how to efficiently rip a bunch of strips with a track saw

[mhadler]

Metric, Imperial, whatever. Most of the time I use neither- just a story stick. I certainly wouldn't get upset over it, nor would I pay more to see a European tool converted to Imperial which is what would happen if Festool had to re-engineer everything for the US market.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't most "re-engineering" consist of using a different rule sticker?  In the few other cases like the domino and the routers, it might require a new part for the depth stop, but that would be peanuts to produce.  Heck, you could just include it with the kit and have the end user decide which one to attach.  I don't think that would cost much at all.  And I am willing to bet that it would also pay for itself in new sales from the "old school" people who refuse to convert.

 

[Paul G]

I use the parallel guide set (with the extensions.)  For thinner stock I can place spacers underneath.  I also have an MFT/3 and use a system that Tom has posted here which basically uses a pattern to set up distances.  So for instance if I need to cut face frame parts at 2 1/4 " I'll make a pattern and then mark it and keep it.  You could also buy two of the edge stops that are used for the LR-32 system.  You could also use 2 adjustable squares.  2 Inca gauges.  I have another way that could be used but I will need to sketch it out.

Peter

Thanks. Would that be Tom Bellemare, Tom Bainbridge, Tom Gensmer, Tom in SoCal or another of the dozens of Toms registered in the forum? I'd like to track this down just not sure where to look.

 

[Paul G]

Metric, Imperial, whatever. Most of the time I use neither- just a story stick. I certainly wouldn't get upset over it, nor would I pay more to see a European tool converted to Imperial which is what would happen if Festool had to re-engineer everything for the US market.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't most "re-engineering" consist of using a different rule sticker?   In the few other cases like the domino and the routers, it might require a new part for the depth stop, but that would be peanuts to produce.  Heck, you could just include it with the kit and have the end user decide which one to attach.   I don't think that would cost much at all.  And I am willing to bet that it would also pay for itself in new sales from the "old school" people who refuse to convert.

I agree and bumped a thread in the Festool wish list to focus in on this issue. Hopefully the metric/inch discussion can resume there http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-wish-list/non-metric-overlays/msg258728/?topicseen#msg258728

 

[peter halle]

I use the parallel guide set (with the extensions.)  For thinner stock I can place spacers underneath.  I also have an MFT/3 and use a system that Tom has posted here which basically uses a pattern to set up distances.  So for instance if I need to cut face frame parts at 2 1/4 " I'll make a pattern and then mark it and keep it.  You could also buy two of the edge stops that are used for the LR-32 system.  You could also use 2 adjustable squares.  2 Inca gauges.  I have another way that could be used but I will need to sketch it out.

Peter

Thanks. Would that be Tom Bellemare, Tom Bainbridge, Tom Gensmer, Tom in SoCal or another of the dozens of Toms registered in the forum? I'd like to track this down just not sure where to look.

I believe this is one of two threads he did about this.  http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/how-i-rip-ff-and-door-pieces/

Peter

 

[Paul G]

Awesome, thanks much!

 

[Stephen B]

Some thoughts on Metric System.

My father was a carpenter when metric came in for Australia in 1970. After several frustrating months, he solved his frustration by simply throwing away his imperial rulers.

As for myself, I sometimes measure in imperial for increased accuracy.

I also work part time in a timber yard. Many customers of all ages still ask for 4x2and 3x1 1/2 inch when they really want 90x45 and 70x35 mm  timber.

 

[peter halle]

Paul,

One of the things that I like about what Tom posted about is that you can use an existing piece as the basis for a pattern.  Say I have been using my table saw to rip face frame parts and in my system I use 2 3/16" wide face frame parts.  I can take an extra part, place it against the fence.  Then I take a piece of wood that will become the pattern to be used over and over again- the same thickness as I normally use - and place that next to the first piece.  I place my rail over both of those pieces and against the fence.  Make the cut.  The piece I just cut becomes the pattern forever unless I do something strange to my saw.  I will have the information written on the pattern and will never have to pull a tape measure again to make that 2 3/16" width part.

May not be to everyone's tastes, but it works without being too complicated.  Works real well if your thicknesses are all the same or extremely close.

Peter

 

[Paul G]

Paul,

One of the things that I like about what Tom posted about is that you can use an existing piece as the basis for a pattern.  Say I have been using my table saw to rip face frame parts and in my system I use 2 3/16" wide face frame parts.  I can take an extra part, place it against the fence.  Then I take a piece of wood that will become the pattern to be used over and over again- the same thickness as I normally use - and place that next to the first piece.  I place my rail over both of those pieces and against the fence.  Make the cut.  The piece I just cut becomes the pattern forever unless I do something strange to my saw.  I will have the information written on the pattern and will never have to pull a tape measure again to make that 2 3/16" width part.

May not be to everyone's tastes, but it works without being too complicated.  Works real well if your thicknesses are all the same or extremely close.

Peter

Tom's method is simpler but I think I'm gonna try this other method first because the template and finish piece are the same width, rather than the difference between the guide and the finish width. http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tools-accessories/parallel-guide-set-replace-the-table-saw/msg70770/#msg70770 Regardless it's good to have options, thank you very much for bringing it to my attention. It's interesting to get myself into a track saw frame of mind.

BTW here is Tom's other thread http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/rip-cuts-in-the-field/msg207991/#msg207991

 

[sancho57]

I use the parallel guide set (with the extensions.)  For thinner stock I can place spacers underneath.  I also have an MFT/3 and use a system that Tom has posted here which basically uses a pattern to set up distances.  So for instance if I need to cut face frame parts at 2 1/4 " I'll make a pattern and then mark it and keep it.  You could also buy two of the edge stops that are used for the LR-32 system.  You could also use 2 adjustable squares.  2 Inca gauges.  I have another way that could be used but I will need to sketch it out.

Peter

Thanks. Would that be Tom Bellemare, Tom Bainbridge, Tom Gensmer, Tom in SoCal or another of the dozens of Toms registered in the forum? I'd like to track this down just not sure where to look.

I believe this is one of two threads he did about this.  http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/how-i-rip-ff-and-door-pieces/

Peter

Thats what i was going to say.

I just used Toms method for ripping some cabinet door stock. To easy.

As for the metric imperial controversy, the system is based on the 32 mm system. So to do things efficiently its best to stick with the metric.
I dont know squat about the metric system so I I got a metric converter app for my Iphone and it makes it alot easier figuring things out.
The more I use it the more it makes sense.

 

[fastbike]

Ply in the US is metric (18mm for 3/4, 12 mm for 1/2). Has been for a long time.

Frankly though, it's typically American, and perhaps our least endearing quality, to think that the world should change to fit our standards / methods / etc. The imperial system is long overdue for replacement in the practical arena as it has been in many scientific and engineering fields.

If America could send us ply to conform to our metric system we might return the favour, until then your stuck with mm

 

[green fever]

my thoughts as someone who has worked through metric and imperial i have had to revert and convert back and forth as i trained with men who used only imperial measurements try doing that 8 hours a day week in week out , getting back on topic i would use the extensions , on a lighter note how many uk members still buy fuel in gallons without thinking litres at the pump ? .

 

[Paul G]

I just used Toms method for ripping some cabinet door stock. To easy.

Thanks for the feedback

As for the metric imperial controversy, the system is based on the 32 mm system. So to do things efficiently its best to stick with the metric.
I dont know squat about the metric system so I I got a metric converter app for my Iphone and it makes it alot easier figuring things out.
The more I use it the more it makes sense.

What is the 32mm system and its relation to Festool?

 

[peter halle]

In an nutshell euro style cabinets (no face frames) are designed in dimensions that are multiples of 32 mm.  If the cabinets and components are "balanced" (in even multiples of 32) then the construction is simplified and yields are maximized.  For instance, a cabinet door that is balanced can be used as a left or a right which means that there is only one setup of cutters or drills versus two.  It has also allowed in manufacturing for vendors to obtain different components from different suppliers to reduce cost.  Ikea is a good example.  Their cabinets may have parts from many different sources all meshed together.

With the markings on the tools in mm it can make it easier to construct within the parameters of the 32 mm system.  That is what I think Sancho was trying to say.

Now Festool does have the drilling system that is very much based on the 32 mm system.  And of course the MFT's have their holes drilled at 96 mm on center - a multiple of 32.

Peter

 

[Paul G]

In an nutshell euro style cabinets (no face frames) are designed in dimensions that are multiples of 32 mm.  If the cabinets and components are "balanced" (in even multiples of 32) then the construction is simplified and yields are maximized.  For instance, a cabinet door that is balanced can be used as a left or a right which means that there is only one setup of cutters or drills versus two.  It has also allowed in manufacturing for vendors to obtain different components from different suppliers to reduce cost.  Ikea is a good example.  Their cabinets may have parts from many different sources all meshed together.

With the markings on the tools in mm it can make it easier to construct within the parameters of the 32 mm system.  That is what I think Sancho was trying to say.

Now Festool does have the drilling system that is very much based on the 32 mm system.  And of course the MFT's have their holes drilled at 96 mm on center - a multiple of 32.

Peter

Thanks for the educational post, I've got some more reading to do I see. If a Festool cabinet class came up in Vegas and I hit the reg button faster than a wack-a-mole I might get a hands on emersion.

 

[Eli]

Does Festool know we use inches in the US? [/sarcasm]

They'd sell more stuff if they honored our system here in the US. Converting metric all the time is about as fun as a colonoscopy. I've had this issue with EU manufacturers in other industries, those who adapt to the US do better.

You should give the metric system two weeks. That's about how long it took me to get used to it, after a lifetime of imperial. It was the easiest thing I ever did, that yielded the best performance increase. After thirty years of adding fractions, it was a relief to have a system that added so much speed to calculations. It frees the mind for so many other things.

 

[sancho57]

If by "typically American" you mean free thinking having the ability to use whatever type of measuring system metric or imperial we want cuz were free o do so.

Yup thats us

 

[Paul G]

If by "typically American" you mean free thinking having the ability to use whatever type of measuring system metric or imperial we want cuz were free o do so.

Yup thats us

LOL, I had a less nice way of putting it but wanted to avoid the political undertones. For me the inch vs metric pissing contest was never the point, rather it is about consumer choice, perhaps that is not fully appreciated everywhere, I know I value it a great deal.

For all those insisting I try metric or learn it, believe me, I know metric, it's not hard to figure out, it's the constant conversions that are a PITA. As a car guy in the US I've got two sets of garage tools as a result of our quasi US changeover and multinational manufacturing. Other than that metric is not common here, football is a 100 yard field (not referring to soccer), the drag strip is a quarter mile, eighth mile or 1000ft, gas is sold by the gallon and fuel efficiency is labeled in miles per gallon. The speed limit sign is in miles per hour, if I got pulled over by the highway patrol and told the officer I was only going 100kph he'd probably write me the ticket just for being a wiseguy. Hardware is all marked in inches as is most wood and other building products such as pipe. Building codes here are all in inches or feet. Office paper is 8.5x11 inches. If I told my neighbor I'm adding a 914mm retaining wall he'd wonder what was actually in my drink until I told him it was 3 ft. The list goes on. This is the community in which I live, it's not about what is better, it is just that our language of measures is Empirical. If everyone magically flipped a switch and all went to metric tomorrow I'd soon adapt, but my nation talks Empirical and to get along so must I.

 

[Eli]

I'm not suggesting you keep converting back and forth, that does sound like a PITA. A contest of which is better is not the point, agreed. The woodworking tools you like to use are metric. Complaining that they are not imperial is less productive than using metric to woodwork, despite your preference. That was my point. It was a suggestion, I don't really care whether you do or not  [big grin]. All the other speeding ticket football retaining wall gallon 'o gas things have no relevance IMO. This online community (and the planet outside the US) uses metric, because that is how Festool make the tools. As previously mentioned, we very often use Imperial measurement for reference in Australia. But measuring anything in two systems at the same time is twice the work.

 

[Paul G]

I'm not suggesting you keep converting back and forth, that does sound like a PITA. A contest of which is better is not the point, agreed. The woodworking tools you like to use are metric. Complaining that they are not imperial is less productive than using metric to woodwork, despite your preference. That was my point. It was a suggestion, I don't really care whether you do or not  [big grin]. All the other speeding ticket football retaining wall gallon 'o gas things have no relevance IMO. This online community (and the planet outside the US) uses metric, because that is how Festool make the tools. As previously mentioned, we very often use Imperial measurement for reference in Australia. But measuring anything in two systems at the same time is twice the work.

Can you show me where it says this online community is metric? There's another thread offering empirical overlays to many earlier TS 55 owners that suggests I'm far from alone in wanting the choice. My TS 55 REQ came with an inch overlay from Festool, I applied it so my Festool is in inches. Perhaps Festool is seeing the light by making this available, problem is it's not available on the accessories for TS 55 REQ, hopefully that will change also, they will probably sell more product in the USA because of it. I chose the Seneca parallel guides in large part because I can get the incra in inches, and will be using a jig instead of the extensions for my thin cuts (the original topic of this thread). A lost accessory sale for Festool. The marketplace is the ultimate judge in these matters.

 

[Kev]

Why can't I have my Festools calibrated in cubits ?? After all, who says this is simply a metric or imperial forum eh?

Festools are made in a metric embracing country.

One day the greater part of the US will see the benefits of the metric system, but it may be after a few generations. The metric system is simply faster, easier, smarter.