seeing.  But now I know what Overtime meant when he said, "daunting amount of options almost infinite..."  Of course, I like having options.

This excellent discussion has been really helpful.  This is the first reply since November, so if anyone has new ideas to add, please jump in!

Thanks,
Matthew

 

[vteknical]

Overtime,
Excellent information! 

Looks like you put a lot of thought and time into communicating the details.  Any chance of doing a Euro style Base cabinet in the future? 

Now I'm gonna have buy the Domino and LR-32 before April.

Thanks
Victor

 

[Overtime]

Thanks guys, I am glad that this info has been useful to those who plan to construct some frameless cabinets.
  Since I started this thread I have completed a few more uppers, and some open (no door) upper shelving. All done using the same methods. Having the tools and assembly jigs shown here really helps to make this process a breeze (as far as repeatability and  production goes) Everything takes time but at least the outcome will be a constant.

  I am now (or have been) planning some base cabinets that I will start in a few weeks. I have been reading up on the Blum drawer hardware. And now have another pile of "goodies" for some base cabinets. They include some 562H Tandem Plus Blumotion full ext slides. I was impressed by the hinge hardware used here, and now after handling these drawer slides I have just one word - Wow !  Going to use them for drawers and pullouts.

I plan on doing another comprehensive (picture loaded, with lots of details  ;D) on the subject with a new thread. I hope to include from start to finish details including half blind drawer construction using the VS 600. And set up and use of the various blum drawer hardware components. But it will be about a month or two out.

 

 

[Dave Rudy]

I am sure I won't be the only one looking forward to it.  Thanks for all the hard work Patrick.

Dave

 

[Dan Clark]

Patrick,

I'll be reading it!

Thanks,

Dan.

 

[James Biddle]

Hi Rob,

    Yes I did consider that type also. And yes I could have used those on the hinges that I used. I had the opportunity to see the plunger type that I used in person (on a finished cabinet) and I liked the low profile of the design - unobtrusive.  I thought the clip on type was a little bulky. But not that bad, and the price is actually less on the one that I could have used  This and only one per door is needed for light ones. This is for 107 and 120 deg full overlay hinge. I ended up using the plunger piston type in the end.

  When using with a 170 full overlay hinge This One is required, note the the size of that thing.
   
   This a very good option and it is one that I never mentioned. It's good that you have found it and mention it here, thanks.
One thing to remember is that all of these Blumotion choices must be used with a SC - Self Close hinge. The FS - Free Swing type will not pull itself closed due to the resistance of the plunger.

  Here is another discussion on same topic with a focus on the Blum and other drilling jigs for the 3 hole cup pattern.http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=1845.0

Overtime,
Great thread!  Question about your Blumotion location: it looks like you located the Blumotion for the Compact hinge recommendation (closer to the hinge) instead of the Clip Top hinge recommendation (further from the hinge).  Have you found your location to work better with Clip Top hinges?

 

[Terp]

Love it, fantastic, keep going! These are the same I put in my last house. The only thing I DIDN'T like about them was they gather dust on top of the lower door rail, hard to clean. The next kitchen I do for us will be likely be flush panels with a shadow line. Love it. Fantastic job.

Dude that's kind of anal.  Are you Felix Unger?  ;D
That's the top edge of the bottom door stile, right?
All 1/4", huh.  Try beveling that edge next time. 
I know this because I had the same pet peeve.

 

[Overtime]

James, where did you find the "location" info for the plunger type Blumotion?  Thanks for the help in getting it right ! I have been waiting for feedback on that detail. It's an important detail that needs to be corrected.  My location is / was not correct. 

I had a minor problem, in that the 120 deg clip top hinge - when fully opened just bumps the tip of the plunger ever so slightly - (the inside edge of the door itself).  The 170 degree hinge - no problem at all.  The function and operation of both the blumotion and the doors were not affected on either hinge types. Smooth operation.

  When I made the first cabinet I set up and used a pair of 170 clip top full overlay. Using the plunger drilling guide bushing tool not knowing that there were specific "locations". I just pushed the guide up to the inside corner and drilled.  I installed the 170 hinges and presto it worked perfectly. No issues at all.  So I drilled them all at the same location. Then I used / installed the 120 clip top hinges and did not notice any thing wrong with the operation. But I finally saw the minor issue, it's too close to the hinge by about 1/8" or so.
So I changed the location on my own by 1/4" or so.

I had some idea that the location was questionable. But some how over looked the info on the plunger location for compact and clip top.
The operation of both the doors and plunger work so well that I did not consider anything other than a very minor adjustment on the location.

Just how far off are my locations ?  ???