Little test - CNC Knee Mill/Router vs kaizen foam

[Scorpion]

What about using a drag knife on the cnc to first cut the outline , the cnc out the interior?

Thought about that.  I think it would if you could get the tool offset right.  May do weird things because the thickness of the blade is zero but the arc of a cut would be the arc of the drag...thingy.  Might try it, I have an exacto I could put in a collet.

 

[fritter63]

What about using a drag knife on the cnc to first cut the outline , the cnc out the interior?

Thought about that.  I think it would if you could get the tool offset right.  May do weird things because the thickness of the blade is zero but the arc of a cut would be the arc of the drag...thingy.  Might try it, I have an exacto I could put in a collet.

Does that exacto have a swivel head on it? Make sure you DON'T turn the router/spindle on!

 

[Scorpion]

What about using a drag knife on the cnc to first cut the outline , the cnc out the interior?

Thought about that.  I think it would if you could get the tool offset right.  May do weird things because the thickness of the blade is zero but the arc of a cut would be the arc of the drag...thingy.  Might try it, I have an exacto I could put in a collet.

Does that exacto have a swivel head on it? Make sure you DON'T turn the router/spindle on!

Well even if I did, it would only end up being for a second!

That's a cool video.  Is the yours?

 

[fritter63]

Nope, just what I'm using as a basis for mine.

 

[rmwarren]

This thread initiated a serious bout of ADD, the TT foam router bits are ordered and it looks like EVA foam is the stuff used for floor mat tiles:
http://www.amazon.com/BalanceFrom-P...ss&ie=UTF8&qid=1454613070&sr=1-1&keywords=eva+foam

Opens up interesting possibilities of laminating up multiple colors to come up with your own version of the LV black/yellow look.  Lots of options in 1/2" thick for < $1/PSF.

This is fun.

RMW

Richard, which mill dos you end up ordering?

The mats are made out of that foam but I've noticed that most have a texture on them which would make lamination interesting.  If you find flat ones, let me know.  Not sure they're actually cheaper than ordering a roll of the stuff from a supplier but maybe.

[member=27782]Scorpion[/member] - I ordered from TT - they have a page dedicated to CNC/foam bits:
http://www.toolstoday.com/c-527-foam-cutting-cnc-router-bits.aspx

I grabbed an Amana 46274 & 46270 to test them out - 1/4 & 1/8" with 1-1/4" flutes. Last weekend I added the Shapeko 3 to the fleet, this weekend I hope to make some chips with it and those bits should show up today. TT is often next-day delivery for me if I order early, highly recommend them. The SO3 has limited Z travel, I don't think I can mill anything deeper than around 2".

I was thinking the same thing on laminating those mats, it is probably best to buy the right stuff from the foam guys. I am going to check the next time I hit HD/Lowes/BJ's just to see if they have any non-textured mat tiles. In the meantime I have some kaizen I am going to test this on, and I might grab a couple SF of really dense foam off Amazon just because it takes one-click and show up at my door.

BTW - I spent some time cruising thru one of you threads on the Garage Journal board last year, love what you did organizing your toolboxes.

RMW

 

[rvieceli]

Richard - Not to be a buzz kill  [eek] but aren't you supposed to finishing up the inside of your shed [poke] [thumbs up]

Ron

 

[rmwarren]

Richard - Not to be a buzz kill  [eek] but aren't you supposed to finishing up the inside of your shed [poke] [thumbs up]

Ron

Ron, you recall the whole ADD thing... "Hey, look..., something shiny!".

Admittedly I have the attention span of a 2 month old golden retriever.

RMW

 

[rst]

Squirrel  [tongue]

 

[rmwarren]

Richard - Not to be a buzz kill  [eek] but aren't you supposed to finishing up the inside of your shed [poke] [thumbs up]

Ron

AND, now you sound suspiciously like you are channeling Mrs. RMW...

However, since the boss in in FL for the month, I can get away with some aimlessness.

RMW

 

[Scorpion]

Don't know if this helps but here are a few shots of my drilling kit:

Two layers

The stuff is very dense like a camping mat.

Cheers. Bryan.

Bryan,  can you post a picture of the goal about this close?

 

[bkharman]

Sure thing scorpion. In my setup, the yellow is most of the form.

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[Scorpion]

Do I have an update for you guys!  Cascade Tool & Foam got the samples too mu door in only a few days.  They were nice enough to send samples of each of the three types of foam they sell, in all of the colors, and in both of the thicknesses. 

Before I get into the differ t types, I'll lead in with - Kaizen isn't my go-forward material for organization.  All of the samples will finish better and are both chemical (including aviation fuel) resistant, can be laminated with heat, and appear to be highly machinable.

Here's a neat way to send a sample - this is the 4lb XPE Value Line that appears to be laser cut, 1/2-inch blue on 1/4-inch yellow. 

This is the 4lb XPE-FR Value Plus material.  This stuff is fire retardant.

And the best I could do for sharing the colors it's available in.

Below, red is 4lb XPE Value Line and yellow is the 4lb XPE-FR Value Plus

6lb closed cell PE which is the only that's designed for around sensitive electronics.

6lb closed cell PE.

Below are the two 6lb's together l.  Notice that the 6lb 1/2-inch sheets are really laminated 1/4's.

As opposed to the 4lb's being true 1/2 (blue is value line, black is ValuePlus

Other observations only by visual inspection

6lb versions have the most shiny surface, almost look plasticy with larger cell and apparent voids internally (small of course but you can see them)

4lb value plus is second in the shiny category with small cell.  No obvious voids.

4lb value line has what appears to be the tightest/smallest cell structure, no voids, least shiny, and has the most consistent structure as well.  This is the sample with the tools cut in it...and it looks really good.

Here's they're current price list:

If I get a minute to play tomorrow, I'll make some sample cuts on the mill to see what an up cutting bit does to it.  I'm already guessing it will cut well. 

 

[Scorpion]

Sure thing scorpion. In my setup, the yellow is most of the form.

Cheers. Bryan.

Thank you very much Bryan.  That looks very much like the 4lb Value Line.  Well, I think the 4lb value line is what I believe to be the foam I'm going to try for systainer organizers...assuming it cuts.

This very much feels like progress.

 

[bkharman]

Keep me posted. This foam is very dense and feels great. Velvety smooth as you run your hands on it. Here is an extreme closeup (now I have sound bites from Wayne's World ringing in my head!!)

I would be very interested in "hiring" you for a project where I want nice clean foam setups. If you have luck and would be interested, let me know via PM.

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[Scorpion]

BTW - I spent some time cruising thru one of you threads on the Garage Journal board last year, love what you did organizing your toolboxes.

RMW

And thank you.  I've become fairly OCD about the organization of my boxes and, though I really like some of my organizers, the time it takes to machine them out of plastic is excessive and expensive.  This look at foam would allow me to organize my sustainers and finish my drawers with less effort (or make more progress with the same effort).  I appreciate the collaboration on this.

 

[Scorpion]

If we put the two together (my sample, then Veritas)

 

[Scorpion]

Keep me posted. This foam is very dense and feels great. Velvety smooth as you run your hands on it. Here is an extreme closeup (now I have sound bites from Wayne's World ringing in my head!!)

I would be very interested in "hiring" you for a project where I want nice clean foam setups. If you have luck and would be interested, let me know via PM.

Cheers. Bryan.

The stuff I'm holding isn't smooth, it's more stiff and mildly abrasive...as much so as foam can be.  Seeming now like it's not the same stuff. 

Cutting stuff for hire - I'm interested as soon as I can get a few issues on my mill worked out.  First - I currently program using a conversational language directly at the control instead of importing a CAD file because my OS needs to be upgraded.  Everything I do I program.  I've gotten good but it's time consuming.  Unfortunately to upgrade I need to prepare some controller boards so it's gonna cost me to make the switch.  I was thinking about doing it this spring.  Second - I'd like to figure out how to get tool profiles into the machine using a more advanced strategy like we've discussed in the thread.  It would make tool shadowing much easier, faster, and more accurate. 

With all of this foam stuff getting discusses I'm encouraged to start thinking about resolving my issues.  Just asking is a compliment and additional encouragement, thank you.

 

[Cheese]

[member=27782]Scorpion[/member]
FWIW...it appears that the 4lb XPE-FR Value Plus is almost identical to the Lee Valley foam that Bryan has. At least the side view of the 2 materials looks identical.

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

 

[rmwarren]

Richard - Not to be a buzz kill  [eek] but aren't you supposed to finishing up the inside of your shed [poke] [thumbs up]

Ron

AND, now you sound suspiciously like you are channeling Mrs. RMW...

However, since the boss in in FL for the month, I can get away with some aimlessness.

RMW

[member=3192]rvieceli[/member] your gentle reminder got me going on this again:
http://festoolownersgroup.com/works...-based-shops/small-shopmodular-work-surfaces-(aka-how-to-cram-10-in-a-5-sack-)/msg441942/#msg441942

Thanks!

RMW

 

[Scorpion]

So a little update here.  I got to playing with the foam samples in an attempt to see which would be the best machining candidate.  The idea is to laminate two color samples of each of the sample types together and machine them using a few different types of end mills.  My hope is that one of the sample types being cut with one of the types of end mills, will result in a clean cut.

I happened to have samples of each of the three in black (1/2-inch) and red (1/4-inch).  To laminate you hold up part of the material and heat between with a heat gun.

Little bubbles start to form.  On the high setting, it took seconds.  When the surface has consistent bubbles (they're small), close and apply pressure.

After only a couldn't to ten, the two cool completely bonded.

Next, to the mill.  I repeated the below process on all three samples.  All are cut to the depth of 1/2-inch which is deep enough to cut firmly into the black 1/2-inch bottom material.  Depth of cut was conservative @ 1/4-inch, 50% overlap.  Three different profile windmills - 3/8-inch 2 flute ball mill, 1/4-inch 2 flute up cutting end mill, and 3/16-inch 2 flute end mill.


The results are consistent.  The 2-flute ball mill performed better than the two 2-flute end mills.  I think this is because the ball profile doesn't push the material out of the way as much as the other two.

The ball mill really didn't leave much fringe on the surface of any pieces of the material and the other two weren't very clean/good.  I'm not happy with any of them.  Looks like I need to get a foam cutting one and see how it does.